PRETEND

Jack Saltarelli is a bounty hunter who also happens to be a former fugitive. In part one of the Bounty Hunter, a judge sentenced Jack to 20 years in prison for a drug offense. After failing to appeal the judge’s decision, Jack decided he wasn’t going back to prison.Instead, Jack Saltarelli moved to Pennsylvania and started cooking meth in a mountainside cabin. When he wasn't cooking meth, Jack was hiding in plain sight on national television. He was volunteering as a search and rescue crew members looking for victims of the Atlanta Monster, serial killer Wayne Williams.This is a wild story, so I don't want to spoil it for you. Hear how the FBI finally caught up to him.Special thanks to former agent Jerri Williams with the FBI Retired Case File Review podcast for introducing me to Jack. I would also like to thank former FBI agent Judy Tyler and Jack Saltarelli for sharing their stories.Jack Saltarelli with agent Judy Tyler and the FBI[/caption]-------Story idea? If you have a story to share, email Javier a voice memo or short written description at info@pretendradio.org.For more episodes like this visit pretendradio.org.To get early releases and bonus episodes go to pretendradio.org/donateCreditsPretend is produced by Javier LeivaTheme music by The ChickenAdditional music by Blue Dot SessionsPromos this week for A Date with Dateline Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Jack Saltarelli is a bounty hunter. His job is to hunt down fugitives. Any given day, he’s going after rapist, murderers, and people who skip court. Most bounty hunters carry lethal weapons, but not Jack. He goes door-to-door carrying a stun gun and a training revolver that fires rubber bullets. You may be asking yourself what’s the difference between a cop and a bounty hunter? First, bounty hunters have more authority than local police. Cops have jurisdictions, and they need warrants in order to enter your home. Bounty hunters, on the other hand, can hunt you down anywhere, and they can even barge into your homes if they have to.How can they get away with this? Simple. Let’s say you get arrested and sign a bail bond contract to get out of jail. The moment you sign that contract, you’re waiving your constitutional rights.I met up with Jack at his bail bonds office in Gulfport, Mississippi. Let’s just say that Jack isn’t your ordinary bounty hunter. His story is much more complicated than that. Find out the secret Jack Saltarelli has been hiding for more than 30 years.Part 2 is available right now for my Patreon supporters.Retired FBI Agent Jerri WilliamsYou know, people always ask me, “Javier, where do you find these stories?” The answer is all sorts of places. But not this one. I learned about this story from my podcast from my friend Jerri Williams. Jerri is a retired FBI agent who has a podcast called FBI Retired Casefile Review. You may remember Jerri from the episode with the telemarketing con artist named Carl. If you haven’t check out FBI Retired Casefile Review, do yourself a favor and subscribe. Jerri is on every week featuring real former FBI agents describing their case. She is the real deal. You can listen to Jerri's interview with Jack Saltarelli and retired FBI agent Judy Tyler here.Also, you should check out her new book, it’s called FBI Myths and Misconceptions: A Manual for Armchair Detectives. Jerri debunks clichés and misconceptions about the FBI in books, TV, and movies.And thank you to you for helping me fund this story. If it weren’t for my Patreon supporters, I couldn’t be able to support the flight down to Gulf Port, MS, or the rental car and hotel. Seriously, this story was great because I was able to be there with Jack. If you want to hear more stories like this, please consider donating one dollar to the show. It really goes a long way.-------Story idea? If you have a story to share, email Javier a voice memo or short written description at info@pretendradio.org.For more episodes like this visit pretendradio.org.To get early releases and bonus episodes go to pretendradio.org/donateCreditsPretend is produced by Javier LeivaTheme music by The ChickenAdditional music by Blue Dot SessionsPromos this week for Beyond the Obituary and Spy Stories Podcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Every night, Marie Walsh had the same nightmare.If only she could roll over and tell her husband the truth. But she can’t. Tonight, she’s going to have to suffer alone.Marie says, "I had a dream where they were chasing me and chasing me." But one night, Marie's nightmare was different."I finally got away. I was finally free, and they wouldn't be able to catch me. And I woke up feeling really happy. After all those years of being a nightmare, I'd finally gotten away."But what was Marie running from? After all, she was just a middle-aged suburban mom who lived an unremarkable life."I was a middle-aged mother of three in a suburb of San Diego, California. I was a soccer mom. That's kind of what I did."Every day revolved around her kids. "It was not that glamorous or exciting."It was just this very average life. An average life that she’s worked so hard to keep. But one night, her recurring nightmare returned. Except for this time she was wide awake.Find out the secret that kept Marie running for more than 30 years.After the episode, make sure to read the book: A Tale Of Two Lives: The Susan LeFevre Fugitive Story_______________Lies, lies, and more liesA few seasons ago, I asked you to submit stories about lies. Either lies that you’ve told or lies that have impacted you personally. And boy, was the response crazy! I ended up making a whole episode dedicated to lies. I want to try it again. Email me a voice memo. Chances are your story could make it on the show.-------Story idea? If you have a story to share, email Javier a voice memo or short written description at info@pretendradio.org.For more episodes like this visit pretendradio.org.To get early releases and bonus episodes go to pretendradio.org/donate Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Peter Pan syndrome is when someone refuses to grow up. It’s neither a disease nor a recognized mental disorder—it’s just a state of mind. Today, you're going to meet a man who became a fugitive in order to live in his very own Neverland.Larry Douglas Jones is not your typical fugitive. He had a wife and three kids. And to be honest, he's not a dangerous man. He became overwhelmed with life and decided to run away.This is the first in a series of stories about fugitives running from the law. This season, we’ll explore how abandoning your old identity leads to a whole set of complications. How do these criminals assume a new identity? What strategies do they use to avoid getting caught?_______________This episode was 100% funded by you. I was able to travel to Gulfport, MS for this story using funds raised on Patreon. So if you’d like to see me to take the show on the road, consider chipping in a buck or two on our Patreon page. Plus, you’ll get access to early episodes and bonus content. So, thank you so much for the support._______________Lies, lies, and more liesA few seasons ago, I asked you to submit stories about lies. Either lies that you’ve told or lies that have impacted you personally. And boy, was the response crazy! I ended up making a whole episode dedicated to lies. I want to try it again. Email me a voice memo. Chances are your story could make it on the show.-------Story idea? If you have a story to share, email Javier a voice memo or short written description at info@pretendradio.org.For more episodes like this visit pretendradio.org.To get early releases and bonus episodes go to pretendradio.org/donate Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Arthur Shawcross is one of America's most notorious serial killers. This is the story about one of his closest friends. Who do you turn to when your deepest fantasies involve murder and cannibalism? It's an affliction most people can't relate to—unless you're a serial killer. For John Paul Fay, that confidant was a killer named Arthur Shawcross. In a series of letters, Fay confesses to Shawcross his desire to kill, yet he never crosses that line.My friend John Taylor interviewed John Paul Fay and asked him, what keeps him from acting on his disturbing urges. This episode is frightening. If you enjoyed it as much as I did, please check out the Twisted Podcast. You won't be disappointed.The episode you're about to listen to is borrowed from the Twisted Podcast with John Taylor. You can read John Paul Fay's book titled the Shawcross Letters: My Journey Into The Mind Of Evil.*Warning this episode contains extremely graphic material including descriptions of murder and cannibalism.Listen to my full conversation with John Taylor on my Patreon feed.Alison Sweeney joins us to talk about the Shawcross Letters and her new project “Chronicle Mysteries” on Hallmark Movie and Mysteries.The host of a true crime podcast embarks on her latest project, and uncovers a decades-old murder while investigating a mysterious disappearance, in “Chronicle Mysteries: Recovered,” a new original premiering Sunday, February 17, (9 p.m. ET/PT) on Hallmark Movies & Mysteries. Alison Sweeney (“Days of Our Lives,” “The Biggest Loser”) executive produces and stars, along with Benjamin Ayres (“Saving Hope”).The Chronicle Mysteries: Recovered premieres Sunday, February 17 at 9pm/8cThe Chronicle Mysteries: The Wrong Man premieres Sunday, February 24 at 9pm/8cThe Chronicle Mysteries: Vines that Bind premieres Sunday, March 3 at 9pm/8c Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Abby Ellin didn't know it yet, but the man she was about to marry was a compulsive liar living a double life. She was duped—hard.In this bonus episode, we talk about her story and why she's now obsessed with con artists.Abby Ellin is a New York Times contributor and author of Duped: Double Lives, False Identities and the Conman I Almost Married. ____________Stick around to the end of the episode to listen to a preview of Pretend season 4.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Let’s say a man speaks to another man. Perhaps he looks at him for too long or laughs at his joke. That’s gay. Maybe you’re standing too close. It doesn’t matter. If I’m a Word of Faith fellowship member and I think you’re gay—then you’re gay. I don’t have to prove it–I know it. And I can’t let you suffer from those gay demons. I have to pray for you to release the gay spirits out of you. And the way we pray at the Word of Faith Fellowship is through loud prayers. And it’s not only me praying over you—Sussie, Bobby, and Roger will join in. Soon, you’ll have 20 to 30 people screaming at you. And like Jane says, “people can get carried away.” So, it’s easy to imagine this prayer becoming more than a loud scream. I might hold on to your shoulders and give you a gentle tug. Then, I might punch you in the chest. Maybe my hands creep further up, and before I realize it, I’m wrapping my fingers around your neck. This hypothetical scenario I painted for you is exactly what Matthew Fenner says happened to him.Release the gay demonsTonight, it’s Matthew Fenner’s turn to receive an exorcism. Church ministers are praying over him. They’re trying to release the devil’s grip over his homosexual desires. Danielle Cordes was there the night. She says Brooke Covington, Jane’s so-called adopted daughter, was the one calling the shots. People who know Brooke’s style of worship say that she doesn’t have time to deal with your devils. So when it’s time to pray over you, it’s going to hurt. Brooke barks at Danielle and demands her to join in. “Brooke was the one coaching them through it,” explained Danielle. She says she too participated in the prayer. “I never slapped him or did any of that. I had my arm on him, but if I had like, I don’t know, I couldn’t do it. I just couldn’t do it.” The case against Brooke Covington and the Word of Faith FellowshipThe night after the alleged attack, Matthew Fenner escaped the Word of Faith Fellowship. He went straight to the police and filed a report. Unfortunately for him, the authorities were only willing to file misdemeanor charges. It will take years for actual criminal charges to be filed. To give you an idea, this beating allegedly took place in January 2013. Matthew was 19 at the time. He’s 25 years old now. That’s almost 5 years and there’s still no resolution to this case. What happens next?This is the final installment of season 3 The Prophet. This might be the last episode of this series, but the story is far from over. To keep up with this story, follow John Huddle’s blog religiouscultinfo.com andCitizens against corruption and abuse on Facebook. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Jane Whaley recently turned 80-years-old. Obviously, the Word of Faith Fellowship can’t go on forever. At least not the way we know of it today. So, who’s taking over? Can it go on without Jane Whaley’s vision and authority? Or will it all just fall apart?John Huddle, a former member, says that Jane’s biological daughter Robin Webster is believed to take over the church. But he suspects that, when Jane Whaley dies, there will be a power struggle within the church.The case against the Word of Faith FellowshipWe’ll talk more about this alleged attack in the next episode. Today, we’re going to focus on how we got to this point. Before Brooke Covington was charged with kidnapping and beating Matthew Fenner, she was actually the person who recruited him into the church. How did she go from being his spiritual leader, to being charged with beating him? In order to understand the case against Brooke Covington and the Word of Faith Fellowship ministries, you first understand how Matthew Fenner joined the church.Cults recruit the vulnerableThe biggest questions I get all the time is, how do people get sucked into a cult. Everyone says that they would never fall for it, so how did Matthew and his family become one of them? Before Matthew Fenner joined the Word of Faith Fellowship, he thought they were freaks. He heard rumors of the demonic possessions and members vomiting in buckets to evil spirits. Let’s just say that he wasn’t exactly a perfect candidate. And on top of that, Matthew was openly gay and considered himself an atheist. So, how does someone like him get sucked into a ultra conservative Christian cult?The Word of Faith Fellowship found Matthew Fenner, and his family, when there were at their lowest point. Matthew’s family rejected his sexuality, his mother was in a bad marriage, and they were running out of money. These were desperate times.Matthew attended his first service in February 2010. During this time he had friends, was a member of a dance troupe, and attended public school. By December of that same year, he cut ties with everyone he knew, quit dance, and enrolled in the church’s private school. How did it happen? How can someone go from gay atheist to a god-fearing cult member?Matthew Fenner describes his journey into the Word of Faith Fellowship. Listen to episode 10 of the Prophet on Apple podcast, Google Play, Spotify, or Stitcher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Christina Bryant is about to go face-to-face with the real Jane Whaley. In my previous episode, I got to see the political side of Jane—the Jane she wanted the world to meet. Christina, on the other hand, is about to talk with the real Jane Whaley—the one everyone fears. And she got it all on tape.Christina Bryant went undercover inside the Word of Faith Fellowship. She’s wearing a hidden microphone. It’s been 6 years since she last step foot in the church. You see, Christina is a former member who has been excommunicated and is forbidden to contact her family. If she ever wants to ever speak with them again, she has to go through Jane Whaley first.This 3-hour recording is completely engrossing. However, there are certain parts of this tape that brings up interesting legal questions regarding child abuse. Jane flat out says she’s not required by law to report sexual abuse because of pastor confidentiality. Is this true? How can this be true? Jane also claims if a child has bruising, the NC Department of Social Services doesn’t consider that abuse.Reporting Child Abuse and Neglect in North CarolinaI reached out to my friend Rabia Chaudry from the Undisclosed Podcast for help. She put me in touch with her co-host Colin Miller, to walk me through what Jane says and how it applies to North Carolina law. I have to say, I’m shocked.I also spoke with NC licensed attorney Paul Ditz. He’s one of the few attorney’s to have ever questioned Jane Whaley on the stand. He tells me that just because DSS allows minor bruising and Jane is protected by penitent privilege, doesn’t mean that she’s not responsible.Take a deep breath because you’re about to go inside the mind of Jane Whaley. Sources:NC Article 7 – Competency of WitnessesReporting Child Abuse and Neglect in North CarolinaParental Discipline: When Is It Abuse and/or a Crime?A&E Documentary on the Word of Faith Fellowship titled “The Devil Next Door” postponed Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The world first learned about the Word of Faith Fellowship after an Inside Edition exposé in 1995. The investigation, led by the Trinity Foundation, revealed accusations of abuse within the church. Watch the Inside Edition story: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwE5fBT9RYEJane Whaley's quiet little kingdom was suddenly in the spotlight. Hidden cameras captured Jane's signature screaming prayer. Church members told Inside Edition that they would strap children to chairs so they wouldn't run away. It was horrifying. After a brief press conference, Jane Whaley never spoke to the media on the record ever again. So why did she pick me as her first interview since 1995?I asked Jane, "Why me?" She told me that God spoke to her after listening to my show. But why now? Jane says she wanted to contact me but said that she didn’t know how to reach me.During my visit, Sam Whaley told me that the closest they’ve come to talking to the media was when a BBC producer approached her about doing a story. She said he was very nice, just like me. But in the end, they decided it wasn’t right. Then, an A&E documentary crew asked to interview Jane and bring cameras into the church. Jane flat out said no because they weren’t interested in the truth. Her lawyers told me that the TV crew and former members showed up unannounced to church member owned businesses and caused a spectacle. My interview with cult leader Jane Whaley of the Word of Faith FellowshipAfter the 3-hour service was over, Jane and I walked back to her office. Jane Whaley sat next to me. To my left sat her husband Sam Whaley. And across the room sat her two attorneys Mark Norris and Josh Farmer. Without ever even asking a question, Jane began to tell me about every controversial issue facing the church. She told me that she knows nothing about unemployment (Jane's referring to the recent the guilty pleas in the unemployment fraud cases.) When I asked her about the Brazilian slaves, she told me that some of the Brazilian's making these claims are entitled and lazy. During the meeting, Jane performed a blasting prayer for me. She also told me that she's gearing for a great confrontation and that they're ready for the end of times.National Domestic Violence HotlineI also want to take the time to thank the former members who have listened to the show and have written me emails, facebook messages about their experience at the Word of Faith Fellowship. It just reinforces that what I’m doing is important. Also, I know there are current members reading this right now. If you feel you’re in danger or just need someone to talk to, call the National Domestic Violence Hotline1-800-799-7233. They’re available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. They can help you find a place to stay near Spindale while you figure things out. Or you can contact the Citizens against corruption and abuse828-289-7923. at area code PromosSouthern GothicMinds of Madness  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices