Catalyst with Shayle Kann

This week we’re bringing you a special crossover episode from With Great Power. It’s a show about one of the most complex machines ever built – the power grid. It’s a machine that’s changing faster than ever. With Great Power is about the people driving that change:A third of the world's largest companies now have net-zero targets in place for carbon emissions. Google was ahead of the curve. Back in 2007, it had already achieved its goal of going carbon neutral across all of its offices and data centers around the globe.But as demand for Google's services expanded, it knew that it had to overhaul its energy goals. At the time, Raiford Smith served as Google's global head of energy and location strategy. And part of his job was jump-starting this massive effort.In 2021, Google launched one of the most ambitious corporate energy strategies ever. And Raiford and his team made it possible.After a career spanning more than 30 years at utilities like Duke Energy, CPS, Entergy, and Southern company, and two years at Google, Raiford knows firsthand that change is possible at power companies.This week, Brad talked with Raiford, now the chief innovation officer at AES, about what's needed to spur tech innovation at utilities, and the technologies that will be integral to the energy transition.This podcast is produced by GridX. GridX is the Enterprise Rate Platform that modern utilities rely on to usher in our clean energy future.Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Catalyst is supported by Antenna Group. For 25 years, Antenna has partnered with leading clean-economy innovators to build their brands and accelerate business growth. If you're a startup, investor, enterprise, or innovation ecosystem that's creating positive change, Antenna is ready to power your impact. Visit antennagroup.com to learn more.Catalyst is supported by RE+. RE+ is more than just the largest clean energy event, it’s a catalyst for industry innovation designed to supercharge business growth in the clean energy economy. Learn more: re-plus.com. 

The good news: The Clarion-Clipperton Zone (CCZ) contains more nickel and cobalt than the rest of the world’s land-based reserves combined. It also has significant resources of high-grade lithium, copper and rare earth metals—all of which are critical for the batteries the world needs to meet Paris Agreement targets.The bad news: The CCZ lies at the bottom of the Pacific Ocean and contains biodiverse ecosystems we know very little about—and that we could profoundly harm if we mine them.The CCZ lies between Hawaii and Mexico and is about half the size of the continental United States. And it’s just one of many potential deep-sea sources of critical minerals.So should we mine the deep sea to fight climate change? And if we do, how do we also protect seafloor ecosystems?In this episode, Shayle talks to Renee Grogan, an expert in deep-sea mining. She is a co-founder and board director at Impossible Metals. Together they cover topics like: The different types of seafloor resources, including polymetallic nodules, cobalt ferro-manganese crusts, and massive sulfides Better understanding seafloor ecosystems and incorporating science into mining practices and regulations, including selective harvesting, protected areas, and offsets The challenges of enforcing regulations three to five kilometers below the surface Ongoing negotiations at the International Seabed Authority, which was planning to finalize regulations for deep-sea mining last week, but announced that it needed more time. Recommended Resources: NYT: Pacific Seabed Mining Delayed as International Agency Finalizes Rules Forbes: Deep Sea Mining: The Biggest Climate Issue You’ve Never Heard Of British Geological Survey: Deep-sea mining evidence review – MineralsUK Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Catalyst is supported by Antenna Group. For 25 years, Antenna has partnered with leading clean-economy innovators to build their brands and accelerate business growth. If you're a startup, investor, enterprise, or innovation ecosystem that's creating positive change, Antenna is ready to power your impact. Visit antennagroup.com to learn more.Catalyst is supported by RE+. RE+ is more than just the largest clean energy event, it’s a catalyst for industry innovation designed to supercharge business growth in the clean energy economy. Learn more: re-plus.com.

Carbon capture and storage. It’s a controversial tool in the energy transition that we don’t want to use, but probably have to. Most of the scenarios in the IPCC’s Sixth Assessment Report include capturing and storing hundreds of gigatons of carbon dioxide between now and 2100. When people say carbon capture and storage, or CCS, they often mean different things. It’s a term that covers multiple technologies used to capture CO2—such as point-source and direct-air capture— and different approaches to using that CO2. With the CCS industry is in its infancy, tackling some big questions now could save us headaches down the road. Questions about CCS infrastructure use, where we’ll build it, and who will control it.In this episode, Shayle talks to Dr. Emily Grubert, associate professor of sustainable energy policy at the University of Notre Dame. She posted a Twitter thread recently about how the same CCS infrastructure actually has four different use cases: Avoiding emissions to extend the life of fossil-fuel infrastructure Avoiding emissions where we don’t have zero-carbon alternatives yet, like cement production Removing carbon to compensate for other emissions, i.e. offsets Removing carbon to draw down legacy emissions and avoid overshooting 1.5 degrees Celsius targets They walk through each categories and cover topics like: Which categories to prioritize over others Avoiding the double-counting problem Where we should use CCS vs. zero-carbon alternatives The resource constraints on CCS, including water, land and energy Whether we have the luxury to prioritize when we need to deploy CCS so quickly Whether CCS customers or regulatory bodies should determine the type of CCS infrastructure we have and where we build it Recommended Resources: Catalyst: Carbon capture and storage is making a comeback Bloomberg: Big Money Rushes Into Carbon Capture. Can It Deliver This Time? US DOE: Strategic Vision: The Role of FECM in Achieving Net-Zero Greenhouse Gas Emissions Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Catalyst is supported by Antenna Group. For 25 years, Antenna has partnered with leading clean-economy innovators to build their brands and accelerate business growth. If you're a startup, investor, enterprise, or innovation ecosystem that's creating positive change, Antenna is ready to power your impact. Visit antennagroup.com to learn more.Catalyst is supported by RE+. RE+ is more than just the largest clean energy event, it’s a catalyst for industry innovation designed to supercharge business growth in the clean energy economy. Learn more: re-plus.com.

Before hydrogen makes it big, we have to overcome a massive, ocean-sized challenge: Transporting the fuel between continents. The places that will be best suited to produce hydrogen via renewables-powered electrolysis, like Australia and Egypt, will have to ship that hydrogen to demand centers in Japan, Europe, and elsewhere.And it turns out that shipping hydrogen is way harder than shipping oil or natural gas. Hydrogen has a very low volumetric energy density. Compared to one barrel of oil, the equivalent amount of gaseous hydrogen takes up way more space to transport.Fortunately, a range of technologies could solve this problem. Will one become the dominant means of transporting hydrogen across the oceans?In this episode, Shayle talks to Anne-Sophie Corbeau, a senior research scholar at Columbia University’s SIPA Center on Global Energy Policy. Anne-Sophie recently wrote about hydrogen transport for Cipher News. They cover the five leading contenders for transoceanic transport: Liquified hydrogen E-methane, also known as synthetic methane or carbon neutral gas Liquid organic hydrogen carriers(LOHCs) Methanol Ammonia They also discuss topics like: Why good old fashioned pipelines might be a viable option for transport, even between continents The challenges of converting natural gas infrastructure into hydrogen infrastructure Why hydrogen exporters might be better off producing products made with hydrogen, such as steel, rather than the hydrogen itself Recommended Resources: Cipher News: Global hydrogen trade may be just a pipe dream IRENA: Global Hydrogen Trade to Meet the 1.5°C Climate Goal: Technology Review of Hydrogen Carriers IEA: Global Hydrogen Review 2022 Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Catalyst is supported by Antenna Group. For 25 years, Antenna has partnered with leading clean-economy innovators to build their brands and accelerate business growth. If you're a startup, investor, enterprise, or innovation ecosystem that's creating positive change, Antenna is ready to power your impact. Visit antennagroup.com to learn more.Catalyst is supported by RE+. RE+ is more than just the largest clean energy event, it’s a catalyst for industry innovation designed to supercharge business growth in the clean energy economy. Learn more: re-plus.com.

More than a third of the world’s current greenhouse gas emissions from fossil fuels go through underground networks of fungi, according to a new peer-reviewed study in Current Biology.That’s a whopping 13 gigatons of carbon dioxide equivalents per year.Mycorrhizal fungi act as a symbiotic partner of plants, seeking out nutrients and bringing them back to the plants’ roots. In return, they accept carbon in the form of carbohydrates—which they then lock away in the structure of the fungi. This symbiotic relationship is nothing new to scientists; what’s surprising is the magnitude of carbon stored.But how permanent is this sink? And what can we do to support fungi as a nature-based climate solution?In this episode, Shayle talks to Dr. Heidi-Jayne Hawkins, lead author of the new paper and research director at Conservation South Africa. They cover topics like: The evolutionary history of mycorrhizal fungi  The mechanics of fungal carbon storage, which boosts carbon storage by 5-20% more than plants alone What we can do to support conditions for fungi to absorb carbon Open questions about the permanence of the storage Recommended Resources: Current Biology: Mycorrhizal mycelium as a global carbon poolCatalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Support for Catalyst comes from Climate Positive, a podcast by HASI, that features candid conversations with the leaders, innovators, and changemakers who are at the forefront of the transition to a sustainable economy. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.Catalyst is supported by Scale Microgrids, the distributed energy company dedicated to transforming the way modern energy infrastructure is designed, constructed, and financed. Distributed generation can be complex. Scale makes it easy. Learn more: scalemicrogrids.com.

Everything, everywhere, all at once—that’s the state of the U.S. solar industry right now.Suppliers are rushing to take advantage of the Inflation Reduction Act’s generous domestic-manufacturing incentives. Major manufacturers like First Solar and Enel have announced billion dollar investments in places like Tulsa, Oklahoma and Lawrence County, Alabama.But tariffs on the import of some Chinese-made parts may resume at the end of 2024; and the industry still faces supply chain shortages and permitting backlogs.Meanwhile, the stakes are high. To reach net zero carbon emissions by 2050, the U.S. needs to install 100 gigawatts of solar per year by 2030, according to a report from the REPEAT Project of Princeton’s ZERO Lab, up from about 30 gigawatts this year. Is that achievable in this chaotic environment? In this episode, Shayle talks about the state of the U.S. solar industry with Ethan Zindler, head of Americas at BloombergNEF. They cover topics like: Generous manufacturing incentives in the Inflation Reduction Act  Conditions to qualify for the incentives, such as meeting prevailing wages, building in “energy communities,” and sourcing domestic content The saga of solar tariffs Looming competition from manufacturers in Southeast Asia How supply chain bottlenecks have eased up Recommended Resources: Canary: Can the US manufacture enough solar panels to meet its surging demand? Canary: In Biden solar tariff compromise, installers win Princeton ZERO Lab’s REPEAT Project: Preliminary Report: The Climate and Energy Impacts of the Inflation Reduction Act of 2022 Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Support for Catalyst comes from Climate Positive, a podcast by HASI, that features candid conversations with the leaders, innovators, and changemakers who are at the forefront of the transition to a sustainable economy. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.Catalyst is supported by Scale Microgrids, the distributed energy company dedicated to transforming the way modern energy infrastructure is designed, constructed, and financed. Distributed generation can be complex. Scale makes it easy. Learn more: scalemicrogrids.com.

The list of potential uses for AI in climatetech is growing fast: developing better materials, optimizing solar farms, integrating renewables and microgrids. But many of these are still theoretical. We wanted to find a real-world application that changed the way we make climatetech.So we decided to come up with our own test run.Back in March Duncan Campbell, vice president at Scale Microgrids, used ChatGPT to code some battery dispatch software and tweeted about his experience. Duncan isn’t a professional software developer, but he still came up with some promising results. Could a non-coder like Duncan use AI to do the work of several climatetech coders?We invited Duncan to do it again and ramped up the challenge. We recruited Seyed Madaeni, CEO and co-founder of Verse to create a challenge for Duncan. Seyed is an expert in AI and the software used in electricity markets. He routinely sends “problem statements” to his team of software developers to create new software. This time, he sent a problem statement to Duncan that reflects real world conditions, one that we might actually assign to real engineers to solve.The challenge? Develop battery dispatch software using ChatGPT. In this episode, Duncan presents his results to Shayle and Seyed. They talk about things like: The different methods of optimizing battery dispatch, from old-school Excel sheets to more sophisticated software written by coders Seyed’s process of assigning a problem statement to his engineering team and the simplified version he sent to Duncan Duncan’s process of iteratively working with ChatGPT-4 to develop and debug the code  Why working with ChatGPT is like working with a bunch of really fast, but really inexperienced junior coders If you want to see the code that Duncan wrote with ChatGPT, click here.  Watch the conversation on YouTube.Recommended Resources: Carbon Copy Live: How AI could supercharge climatetech The Wall Street Journal: Why AI Is the Next Big Bet for Climate Tech Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Support for Catalyst comes from Climate Positive, a podcast by HASI, that features candid conversations with the leaders, innovators, and changemakers who are at the forefront of the transition to a sustainable economy. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.Catalyst is supported by Scale Microgrids, the distributed energy company dedicated to transforming the way modern energy infrastructure is designed, constructed, and financed. Distributed generation can be complex. Scale makes it easy. Learn more: scalemicrogrids.com.

Voluntary carbon credits are a lot like used cars; you really have no idea what their quality might be. Or maybe they’re more like expensive bottles of wine. Most people (or at least Shayle) can’t tell if they’re buying good quality wine. If it’s expensive, it must be good, right?That’s the logic that has plagued voluntary carbon markets for years. A carbon credit can work in two ways. First, it can avoid 1 metric ton of emissions that would have otherwise happened by, for example, preventing deforestation. Alternatively, a credit can directly remove a ton of carbon from the atmosphere through methods like direct air capture or biochar.But widespread reporting reveals that most credits don’t do what they say they do. Just this month the CEO of the world’s leading certifier stepped down after an analysis by The Guardian found that over 90% of rainforest carbon credits were worthless. In May, a new $1 billion California lawsuit alleged that the credits that Delta relied on for its claim of reaching carbon neutrality claims were bogus.Carbon credits are in crisis at the same moment we need to massively scale up carbon credits to meet net zero goals. So what do we do about these quality problems? In this episode, Shayle talks to Allister Furey, co-founder and CEO of Sylvera, a company that rates the quality of credits, akin to what agencies like Moody’s or Standard & Poor’s do for bonds.Shayle and Allister cover topics like: The history of the first voluntary carbon markets and their early problems, like producing fluorocarbons just to destroy them The state of the current market, including its size, segments and prices The wide gulf in price between the cheapest avoidance credits and the most ambitious engineered removal credits  Why Allister thinks we need to be on a “war footing” to reach to the highly ambitious carbon removal targets to meet net zero, such as growing the market from $2 billion to $1 trillion by 2050 Why high prices do not necessarily mean high quality  Recommended Resources: The Guardian: Revealed: more than 90% of rainforest carbon offsets by biggest certifier are worthless, analysis shows The Guardian: Delta Air Lines faces lawsuit over $1bn carbon neutrality claim Sylvera: Sylvera response to The Guardian’s Analysis of Rainforest Offsets Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Are you a utility or climatetech startup looking to understand how artificial intelligence will shape your company? Come to our one-day event, Transition-AI: Boston, on June 15. Our listeners get a 20% discount with the code PSPODS20.Support for Catalyst comes from Climate Positive, a podcast by HASI, that features candid conversations with the leaders, innovators, and changemakers who are at the forefront of the transition to a sustainable economy. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.Catalyst is supported by Scale Microgrids, the distributed energy company dedicated to transforming the way modern energy infrastructure is designed, constructed, and financed. Distributed generation can be complex. Scale makes it easy. Learn more: scalemicrogrids.com.

The energy transition is fueling skyrocketing demand for copper, an essential metal for renewables, batteries, and other climatetech.But supply isn’t keeping up. There’s more than enough copper in the earth’s known reserves to supply our growing demand for the metal, but supply is stagnating due to rising extraction costs and decades-long lead times to open new mines.A July 2022 report from S&P Global predicts that demand could begin to exceed supply in just a few years.. Without action, a growing supply gap could last into the 2050s, hampering the speed and scale of the transition.What can we do about it?In this episode, Shayle talks to Cristóbal Undurraga, the CEO of copper mining technology company Ceibo. They talk about the causes of stagnating supply and the technologies that could help increase production. They cover topics like: Energy usage and carbon emissions in copper supply chains The limitations of scrap recycling to meet growing demand The geopolitics of copper supply chains, including China’s major role in smelting The pros and cons of the two major copper extraction methods – concentration and electrolysis The two major types of ore – copper oxides and copper sulfides, and why one is so much harder to mine The long lead times to build new mines and why constructing new ones isn’t easy Ceibo’s approach to increase mine capacity using novel electrolysis technology for copper sulfides Recommended Resources: S&P Global: The Future of Copper The Economist: Copper is the missing ingredient of the energy transition Bloomberg: The Green Energy Transition Has a Chilean Copper Problem Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Support for Catalyst comes from Climate Positive, a podcast by HASI, that features candid conversations with the leaders, innovators, and changemakers who are at the forefront of the transition to a sustainable economy. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.Catalyst is supported by Scale Microgrids, the distributed energy company dedicated to transforming the way modern energy infrastructure is designed, constructed, and financed. Distributed generation can be complex. Scale makes it easy. Learn more: scalemicrogrids.com.

Are you a utility or climatetech startup looking to understand how artificial intelligence will shape your company? Come to our one-day event, Transition-AI: Boston, on June 15. Our listeners get a 20% discount with the code PSPODS20.On the Catalyst with Shayle Kann podcast this week:The good news: the U.S. has about 47 days’ worth of energy stored up for later use. The bad news? Virtually all of it is in the form of fossil fuels – coal, oil and natural gas. By comparison, if you add up all the energy stored in batteries, pumped hydropower and other zero-carbon storage, it adds up to just a few seconds’ worth.This small scale of low-carbon energy storage is a big problem. We’re building out intermittent renewables fast, and we need enough energy storage to back up wind when turbines slow down and solar when the sun isn’t shining. But there are technologies that could get us there. In this episode, Shayle talks to his colleague Andy Lubershane, who is a partner and head of research at Energy Impact Partners. Andy recently wrote a piece called Four ways to store sunlight, which compares lithium-ion batteries, heat storage, ion-air batteries, and hydrogen. Andy and Shayle cover topics like: The storage trifecta: short duration, diurnal, and multi-day seasonal Andy’s guess at how low the price of lithium-ion batteries could go Why we would use heat storage and hydrogen, despite their low round-trip efficiencies Why molten-salt heat storage didn’t take off High hopes for iron-air batteries’ low costs Blending hydrogen into gas turbines How all these technologies are competing against carbon capture and storage (CCS) Recommended Resources: Andy Lubershane: Four ways to store sunlight Form Energy: Enabling a True 24/7 Carbon-Free Resource Portfolio for Great River Energy with Multi-Day Storage Catalyst is a co-production of Post Script Media and Canary Media.Support for Catalyst comes from Climate Positive, a podcast by HASI, that features candid conversations with the leaders, innovators, and changemakers who are at the forefront of the transition to a sustainable economy. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.Catalyst is supported by Scale Microgrids, the distributed energy company dedicated to transforming the way modern energy infrastructure is designed, constructed, and financed. Distributed generation can be complex. Scale makes it easy. Learn more: scalemicrogrids.com.