Changing Academic Life

Austen Rainer and I love co-facilitating academic leadership development courses for Informatics Europe and sharing experiences with so many people who share a commitment to doing academia differently. In this conversation we reflect on how these courses came about and experiences running them so far. We also try to unpack the similarities and differences between the online and residential versions of the course as well as the broad topic areas we cover. Join us in being part of changing academic cultures through good leadership practices.[A leader is] “anyone who holds themselves accountable for developing the potential in others” Lucy Ryan, Lunchtime Learning for Leaders p.3 “A leader is anyone who takes responsibility for recognising the potential in people and ideas, and has the courage to develop that potential” Brené Brown“... collectively trying to change academic cultures for the better through positive constructive leadership practices, and bringing out the best in people.” Geri“I find it such a rewarding course to be involved in, how much I learn from everybody that participates,...and certainly that's the feedback we get, how beneficial the course is to help people in the kind of development... of leadership in academia.” AustenOverview (times approximate):0:05 Welcome to Changing Academic Life. 5:58 Dagstuhl 2019 and the first meeting. 10:26 What made you want to do the master’s degree? 16:42 What is the value of co-facilitation? 20:05 How would you define leadership within the academic context? 25:20 Giving people permission to pursue something.33:09 The importance of self-reflection and ongoing learning. 40:38 Differences between online courses vs. residential courses.44:16 Broad topic areas of the courses48:46 Invitation to join the next courses -online starting in Spring 2023 and the residential in June 2023 50:40 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation.Related links:Informatics Europe Leadership Courses - overview page - with links to next course offerings (special rates for people from IE member institutions)Online Academic Leadership Development course Spring 2023 - early bird reg 31 Jan, registration open until 17 Feb.Residential Academic Leadership Development course June 2023 - early bird reg 28 AprilInformatics Europe - IE home page - encourage your institution to become members if they are not alreadyLucy Ryan, https://www.lucyryan.co.uk, Book: Lunchtime Learning for Leaders Brené Brown, https://brenebrown.com, Book: Dare to LeadAn earlier podcast conversation with Austen Rainer (Queens Uni, Belfast) about his career path - changing cultures, leading people, valuesMaria Angela Ferrario, Queens Belfast  Gregor Engels, Paderborn Uni & Informatics Europe ECSS2018 Deans Workshop ECSS2019 Leaders Workshop Dagstuhl Seminar ‘Values in Computing’, July 2019  Ben Zander ‘Mistakes: how fascinating’ VIA Character strengths

In this short podcast [19:16 mins], I reflect on some of the themes from across the podcast discussions since Sept 2022 - themes around listening, leadership and stepping up to make a difference. I also conclude with a call to take some time now to reflect on and savour your 2022 and to think of your theme for 2023.Full transcript: [Also downloadable as pdf]00:05 Welcome to changing academic life. I'm Geraldine Fitzpatrick. And this is a podcast series where academics and others share their stories, provide ideas and provoke discussions about what we can do it individually and collectively to change academic life for the better.00:30 As 2022 draws to an end, I thought it would be useful just to step back and reflect on the different themes and the conversations we've heard in this series. So far. As I shared in the first short podcast in September 1, actually, this year, it's been a bit of a strange year, I think still trying to reconnect and get reestablished or to find new ways of being and working, and living and then in, in the ongoing situations that we're dealing with worldwide. So the podcast series only really started up again in September. And I think across the conversations that we've had, so far, there's some really interesting common themes around the power of good listening, the different ways of doing leadership and being leader, and how any of us can step up and be part of making a difference. 01:27 So we started off this series, listening to Oscar Trimboli, who's who's an expert on listening, and whose mission is to create 100 million deep listeners in the world. So he's not an academic, per se, but does draw on a lot of research based work to promote different ways of listening well. And just as a little sidebar, I was talking about this in a workshop, we're running around mentoring and mentioning about deep listening. And someone just had a little chuckle, because talking to a group of computer scientists, deep listening is DL, which is deep learning, you know, so that you can think of it as DL. But what I think Oscar really was good at just drawing attention to was the importance of just how we're present with people. And the importance of really listening deeply, so that we can also then ask great questions that aren't for our own understanding, but helping other people better understand and develop. And he also talked about or unpacked for us five different levels of listening. So different ways that we can really listen. 02:39 He also talked about us needing to communicate more in how we communicate. So for me, I think that thing of being really present with people and trying to listen well, and being more explicit in how we're communicating is a useful thing to pick up. And, and interestingly, that was something that Julie Kientz mentioned in her discussion as well about taking on a head of department role, where she talks about needing to be very explicit with people that she was working with, especially some of her students and that which hat she was wearing, or which hat they wanted her to wear an interaction. So I think that's a nice example of communicating how we communicate. 03:28 We also then, after Oscar heard from four different people, Julie Kientz, who stepped up and took on a head of department role, Darragh McCashin, who stepped up and was part of creating a COST network on how to promote better mental health amongst researchers. We had Stuart Reeves, who stepped up to become part of the University Senate as a way of trying to affect change in his local institution. And we had Aisling O'Kane who stepped up as a as an interim department head as well. And what I think is interesting about all of these people, you know, Aisling talks to talked about the fact that she wasn't, she always sort of associated these roles with the grey hairs, the lots of experience, and all of these people are relatively young, career wise. And yet all of them demonstrated that it is possible if we see something that needs to be done that we can step up and do it and we don't need to be senior. 04:44 So, you know, Darragh was talking about the, the stepping up and setting out sort of working with others on mental health initiatives as part of the cost network and touching upon issues of imposter. And for me the discussions of impostor wasn't just about the fact that it's dealing with impostor, which is perhaps a common experience that many of us share. But again, that that thread of the value of listening to each other, of sharing our own stories and hearing that we're not alone in dealing with these issues, and, and the power of that, and a lot of the interventions and events that they've held, we had Stuart who's talking about slow heart change working from the inside of institutions. And that the, you know, what must be frustrating at times, just because of how slow these institutions are to change. But if we want to see change, we've got to be part of it. And the way that he's learning to work within the bureaucratic structures of the University Senate to try to affect change, and to try to bring in the voices of other people that he works with. And so again, that theme of listening to what the other voices and concerns are, so that he could properly represent them. 06:17 And then Julie and Aisling, both taking on heads of department role, and dealing with the challenges of shifting from being appear to stepping into a different sort of role. And so there are a couple of interesting things, I think I heard across their discussions as well. And that is that there's no ideal way of doing leadership. You know, as we said, you don't have to be the grey experienced person, grey haired, experienced person. And what I liked about both of the ways that they navigated through their, their stepping into these roles was the way that they connected to what their own strengths were, and defining a modality of leadership that reflected who they were. So for Julie, that was really tapping into her strength around being a mentor and her love of mentoring, and how she could reinterpret that within a wider faculty context. And for Aisling, it was very much around how to bring forward those strengths that she brings into the research around engaging multiple voices and participatory design co design sort of processes, and how to bring similar participatory decision making to the faculty. 07:38 And it's interesting the both of them in different ways, talked about being reluctant sort of authority figures, and somehow having uneasy relationships to power because of the relative youth and having stepped from peer into leadership. And I think, both and in fact, all of them demonstrate really interesting examples of a way of exercising power that's around power with. And this goes back to some work of Mary Parker Follett, who studied organisations back in the 1940s, who first wrote about these notions of power over versus power with, and that's since been developed by lots of different authors to also include power to. So power over is often associated with the more grey had experienced, like it's the asymmetrical power relationships, it's very hierarchical command and control, the power to reflects that sense of the ability of the leader to have some influence. And this is an interesting concept. The power to because it can be it can play out in relation to power, I have the power to have power over. But it can also be, I have the power to help other people find their power. 09:03 And that points to more of the power with and that's how you that the ability of the leader to actively promote people to work together to act together and to empower them to be part of decision making. And I think all of them have talked about different ways of engaging with people that really illustrate specific examples of power with Julie talked about the importance of being open and communicative and doing it in a timely way. And, you know, and also recognising the power to because she also talked about in your recognising that when you're in a position of leadership, and you see something some situation or some that needs dealing with or some people come to you with some concerns you actually have power to do something about it. And Aisling similarly talked about, one of the motivations for her stepping into the department head role was seeing that there were changes that were needed because of the rapid recent growth of the department and the current challenges of the context that we're in. And recognising that there was something she could do about it and wanting to make a difference.10:27 Now, we also saw different people talk about the different trade offs and costs of doing this. So there, I think it's worth pointing out that there are trade offs and costs in not doing anything, which is the status quo, or other people exercising power, taking things in directions that you may not want to see things go in. Some of the costs were around research time. And yeah, the amount of time to really sort of focus on that. They're also impacts on family life as well, in some ways. And again, they have different ways of navigating and negotiating this. 11:07 Some other themes that I think we've seen is around the permission, that to give ourselves not to be perfect, to learn, to be comfortable with being uncomfortable. As Julie said, The recognising that we're not always going to get it right, and asking for advice. And as Aisling so beautifully illustrated, also sort of recognising what could have been done differently or better, and acknowledging that. So I think there's lots of encouragement in the discussions that we've heard about, any one of us can step up and be part of making a difference. 11:53 And I think also recognising that it's always going to be in situations of change and challenges. That what we've seen in the last couple of years, maybe a little bit more exaggerated, if you like, and more shared global experience in terms of challenges. But if you even think back to Stuart's early days being on the picket line, there were challenges then that they were responding to. So I think that it's situation normal, that there always going to be challenges and complex issues to deal with. 12:33 The other thing that I think we've heard across all of the discussions as well, and whether is about the complex structures that we need to engage with, and that the anything that we're dealing with here is multi level. So Darragh talked about needing to have both top down and bottom up approaches, Stuart talked about the really complex management structures. Both Julie and Aisling talked about the way they had to engage, you know, top down and bottom up and across as well. And the ways in which, when and how those sorts of interactions were important for effecting change. And through all of that, again, was that thread of the importance of listening to people. 13:21 What I also heard across the discussions was the importance of support and connection and collegiality, whether it was connecting with other heads of department, whether it was connecting with other people within the group for support, you know, for and Darragh talking, for example, about the importance of connecting with other people in the lab and just sharing and peers and just sharing. We also heard as part of this, the importance of empathy. Both Julie and Aisling mentioned that in particular, when it comes to leadership. 13:56 So let's be encouraged by what they've said. About Darragh talking about the value in putting ourselves out there. The call from Julie to try out leadership and really, that being a way of being able to amplify the impact and having bigger impacts that can be better for all. The encouragement of Aisling to create better workplaces for all of them that she benefits from as well as everyone else. Of Stuart recognising the great power that there is through collective action. So how can you and I step up within our individual contexts? What are the opportunities right now where we can listen better? To understand the concerns and the issues? And where we can connect to our values and strengths, and work out how we can best make a contribution to having an impact in our local contexts? 15:04 And Julie's decision framework that she had that was more talking about her research, I think can also be useful here. So I and I would sort of riff off her decision framework as she talked about, will I have fun doing it? Will I learn something from it? Am I uniquely qualified to do it? And I'd sort of unpack that mi uniquely qualified to do it to think about what are the unique strengths that I can bring to this right now, you know, and then your unique passions. So I look forward to bringing more conversations in 2023. 15:46And just to end on a slightly different note, can I encourage you just to take some time to reflect back on your 2022 on what you achieved, what you've enjoyed, what you've survived? And take a little bit of time just to pat yourself on the back as well. Because I think that one of the things that Darragh talked about was with the imposter, we often don't sit with our achievements very long. We're always looking for the next thing. Yes, we've accomplished this. And what's the next thing is we're immediately jumping to that because there's always something more. 16:29 So, in closing, I just like to encourage us all to take to gift ourselves, five minutes, 10 minutes just to sit and reflect on what we're proud of this year. And it could be achievements could be things like, you know, the usual publications or grants. But it could just be that we made it to the end of the year, that we're relatively saying that we're, that we're healthy enough. It could be valuing and being grateful for the social connections that we have for the supports we have. It could be the gratitude for reconnecting to that to what's important to us and getting better perspective, given all the challenges that we've had in the last couple of years. So taking some time just to stop and reflect and celebrate, and savour and I'll point to a previous related work that I did around just taking time to savour. 17:34 So may you enjoy your time at the in this in these dying minutes of 2022 to savour and reflect on what you have achieved. And looking forward to 2023. And towards this I'll also put a link in the on the web page to another related work podcast that was called my year of being bold. That actually talked about the value of deciding on some theme that's going to set you up for your new year to describe your new year in terms of some overall connection to your why. What do you want this year to be for you? So all the best. And thank you for listening with me for this year. 18:25 [Outro]19:17 EndRelated links& podcasts:Mary Parker Follett - power over, power withAnd a recent paper reviewing some of the literature on power over, to, with: Pamela Pansardi & Marianna Bindi (2021) The new concepts of power? Power-over, power-to and power-with, Journal of Political Power, 14:1, 51-71, DOI: 10.1080/2158379X.2021.1877001RW9 Progress and praise [23:27 mins] - the discussion on savouring in particular starts at 18:46 mins.RW1 My year of being bold [10:11 mins] - your theme for 2023?

Dr. Aisling O’Kane is an Associate Professor of Human-Computer Interaction in Health at the University of Bristol in the UK. In Part 1 of our conversation, she talked about her very diverse background ad reflected on issues like the importance of mobility, the challenges being part of an academic couple with family, and the impact of COVID. In Part 2 here, she goes on to talk about how she came to take on an acting Head of Department role as a relatively junior faculty member, motivated by wanting to try to make a better workplace for herself and others. She also talks about issues of power and engagement and what she terms ‘a radical participatory decision making’ approach as way to try to engage people in being part of the change.“[Prev HoD] was the poster child of what you want for leadership, just his emotional intelligence, his empathy, his view on things engaging with people is fantastic.” “You might think…what to sacrifice, what a volunteer. It was entirely selfish. I wanted a better workplace.” “I certainly wasn’t the authority figure.”“So that was pulling on…my research, which involves co design…participatory design, and treating that year…as a big co design activity and making decisions that way. “ “I remember arriving and being new and female and and not feeling like I could talk about things.”“I am much more confident going into it and knowing that I don't know things and it's okay… And to be able to reach out and ask the stupid questions and not be ashamed of what you don't know.”“I'm happier here now. It's more collegiate place in a nicer place to work.”Overview (times approximate): 00:28 Episode introduction0:05 Introduction to Part 2 of this episode. 2:24 The current situation in computer science at Bristol 5:21 The transition from a department into a school and the need for leadership. 10:51 The wild west of the university system. 17:15 The key things that made it work for a year. 23:24 The importance of being part of the change and the cost of being selfish. 27:12 The move to online discussions and decision making and how people feel about it. 32:51 What Aisling learned from this year as head 38:09 Being proud of what she has achieved and also reflecting on the mistakes41:00 My final reflections43:43 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation Related links:Seth Bullock Chris Allen Bristol Interaction Group Related podcasts:Aisling Part 1 of our conversationRW6 Exploring your own superpowersRW7 Job Crafting - small tweaks can make a big difference

Dr. Aisling O’Kane is an Associate Professor of Human-Computer Interaction in Health at the University of Bristol in the UK. In Part 1 of our conversation, she talks about her very diverse background from engineering to human factors and working in industry, from margarine, beer and nuclear risk assessment, then to doing a PhD, and now being in a faculty position. Along the way she reflects on the importance of mobility, the challenges being part of an academic couple with family, and the impact of COVID. In Part 2, we will go on to talk about how she came to take on an acting Head of Department role to try to make a better workplace for herself and others.“I'm really quite passionate about understanding the real world influence on these things that are designed to be safety critical for health.”“It is luck. But it's a lot to do with my parents, setting me up with an education that I could I could pursue something of interest rather than just having to focus on making money.”“We're very lucky here to have not only superstars, but they're also really nice…they're all parents as well.”Overview (times approximate):00:30 Preamble02:31 Aisling introduces herself, her very diverse background, and draws the threads together in her current work on safety critical health technologies.06:49 Combining experiences from different disciplinary areas and experiences for her PhD and current work around real world influences on safety critical systems09:40 The important influence of her parents on so-called luck11:30 Reflecting on the skills needed to bridge different disciplinary and application domains15:47 The importance of mobility and ability to travel for her and the impact of COVID, having two children and the ‘two body problem’ as well as the environmental impact concerns20:31 Coming out of COVID and choosing to go into the office now for more face to face, chit chat banter with nice colleagues, lab meetings and accommodating people’s different childcare responsibilities using online tools24:54 Impacts of COVID on CV etc, as well as the passive impact of choosing to have two kids on her CV and research trajectory and appreciating having the safety net of a permanent role26:21 Reflecting on some tips and tricks for how to manage that, eg using external conference and review deadlines28:06 Reflecting on generational differences31:15 My final reflections33:19 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation.Related Links:Paul Marshall, BristolKia Höök KTH (see also the CAL podcast episode with Kia)Helena MentisMegan Morgan and Sam James, Bristol - PhD student of AislingMichael Carter, Uni of TorontoGregory Abowd who was at Georgia Tech now at NortheasternGillian Hayes and Yunan Chen, Irvine (see also the CAL podcast episode with Yunan)Sun Young ParkRob Comber and Madeline Balaam, KTH StockholmMike Fraser, Anne Roudaut, Oussama Metatla, and Chris Priest, Bristol UniKTH Interactive Systems Engineering Masters programMobile Life Centre, SwedenUCL Interaction Centre UCLIC, UKCHI_Med EPSRC-funded project

Dr. Stuart Reeves is an Associate Professor in the Mixed Reality Lab and Horizon Research Institute at Nottingham University in the UK. This conversation is in two parts. In Part 1 of our conversation, he reflected on the complexities of universities and the structural/managerial issues that contribute to this. In Part 2 here, Stuart goes on to describe his journey from protesting about pensions on the picket line to becoming an academic member of the university Senate and his experiences of trying to effect change in university governance. As you will understand, he necessarily has to be circumspect about the specific details he shares but nonetheless there is much to be inspired by hearing someone not just see challenges but commit to being part of the change to meet these challenges.“Just making a noise about stuff can bring it onto the agenda.”“People will say…they're just activists…but they miss the fact that…there's a lot of people who agree with you, or at least have some kind of similar troubles with how universities work.”“Sometimes universities do stupid things…partly just because they've just not consulted people.”“The more people…involved in speaking about regular issues, the better.”“Through that collective action, there's great power.”Overview (times approximate)00:29 My introduction to Stuart02:55 How Stuart responds personally – he tells the story of his 2018 involvement in the strike about pensions and how it was the trigger for him thinking that he should start to do something more about this08:37 This led him and some others to run for the university senate and effect change in that way, albeit it being a slow frustrating process of change11:30 The level of commitment being part of Senate12:49 The sorts of changes that can be effected via the Senate work, e.g., structural changes in ways the Senate works, centralization/decentralization discussions, having the long view, connecting with others also asking what are universities for, how to make it more democratic17:49 Reflects on the importance of it being ‘the bunch of us’ doing this work, collegiality, and people responding differently in terms of action21:54 The costs of getting involved in these ways and the types of time and effort involved and wanting to see universities become less top down27:37 Advice for anyone who may be thinking about getting involved in university governance30:02 The lack of collective action by university leadership31:17 Signing up to DORA has been useful to push back on metrics for publications32:09 The rankings racket, like QS and Times Higher, and a call for university leadership to get together and push back a bit in the way they have done with journals33:51 Why he is still in academia37:17 My final reflections38:43 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation here.Related LinksUSS pension scheme San Francisco Declaration on Research Assessment (DORA)QS World University Rankings Times Higher World University RankingsStuart’s Medium article 2017: Thoughts on the UK’s Teaching Excellence Framework.  Stuart Reeves, Murray Goulden, and Robert Dingwall. The future as a design problem. Design Issues, 32(3), Summer 2016. Stuart’s tweet about what they are striking for

Dr. Stuart Reeves is an Associate Professor in the Mixed Reality Lab in the School of Computer Science and Horizon Research Institute both at Nottingham University in the UK. This conversation is in two parts. In Part 1 here, he reflects on the conflict in defining one’s own research brand vs the importance of the collective and collegiality in academia, and the structural issues that contribute to this. He raises the question of ‘what are universities for’ and highlights the complexities of university management and the structures around this. In Part 2 we will go on to discuss his response to these challenges by becoming actively involved in governance at his university.‘The idea of creating one's own research brands…collegiality creates a bit of friction with that. And it's a big kind of mess of things which we're all caught up in …there's a big struggle between defining yourself as part of a group, but also defining yourself as an individual’‘I struggle with that kind of Big [research] Vision element’‘Describing what universities are for socially, culturally, and their value beyond … just producing valuable economic units, economic actors, ie graduate students’‘This is a crisis that's been emerging…it's been visible for years ever since the fees are introduced, you could argue, if you extrapolate,…it was going to happen, at some point, it became more and more significant’Overview (times approximate):2:25 My preamble to Part 13:01 Stuart introduces himself5:17 His reasoning coming back to Nottingham where he did his PhD6:41 The conflict in defining own research brand vs the importance of the collective and collegiality9:46 The structures that help reinforce those tensions e.g., how funding is allocated, how universities value certain aspects11:45 Different research styles that don’t work so well with massive grants – a skill to be able to talk about individual pieces of research as part of some grand vision15:05 About rankings and how governments engage with universities – they can’t articulate what universities are for – and managerialist ways18:55 Balancing this with accountability against the public purse and critiques ways of valuing degrees 21:42 What Stuart would argue universities are for – value on different dimensions and impact of degrees on society24:50 The pressure on student numbers, and capped student fees – ‘this is a crisis that has been visible for years’ – the funding pressures for universities and the disparity between institutions and how much they rely on fees31:32 The day to day impact of all this depends on where you are and internal balancing of finances; also impacts in casualization of workforce; and the management decisions of universities35:32 The backgrounds of university management and management tracks for academics that can lead them to be detached from academic staff38:39 My final comments.39:58 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation here.Related LinksStuart Reeves web page & Stuart’s Medium pageSteve Benford & MRLHorizon Digital Economy Research InstituteUKRI Digital Economy ProgrammeEPSRC Engineering and Physical Sciences Research Council

Welcome to Part 2 of my discussion with Dr Darragh McCashin. In Part 1 Darragh discussed his PhD in Digital mental health and his path to being an Assistant Professor in the School of Psychology at Dublin City University during COVID. In part 2, we start off replaying what he was saying about the mental health challenges faced by PhD and early career researchers in particular and then we get into a focus on the imposter, something that we can probably all relate to. Based on his work and that of his colleagues in the EU ReMO COST Action, ReMo standing for Researcher Mental Health Observatory, Darragh talks about what is imposterism, how it is experienced, the importance of raising awareness and the power of sharing our imposter experiences. He also talks about the importance of taking both top down and bottom up approaches for dealing with imposterism, and shares practical strategies for doing this. “You see the value in putting oneself out there”“It's incredibly powerful when somebody beside you a different career stage …spews the same type of impostor stuff”“It's multi level… it has to be top down meets bottom up”“You're externalising it. And you're living with rather than…living under the feelings of impostor”“At an institutional level, there needs to be an acknowledgement matched with resources”Overview (times approximate):0:30 Preamble01:40 How he got into this work in the first place – by putting himself out there07:29 The themes that come up in discussions about mental health, how mental health issues practically play out and the patterns he sees12:28 The importance of taking both a top down and bottom-up approach15:50 How he defines imposter19:13 Moving to talk about the levels and practical tips for taking action; Being aware of the imposter cycle - ‘It’s always the next thing’ and imposter awareness21:44 Changing toxic lab environments by connecting, and sharing to disrupt the imposter cycle by increasing awareness27:50 Externalizing the imposter as a common experience, finding ways to disrupt the patterns – the importance of language framing – living with rather than under the imposter34:15 More about what can be done to support each other at the group level 37:03 The systemic issues and working at the system/institutional level where there needs to be acknowledgement matched by resources, and the challenges of a duty of care42:59 Final thoughts wrapping up – signposting ReMO COST Action and their manifesto re multi-level change44:35 My reflections at the end47:29 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation here.Related LinksPeople/Projects/Webinars:Darragh’s ReMO Webinar on ‘Understanding the Psychology of Impostor Syndrome in Academia and Beyond’ YouTube link ReMO COST ActionReMO Researcher Mental Health and Wellbeing Manifesto Gábor Kismihók, Brian Cahill, Stéphanie Gauttier, Janet Metcalfe, Stefan T. Mol, Darragh McCashin, Jana Lasser, Murat Güneş, Mathias Schroijen, Martin Grund, Katia Levecque, Susan Guthrie, Katarzyna Wac, Jesper Dahlgaard, Mohamad Nadim Adi, & Christina Kling. (2021). Researcher Mental Health and Well-being Manifesto. Zenodo. https://doi.org/10.5281/zenodo.5788557 ReMO on twitter Hugh Kearns https://www.ithinkwell.com.au/hugh-kearnsPapers:Katia Levecque et al, 2017 Work organization and mental health problems in PhD students. Research Policy, 46:4, 868-879.Interview with Katia   https://www.science.org/content/article/four-years-after-landmark-study-phd-student-mental-health-what-has-changedRuchika Tulshyan and Jodi-Ann Burey, 2021, Stop telling women they have imposter syndrome, HBR Kirstin Mulholland, David Nichol & Aidan Gillespie, 2022, ‘It feels like you’re going back to the beginning…’: addressing imposter feelings in early career academics through the creation of communities of practice, J. Of Further and Higher Education, online July 2022.

Dr Darragh McCashin started as an Assistant Professor in the School of Psychology at Dublin City University during COVID. In Part 1 of this conversation, he reflects on his experiences doing an interdisciplinary PhD in digital mental health, on the importance of interdisciplinary thinking, and on starting a lecturer position at a new university during COVID times. Darragh is also part of the Core Group for the EU COST Network on Researcher Mental Health Observatory, called ReMO. In sharing what he loves and what he finds challenging in his lecturing role, we start to touch on the theme of the imposter, a theme that we focus on in Part 2, coming soon.“It's so hard methodologically logistically to manifest that interdisciplinarity.”“Taking up that [lecturer] position early September 2020. So .. I'm excited for that. But like anything, it was all on Zoom. So it almost didn't feel real.”“[Likes] the flexibility in being able to say, okay, I can set my research agenda”“It's always the next thing … the cycle of imposterism, you'll achieve that thing that you thought you'd never achieve. … And then almost like lightning, it's the next thing that the anxious gaze shifts towards.”“It's incredibly powerful when somebody beside you in a different career stage or in a different discipline, spews the same type of imposter stuff, … You're like, okay, so it's not it's not just me”Overview (times approximate):00:30 Preamble02:07 Darragh introduces himself08:07 How he manifests interdisciplinary thinking 09:35 His men in rural Ireland study for a Movember project 14:43 Experiences of taking on his first lecturer position in the middle of a pandemic20:13 What he loves about his job 22:38 What he is afraid of – the imposter.25:39 The recognition from audiences when he talks about the pressures of academia and the imposter30:01 My reflections at the end32:46 EndIn more detail: PART 1 00:30 Preamble02:07 Darragh introduces his background in sociology and psychology, getting to a PhD in digital mental health and now being an Ass Prof in Dublin City University08:07 How he manifests interdisciplinary thinking but having to be located within a discipline and the shift to transversal skills (soft skills)09:35 His men in rural Ireland study for a Movember project bringing together qualitative thinking/methods and psychology constructs14:43 Experiences of taking on his first lecturer position in the middle of a pandemic, the zoom haze and the challenges getting to know processes, culture and colleagues20:13 What he loves about his job - the flexibility and learning that he can facilitate and is good at it22:38 What he is afraid of – the imposter.25:39 The recognition from audiences when he talks about the pressures of academia and the imposter, and on hearing the research that says 1 in 3 PhD students experience mental health issues30:01 My reflections at the end32:46 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation here.Related LinksDarragh on twitter, on LinkedInMarie Curie TEAM Innovation Training Network & David Coyle & TEAM twitter accountMovember Men’s mental health initiativeAge Action Ireland Report (funded by Movember): EU COST Action ReMOReMO on twitter https://twitter.com/ReMO_COSTRelated CAL podcasts:RW6 Exploring your own superpowersRW9 Progress and praise

Dr. Julie Kientz is a professor and Chair of the department of Human Centered Design & Engineering at the University of Washington in the US. In part 1 of our conversation, Julie reflected on how she made her own way from a small town geeky outcast, to get through college, and then on to a PhD and a faculty position and parenthood.We continue here in Part 2 with Julie talking about some early roles that demonstrated leadership skills, her tenure process and finding a more focused path post-tenure. She also talks about how she came to take on the Department Chair role and then almost immediately having to lead her department through the COVID crisis and then the murder of George Floyd and ongoing racial justice issues. She role models leadership from a place of humility and care, working to her strengths, amplifying impact and being comfortable with being uncomfortable.“Having the authority to really do those things felt really great, it was also scary right, but it was great to recognise that when you are in a position of leadership and you see something or people come to you with concerns, you can do something about it.”“It was important to be open, communicative and timely too.”“I don’t always know what to say but it is better to say something than to struggle with the exact right thing to say.”“Those little things can have an impact on people. But they are hard.”“Being comfortable with being uncomfortable, pushing outside your comfort zones”“Don’t take yourself too seriously, take feedback”Overview (times approximate):02:35 How she became chair through her reputation for being an organized person, trying new things, developing new processes03:57 A digression into her tenure experience05:42 Finding her more focused path post tenure during sabbatical – topic & people & making impact through people11:00 Getting back to the department chair story, being approached by the Dean as an interim chair12:58 Attending a post-tenure mentoring program and deciding a PhD program chair was her ideal role which she does and implements lots of changes, with lots of positive feedback15:04 Taking on interim chair role Fall 2019, creating associate chair roles for support, then being the sole applicant when they did the permanent chair search in Feb 202018:04 Navigating the department through COVID and racial justice issues, working out how to respond, getting and giving support, not always getting it right25:51 Forming a peer support network, re-framing the role of department chair towards mentoring faculty29:05 Managing the shift in relationship from peer to leader, and clarity about different roles/hats 31:45 Relationship with power35:52 Her legacy/impact wishes37:02 Encouragement to try out leadership and amplify impact38:41 What’s hard about the job, and handling the hard decisions41:01 Julie’s final thoughts42:07 My final reflections on the conversation with Julie44:56 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation here.Related LinksJulie Kientz - Bio & Part 1 of our conversationAnind Dey, Amy KoPost-tenure Pathfinders Programme

Dr. Julie Kientz is a professor and Chair of the department of Human Centered Design & Engineering at the University of Washington in the US. In part 1 of our conversation, Julie shares her fascinating journey from first wanting to be a vet to then getting into a small town college to do computer science and then eventually doing a PhD at Georgia Tech and later getting a tenure track position. Her telling of the story is rich with reflective insights and nuggets of wisdom, whether it is about the about the value of good mentors, advice to PhD students, doing a job search as part of an academic couple, how to survive that first year as a faculty member, making decisions and managing boundaries, and parenting alongside work. In Part 2 we will focus on her path into leadership and being a department chair. They were such good mentors. And life changing. The first year is all about survival. So many things you have to learn in that first year [as Assistant Professor].I learned I can’t do it all so I developed this [decision] framework: will I have fun doing it, will I learn something from it, … am I uniquely qualified to do it?There are a lot of parallels between mentoring and parentingOverview (times approximate):02:22 Julie introduces herself and how she got into computing05:00 Discovering research and the life changing impact of good mentors09:25 Getting into Grad School and doing her PhD11:57 Challenges/experiences doing a PhD and learnings as advice to other students 16:47 Finding her post-PhD path18:40 Doing a job search together with partner25:08 Surviving the first year29:45 Making decisions about service, learning about setting boundaries34:14 Managing parenting and being more focused and strategic with work 41:25 EndDownload a full transcript of the conversation here.Related LinksJulie Kientz - BioAnind Dey - https://ischool.uw.edu/people/faculty/profile/anind Jen Mankoff - https://www.cs.washington.edu/people/faculty/jmankoff Previous podcast conversation with Jen Mankoff - http://www.changingacademiclife.com/blog/2019/4/23/jen-mankoff Gregory Abowd - https://coe.northeastern.edu/people/abowd-gregory/ Gillian Hayes - https://www.gillianhayes.com Acknowledgements:Auphonic for post-processing, Otter.ai for help with transcription.