

The Science in The Fiction
Marty Kurylowicz and Holly Carson
This is both a science and a science fiction podcast. We dig deep into the biggest ideas in science fiction, using science to elevate the conversation about sci-fi, and sci-fi to promote science education, curiosity and vision. We talk to science fiction authors about the science in their fiction, then talk to scientists about the same topic, and catalyze conversations between the two.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Jun 20, 2024 • 42min
Anniversary Special - Marty and Holly on The First Year of The Sci in The Fi
To celebrate the first anniversary of our podcast, Marty and Holly do a little retrospective to discuss their favorite books, people and interviews from the last year. We discuss some of the best science fiction books we read: 'Red Team Blues' by Cory Doctorow, 'Semiosis' by Sue Burke, 'Neverness' by David Zindell, 'Night Owls' by Stephen Gay and 'The Ministry for the Future' by Kim Stanley Robinson. We also talk about some of our favorite science books from this year: 'Planta Sapiens' by Paco Calvo, 'A Zoologist's Guide to the Galaxy' by Arik Kershenbaum and 'If Nietzsche Were A Narwhal' by Justin Gregg. We reflect on some of our favorite interviews - with Cory Doctorow, Stephen Gay and Ben Feist, Peter Watts and Justin Gregg, KSR and Heidi Sevestre. Then we do a bit of looking forward into what we have planned for the near future: interviews with Benjamin Percy on space fungus in 'The Unfamiliar Garden', Elan Mastai on time travel in 'All Our Wrong Todays', Daniel H. Wilson on his upcoming book 'Heliopause' and Avi Loeb about Oumuamua and first contact with alien technology in his book 'Extraterrestrial'. Thank you to our listeners for giving us your attention and interest, and to all our guests for their expertise and insight, and to everyone for making this show a success and a wonderful experience!Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

Jun 6, 2024 • 38min
David Curtin on Dark Matter in 'Sunfall' (Part 2)
This is the second part of our interview with Dr. David Curtin, Canada Research Chair in Theoretical Particle Physics at the University of Toronto. In response to the kind of dark matter model found in Jim Al-Khalili's science fiction book 'Sunfall', David expounds upon the "significantly weirder' models of dark matter being contemplated today. Since the failure to find any dark matter candidates at the Large Hadron Collider, and the continued exclusion of WIMPs by the Cryogenic Dark Matter Search, there has been room to develop more complex ideas about atomic dark matter forming from simpler dark particles, and the possibility of a dark electromagnetic force with dark photons to bind dark atoms together. David explains the consequences of not being able to cool down on galactic scales, which gives rise to the spherical halo of dark matter around galaxies - what macro-scale structure tells us about micro-scale structure. He tells us about asymmetric dark anti-matter which may balance the existence of asymmetric regular matter, and could finally explain how something came from nothing in the formation of the universe we see today. We also learn that photons and dark photons are quantum mechanically indistinguishable from each other, which might allow for 'mixing' that turns one into the other, and ultimately gives a mechanism for the detection of dark matter one day. Finally, David describes "mirror stars" as one form of detectable dark matter that we can go looking for right now, either in existing astronomical data or with new telescopic surveys designed to hunt for signatures of the dark universe.Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

May 30, 2024 • 46min
David Curtin on Dark Matter in 'Sunfall' (Part 1)
Dr. David Curtin is the Canada Research Chair in Theoretical Particle Physics at the University of Toronto, and specializes in exotic theories of dark matter that describe a "dark sector" which may include complex dark matter. These "banana-town weirdo" dark matter models include dark electrons, dark protons and dark photons that form dark atoms and possibly an entire mirror universe that exists transparently all around us. We discuss Jim Al-Khalili's book 'Sunfall' and the relatively tame dark matter scenario presented there, in what David calls a "nostalgic book, reminiscent of the days when theoretical physicists moved nations"! We also talk about the spectacular success of the Standard Model of particle physics, super-symmetry and our failure to detect its predictions at the LHC, and the "whackadoodle possibilities" this opens up for more sophisticated and interesting models of dark matter. Along the way David tells us us about WIMPs (Weakly Interacting Massive Particles), theories of neutral naturalness, the hierarchy problem, calculating the electron's dipole moment to 12 decimal places, and the mind-expanding power of science fiction.Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

May 16, 2024 • 51min
Jim Al-Khalili on Dark Matter in 'Sunfall'
Our theme in the next two episodes is dark matter, the kind of far-out science that is stranger than fiction and presents realms of possibility that are both more plausible and more interesting than parallel worlds or extra dimensions or even wormholes. In this episode we talk to Jim Al-Khalili, who is many things: physicist, author of both fiction and non-fiction, educator, broadcaster and all around extraordinary public intellectual who reaches millions of people around the world with his popular science books and as the host of the BBC’s flagship scientific program, The Life Scientific. In this conversation we talk about his new science fiction book Sunfall, which uses dark matter as the novum that drives the story, and makes heroes of the physicist who save the world. Along the way we talk about a lot of other cool science in his science fiction, including quantum effects in biology, the magnetic field of earth and how it prevents our atmosphere from being stripped away by the solar wind, as well as a really interesting bit of (fictional) particle physics that imagines the possibility of manipulating and focusing dark matter beams so they can interact with each other and release their energy in the core of the earth. This is a gentle introduction to the subject of dark matter, about which we still understand very little - but we know it exists, and it is likely to show us that the universe is more ingenious and creative and interesting than our human minds have yet to imagine.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Al-Khalilihttps://www.amazon.com/Sunfall-Jim-Al-Khalili/dp/0593077423Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

May 2, 2024 • 55min
Edward M. Lerner on Planetary Protection in 'Life and Death on Mars'
In this episode we return to the theme of Planetary Protection, continuing the conversation we started in episodes 19 and 20 where we discussed the return of samples from Asteroid Bennu to Earth in NASA’s recent OSIRIS Rex mission. There we talked about what measures were taken to protect the biosphere of Earth from any unforeseen biological agents that such a sample may harbor, hearkening back to the plot of Michael Crichton’s famous novel 'The Andromeda Strain'. In this episode we continue down this road with science fiction author Edward M. Lerner, this time contemplating the difficulties and dangers inherent in a return of samples from Mars to Earth, in his new novel 'Life and Death on Mars'. We discuss the difference between samples from asteroids and samples from Mars, and contemplate the possible existence of life on Mars along with the various possible consequences of its interaction with life on Earth. We also talk about the international collaborative efforts in the space station and the return to the Moon, how the Moon can act as a stepping stone in the race to Mars, what resources can form the basis of an economy and permanent presence on Mars, using a Mars base to exploit the mineral wealth of the asteroid belt, and imagine what may become the next space race after Mars.Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

Apr 19, 2024 • 1h 8min
Peter Gorniak and Cydney Nielsen on Artificial Intelligence and Virtual Reality in 'Stealing Worlds'
Marty sits down with his university pals Drs. Peter Gorniak and Cyndey Nielsen, to discuss Karl Schroeder's book 'Stealing Worlds'. As it happens, they both have PhD's and lifelong careers working in their fields of expertise - Peter in artificial intelligence and Cydney in data analytics and virtual/mixed reality, so they were the perfect people to bring their professional and personal perspectives to a discussion of Karl's book. We talk about where artificial intelligence and virtual reality were 20 years ago, where they are today, and what they might become in the future.My Science Fiction — KarlSchroeder.com (kschroeder.com)https://www.kschroeder.com/my-booksSend us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

Apr 4, 2024 • 1h 4min
Karl Schroeder on Artificial Intelligence and Virtual Reality in 'Stealing Worlds'
Karl Schroeder is a science fiction author and foresight analyst. His fiction is known for both its scientific rigour and its visionary quality of bearing witness to what we can expect just around the corner – especially with his latest book 'Stealing Worlds'. This book is jam packed with big ideas about artificial intelligence (AI) and virtual reality (VR). We talk about the creation of LARPing worlds, i.e. Live Action Role Playing games within a virtual reality which can exist on top of and in parallel with the regular world. We also discuss more sophisticated versions of this called frame worlds, which have their own independent but virtually embedded economies. We chat about the oligarchic systems within our neoliberal catastrophe, think about invoking consensual hallucinations that are even better than money, and imagine how choosing your technology layer can translate to choosing your reality. We also discuss artificial intelligences that think they are eagles, or forests, and how to get them to act independently on behalf of beings who have not been able to represent themselves economically or politically - til now. Science Fiction for the Crypto Age — KarlSchroeder.com (kschroeder.com)https://www.kschroeder.com/Karl Schroeder - Wikipediahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_SchroederStealing Worlds by Karl Schroeder | Goodreadshttps://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/41447722Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

Mar 21, 2024 • 58min
Peter Watts (Part 2) on Intelligence and Consciousness in 'Blindsight'
In the second part of our interview with Peter Watts, we delve into his ideas about intelligence and consciousness. Does consciousness serve any function, or can all cognitive processes get along just fine without it? In his novel Blindsight, Peter postulates a hostile entity whose intelligence outcompetes our own, because it is not weighed down by the slow, clunky machinery of sapience. But his thinking has evolved in recent years, to concede the possible primacy of consciousness, and heck, even the existence of a soul! Along the way we talk about a blob of cells called dish-brain that taught itself to play pong. We contemplate energy minimization, integrated information and even pan-psychic theories of consciousness. We ask how far down the chain of being sentience might reach, and ultimately admit we have no idea how a lump of meat can wake up to ask questions about the nature of its own awareness.Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

Mar 14, 2024 • 51min
Peter Watts (Part 1) on Intelligence and Consciousness in 'If Nietzsche Were a Narwhal'
We talk to acclaimed science fiction author Peter Watts about Justin Gregg's book 'If Nietzsche Were a Narwhal'. We ask if the human flavour of intelligence is maladaptive, and other creatures are smarter because they are so well adapted to their evolutionary niche - or are we comparing apples with moon rocks? Ultimately, the question is whether the animal wisdom of bedbugs and crocodilians is going to get them off this planet when the sun goes supernova. Peter expresses his opinion that human intelligence is actually special in this regard. The problems we create with our technological intelligence are due to our minds still being shackled to animal instincts, and if we are to solve our problems we may need to escape from the evolutionary constraints under which our minds evolved.Echopraxia (rifters.com)https://www.rifters.com/Peter Watts (author) - Wikipediahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Watts_(author)Send us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/

Feb 29, 2024 • 59min
Justin Gregg on Intelligence and Consciousness in 'If Nietzsche Were a Narwhal'
Marty and Holly sit down with zoologist Justin Gregg to discuss his book 'If Nietzsche Were a Narwhal: What Animal Intelligence Reveals About Human Stupidity'. We discuss which aspects of human intelligence (and stupidity) are unique in the animal world, and what sets our mental faculties apart from those of other animals. We talk about our capacity for causal reasoning, the creation of language and our ability to lie, to imagine our own death, and to create moral frameworks to guide our behaviour. We also contemplate the phenomenon of consciousness and self awareness, and discuss how the subjective experience might arise in other organisms, from insects to primates. Finally we examine 'prognostic myopia', our short-sighted inability to plan for long-term problems, and the consequences for our species and our planet.Justin Gregghttps://www.justingregg.com/If Nietzsche Were a Narwhal — Justin Gregghttps://www.justingregg.com/narwhalSend us a messageEmail: thescienceinthefiction@gmail.comFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/743522660965257/


