Cider Chat

The Ask Ryan Series is back! In Spring of 2020 the first Ask Ryan series with Ryan Monkman of FieldBird Cider was posted. This year we return with Ryan once again to dive into more  cidermaking questions. In this segment we return to more questions about oak barrels and cider and the technique known as Bâtonnage. The question: Is it okay for gross lees stay in the barrel or is it a good idea to rack out the cider into another barrel to get it off of the gross lees? Ryan Monkman Gross Lees Defined The sediment that forms on the bottom before fermentation is generally called Gross Lees. Considering this definition then, once the apples are pressed and before they go into the barrel there can be a drop of the heavy particles in the apple juice before it ferments. Sooo, it could be said that the gross lees are not in the barrel to begin with...or are they? Heavy Solid Ferments at FieldBird Cider 20% of the ciders that FieldBird makes is done so on the gross lees Dangers of Gross lees and how to manage The danger is that heavy solids bind with oxygen Cure: Manage the oxygen FieldBird does a rack and return with some of the ciders. This in turn helps with reduction When to do the Rack and Return? Track the ferment during alcohol fermentation Macro-oxygenation (Macro-Ox) is a technique where one intentionally over oxidizing juice before fermentation Ryan's Recommendations and Readings on the topic of oxygen and Bret management Book: Post Modern Winemaking This link above is an affiliate link that cost you nothing to click onto but may provide a kick back to Cider Chat. Ryan recommends getting an oil free air compressor for the hobbyist At FieldBird, they use Food Grade Oxygen Contact for Ryan Monkman at FieldBird Cider website: https://www.fieldbird.ca/ Instagram  FieldBird https://www.instagram.com/fieldbird.cider/ Ryan Monkman https://www.instagram.com/rgmonkman/ Listen to past episodes with Ryan Monkman AskRyan Quarantine Quad series 2020   Part 1 Part 2  Part 3 Part 4 131: Cider Barrels with a Cooper, a Maker & Thierry Lemaire 132: Barrels & Bâtonnage 168: Barrel Aging Cider Inspiration Mentions in this Chat Marcel's cidery in the Netherlands http://www.degerdeneer.nl A new 2021 book on cidermakers in the Netherlands http://hethamerstuk.nl/boek-ambachtelijke-cider/ CraftCon2021 - April 29th & 30th 2021 A virtual two day conference based in the UK Grazed Knee Cider | Isle of Wight Fermentis by Lesaffre - Q&A #17 What causes a stuck fermentation? Two upcoming Ferementis seminars May 20th - Session 1 for craft and industrial:https://www.edudip.com/en/webinar/exploring-the-diversity-of-yeast-strains-and-fermentation-conditions-for-different-cider-styles-session-1/1135676May 27th - Session 2 for home cider makers:https://www.edudip.com/en/webinar/exploring-the-diversity-of-yeast-strains-and-fermentation-conditions-for-different-cider-styles-session-2/1135696    

Cider Canada / Cidre Canada Barry Rooke knows that the Canadian cider market is growing and believes in it so much that he and his partner Wendy co-founded The Cider Crate, a website that hosts their blog, a map of cidermakers in Canada, a podcast.  His full time work is as Executive Director - National Campus/Community Radio Association and he is also an accredited member of the Canadian Society of Association Executives! Suffice to say, Barry has the tools at hand to help build an association from the ground up! Building Cider Canada Barry shares the baseline steps for building an association Interim President and Board Bylaws Membership Website and Social Media By the Fall this burgeioning association hopes to hold its first of what should be an Annual General Meeting. Cider Canada / Cidre Canada This multi lingual country with the province of Quebec speaking predominantly French Canadian is why the association is choosing both spelling for the associaton on its logo. Barry discusses 4 General Apple Regions to consider Atlantic -soft and sweet profile. Quebec - more tannic and acid forward Ontario - Brighter, higher alcohol Okanagan Valley, British Columbia - more minerality Though we only discussed 4, I do believe there are more and as time goes on each province will hone into their regions terroir further. Mentions in this Chat Fermentis by Lesaffre - Q&A #16 What is Fermentis yeast strain is recommended for an industrial cider using AJC/Sugar for cider, in varying ratios? AB1 A New Podcast fan for - The Original Designated Drinker with Ambrosia Borowski Episode 1:  Malort https://soundcloud.com/user-91938082/designated-drinkers-episode-1-mallort Tattiebogle Ciderworks  - Pennsylvania CraftCon2021 - April 29th & 30th 2021 A virtual two day conference based in the UK

Fermenting with Quince Was Aphrodite’s Forbidden Fruit a quince or the apple? She's not talking, but cidermakers are in this panel discussion on “Fermenting with Quince” that was recorded for CiderCon2021. Quince a.k.a. Cydonia oblonga is the sole member of the genus Cydonia in the family Rosaceae. Quince is a ‘pomme’ fruit with the likes of apples, pears, and medlars. This golden Pomme is having a renaissance of sorts with makers partly due to it aromatic qualities and tannins. Kim Hamblin and Dan Rinke of Art + Science in Oregon, Steve Selin of South Hill Cider in New York and UK makers Martin Berkley of Pilton’s Cider and James Forbes of Little Pomona will discuss fermenting with Quince for this panel discussion that was moderated by Ria Windcaller of Cider Chat.  The Fermenting with Quince questions What inspired you to ferment with quince and how long have you fermenting with quince? How do you source your quince? Quince varieties used - not unusual for makers to use unknown varieties. Quince product(s) and how it is made. What is the ABV? Tasting notes: or what should we expect. Maker Techniques for instance, 100% or blended into cider Fermenting with Quince Order of Speakers Art + Science | Oregon South Hill Cider | New York Pilton Cider | Somerset/UK Little Pomona | Hertfordshire/UK Mentions in this Chat Fermentis by Lesaffre - Q&A #15 - What yeast strain(s) would you recommend for a Cold/sweet/French cider? AB1 ,AS2 sweet complexity, Quince Episodes on Cider Chat Episode 248 New England Quince Taste Test 2020 Episode 252 #GrowQuince  | Part 1 Episode 253 #GrowQuince |Part 2 - The Harvest Episode 266 Vermont Quince Co. Elevates a Forgotten Pomme Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTube

Vermont Quince Hosts the New England Quince Taste Test of 2020 Perhaps before you listen to this episode 266 you might like to go to episode 248 to hear the initial blind tasting to compare the notes with this episode. The Inspiration Behind Vermont Quince A mother and son trip to Spain, inspired Nan Stefanik to incorporate Vermont Quince Company was in 2012. Since that time her one person company has not only wowed the foodie market with her many quince marmalades and pastes, but she also secured a Specialty Crop Grant for the #GrowQuince Initiative. Nan notes that she is "Still amazed that even at her age, she knew so little about quince" which had first been introduce to New England in 1629. At the time quince became a staple as it is a great resource for pectin used in the making of jams. From New England, the quince traveled to Texas in 1850 and then California. The Golden State became a top producer of 90% of the commercial quince on the market. In the mid 20th century the producing artificial pectin led to the demise of quince production. Market Research and Vermont Quince Nan credits her son for encouraging her to do a bit of market research on Quince. She found that US chefs were sourcing their quince from overseas from Spain, Italy, Australia and New Zealand. The thought of importing this once beloved pomme fruit (in the same family as apples and pears) inspired her to start her business Vermont Quince which produces a lovely assortment of quince condiments and preserves....and she even plays at home with infusing quince to make a delightful liquor. The quince is listed below in the order that they were presented in this blind tasting. Aromatnaya A Russian variety that bears a very large, bright yellow, aromatic fruit with a delicious, lemony flavor. Aromatnaya fruit can be eaten fresh, when thinly sliced and used to make marmalade and jellies. ID: This variety is typically squat and with ridges like a pumpkin Kuganskaya Known to be from the region of the southern Caucasus, north of Turkey and Armenia.  ID: This variety has very smooth skin and doesn't tend to split Smyrna Extremely large fruit with light yellow flesh, bright yellow skin. Attractive tree (or multi-stemmed shrub) has dark green foliage & very showy bloom. Tolerates wet soil. ID: Described by Nan as being a "big honking' fruit that can appear bulbous van Deman - this quince variety was developed by Luther Burbank, (March 7, 1849 – April 11, 1926) who was an American botanist and horticulturist based in California. Van Deman bears good crops of large and delicious, bright yellow fruit. Expect a spicy flavored from this quince.  Orange Expect ripening to occur October through December and to also extend through February in some colder areas. The Orange Quince is a self fertile tree and requires 300 chill hours. ID: round and apple like Follow the #GrowQuince Initiative by going to the links below as Nan continues to make available more ID tools and info on this once forgotten fruit! Contact info for Vermont Quince Company Shop for all the products Nan discussed and more at  Vermont Quince email info@vermontquince.com Facebook page: GrowQuince. Mentions in this Chat Fermentis by Lesaffre - Q&A #14 - Can you explain a little bit about the difference between mineral and organic nutrient/nutrient additions? Quince Episodes on Cider Chat Episode 248 New England Quince Taste Test 2020 Episode 252 #GrowQuince  | Part 1 Episode 253 #GrowQuince |Part 2 - The Harvest Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTube

Tasting Calvados with Étienne Dupont Étienne Dupont took over the Domaine Familial Etienne Dupont in the Pays d'Auge region of Normandy France from his father Louis and grandfather Jules in 1980. Episode 098: Jérôme Dupont | Domaine Dupont is a conversation with Étienne son who sadly passed away in 2018. The recording with Jérôme provides the backdrop of the story behind the Dupont families acquiring the estate or what is called a Domaine in France.  Eitenne Dupont and Benoit at Cave Pepins In this episode Étienne and I are in the city of Caen and we are visiting Cave Pepin - wonderful store filled with Calvados, Cider, Poire and Pommeau. We are assisted by Benoit or Ben who works at the store and brought us through a tasting of Calvados. Etienne begins by describing the Étienne's Notes Three Sources of Aroma in Calvados The fruit The Yeast The Cask in which the Calvados has been kept If the cask is new wood you will taste the sap which presents itself as grainy. Classical Calvados - the cask only contained cider and Calvados Étienne asks if we suspect acetone in the Calvados as we are tasting. During our first tasting we are delve into the taste and as Étienne says, “We are fighting the acetone, we are too professional” Étienne's Tips on Distillation of Cider He prefers a quick fermentation of 3 days and then distillation. But alas the rules in Normandy require that distillation now must be done 3 weeks from the point of initial distillation. Use clean apples. When Domaine Dupont presses the juice goes directly into concrete vats at the Pressoir and then it is pumped underground via tubing to the pot still. The cider is racked off the gross lees at this point, with only the fine lees being distilled His preferred temperature to ferment the cider is 22 to 23 degrees celsius (71 Fahrenheit) and no fermentation below 8 degrees Celsius (46 Fahrenheit). Determining Age of Calvados Fine is younger 2-3 years old Hors d'Age is at least 6 years old Étienne jokes that Hors d'Age which can range from 6 years to 20 is designed to get you lost. I agree and so best to ask the producer! Or as Étienne says that "You must rely on your palate." Contact for Cave Pepin I recommend following -  Cave Pepin's Facebook page Contact for Domaine Familial Etienne Dupont Website: https://www.calvados-dupont.com/en/ciders-calvados.htm Mentions in this chat Piotr Marzęcki of Polandski Read about Piotr ciders via Cider From Poland Fermentis yeast that Piotr uses for his ciders.  UCLM S325 Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTubeFermentis Q&A #13 Fermentis by Lesaffre -This week's Q&A with Kevin Lane from Fermentis: What are the sulfite additions effects on cider/yeast that you are planning to use? Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts.      

Grandma's Apple Orchard John Bunker, of Maine, Presents: Grandma’s Apple Orchard: the perfect orchard with only twelve trees. How did she do it? John is a Colby alumnus and was presented the 2019 Commissioner's Distinguished Service Award by Governor Janet Mills and Commissioner Amanda Beal for Saving Maine's Apple Heritage. He has also authored two books: Apples and the Art of Detection: Tracking Down, Identifying, and Preserving Rare Apples, and Not Far From the Tree--a Brief History of the Apples and the Orchards of Palermo Maine 1804-2004. The Palermo Community Library hosted this virtual presentation by John Bunker on Wednesday, February 24th 2021 and granted permission to Cider Chat to edit and repost this delightful presentation. Find the link to this the full Zoom presentation CLICK HERE  "The apples are longing to be planted in your yard. They want you to put down your roots with them here in your Community now When Dostoyevsky wrote about the renewal in the orchard, he talked about 100 years. That hundred years is now. He knew that he was speaking to us now, he meant us. We are it." Recommended websites presented during Grandma's Apple Orchard Out on the limb apples Maine Organic Farmers and Gardeners Association More chats with John Bunker on Cider Chat 016: John Bunker | Super Chilly Farm, Maine 028 John Bunker | Apple Identification Where to Start In humanities renewal, let the apple trees lead the way. Mentions in this chat Fermentis Q&A #12 Fermentis by Lesaffre -This week's Q&A with Kevin Lane from Fermentis: What is the reasoning behind adding adding Sulfites to the fresh pressed apple juice before fermentation? Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTube

Science Based Resource for Apple Identification Up to this point we've all been reliant upon drawings and descriptions from historical books and "those in the know" to identify specific apple varieties. Today, as you will see below, there is now an option to have an apple's parentage checked via the DNA. Apple Identification via Genetics has arrived! Cameron Peace PhD of Washington State University's presentation on "The Reconstruction of the Apple Family and other cider genetics". This video is synced with the power point presentation presented by Dr. Peace at Franklin County CiderDays 2019. Extra notes from Dr. Peace: Cost of DNA profiling to determine identity and/or parentage is currently $120 per tree (sorry). Your photos and background stories of each mystery tree to be tested are welcome and requested – I’m interested in learning about each tree and joining you in making discoveries. Please note that this is NOT a commercial service but rather a research opportunity. Besides genetics answers provided back to you, knowledge of public interest might be revealed such as filling of gaps in the cultivated apple family tree. DNA profiles of apple tree submissions (your name redacted) are added to a larger dataset (publicly accessible by scientists) and might be used as examples in future scientific presentations and studies. To obtain leaf sample collection instructions, please email me at cpeace@wsu.edu Heritage Orchard Conference For a recently recorded and complementary talk by Dr. Peace on “Apple Identification with DNA: Identity and Parentage Revelations using New Tools” and other great talks by heritage apple experts, please see the Heritage Orchard Conference webinar series based out of the University of Idaho. Here is one of the first webinar on the series. This one below is on Sleuthing for Lost Apples.   Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTube  

What is a Virtual Cidery?   A virtual cider is a cidery managed out of someone’s else’s cidery, or winery and in some cases a brewery. This week's featured guest is Ryan Monkman of FieldBird Cider in Prince Edward County Ontario. I met Ryan in 2018 and visited his Virtual Cidery host Keint-He Winery. The location was ideal being close to where Ryan lives making it very easy for him to manage the barrels of cider stored in the amazing underground barrel room. Ryan Monkman The arrangement or agreement is key to the success of this cidery model. Ryan discusses the following options to consider. The virtual maker (VM) does sales, while the host does packaging. The VM does everything. Virtual Makers must decide: How involved do you want to be? Benefits of the Virtual Cidery Model Low risk - you get to test your brand and product without having to set up a full brick and mortar site Low financial up front costs The VM and host have the potential to do collaborations. Selecting the right Virtual Host For Ryan, he found three key areas to consider People : Can you get along with the people who work there and the owner? Equipment: is the host site equipment going to meet the VM needs? Maintenance: If equipment breaks, can you wait till the host fixes it? Plan for unexpected costs - If the barrel steamer is broke, it is in everyone's best interest to get it fixed instead of waiting for the host who might be strapped for cash. Contact for FieldBird Cider and Ryan Monkman Website: https://fieldbird.ca/ Address: 1385 Highway 62 Prince Edward County, ON Mentions in this chat The Building a Cidery Series Part 1-7 255: Trademark Law | Building a Cidery Part 1 256 Securing a Trademark | Building a Cidery Part 2 257: Courthouse Creek Garagistes | Building a Cidery Part 3 258: Ragged Hill Design | Building a Cidery Part 4 259: Artifact Cityscape | Building a Cidery Part 5 260: Eris Brewery and Cider House | Building a Cidery Part 6 261: Yonder & The Source | Building a Cidery Part 7 Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTube

What is Yonder? Yonder Cider is made at the production facility in Wenatchee, Washington. Cider are made with both culinary and classic cider varieties that co-owner Caitlin Braam, who is our featured guest in this episode, says is key to the Yonder label.  Wenatchee is also the home of Snowdrift Cider Company where Tim Larsen is based and who also co-owns Yonder. Listen to episode 37  featuring Tim Larsen to learn more about his background and why this region of Washington state is so important the apple industry of the Pacific Northwest. Caitlin Braam What is The Source The Source is a separate business, but also based at the Wenatchee site. Sourcing juice is jargon widely used in the cider industry for makers needing to "source" juice from orchards to make cider. The Source provides both customized blends and apples to makers. The Source in Wenatchee The Future of Yonder The future looks bright despite the closing of the Yonder Bar on February 15, 2021. The garage bar for Yonder was set up in Caitlin's own garage in response to Covid. Despite the overwhelming support of neighbors, one anti cider fan was out to close the "garage bar" and the city finally conceded. Later this year (2021) a new Tasting Venue will be opening with ample outdoor seating. This new site is a collaboration with Bale Breaker Brewing and will be located in the Ballard Brewery District of Seattle, which is 15 minutes to the north of the Seattle Fish Market. Expect 6200 feet of outdoor space and a shared Tasting Room inside. Thinking out Yonder of the Box Because of licensing regulations, Caitlin had to secure the licensing for a distillery so that the Bale Breaker and Yonder project  could work. Contact Yonder Cider and The Source https://www.yondercider.com/ https://www.thesourcecider.com/ Mentions in this Chat Alma Cider and Beer Bar - 904 N. Virgil Ave. LA, CA Telephone323-522-3362 Fermentis by Lesaffre -This week's Q&A with Kevin Lane from Fermentis: Q: Which yeast should I use to expand the attributes of the cider Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTube

What is Eris? Eris is the name of the goddess of chaos. Her splendor in creating chaos is exactly why co-owners Michelle Foik and Katie Pizza named their craft beer and cider bar Eris, but there is more. Katie's "elevator pitch' for Eris tells it all saying, "Eris is a brewery, cider house and full service restaurant all under one roof in Chicago." Eris situated in the Howler Building The path to Eris Michelle and Katie began conceptualizing Eris back in 2014, though the actual name of the bar came about much later. It took four years before they could opened the door in February of 2018. The building itself was originally used as a Masonic Temple. Today, the cidery is situated in the basement, the brewery and restaurant on the first floor and the second floor is sighted to be a 200 person event space. There is also outdoor seating, which got a major boost when infrared heaters were added this past November, making the covid safe space super toasty even in the winter months! Katy Pizza and Michelle Foik Planning ahead What equipment feel out of favor? The cross flow filter is used to ensure that the cider stays stable on the shelf. Michelle found that it couldn't keep up with the flow of cider being canned. Tanks through the window What equipment did they get right? Building for the future by having a 30 barrel brewery and enough tank space in the cidery to avoid the need to scale up for a very long time. Both women noted that with the cidery in the basement they had only one shot to get the tanks in. To do so later would be impossible. That said, perhaps they could have gotten away with a smaller brewing system, but something tells this podcasters that in time they will be very happy to have the larger system in the long run. ] Summer Patio and now a winter patio too with infrared heaters outside at Eris Contact for Eris Brewery and Cider House Website: https://www.erischicago.com/story Address: 4240 W Irving Park Road, Chicago, IL 60641 Telephone: 773-943-6200 Mentions in this Chat Fermentis by Lesaffre -This week's Q&A with Kevin Lane from Fermentis: Q: I though Apples were filled with nutrients, so do I need to add nutrients to the ferment and if so which ones? Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving! Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. Listen also at iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher (for Android), iHeartRadio , Spotify and wherever you love to listen to podcasts. Follow on Cider Chat's blog, social media and podcast Twitter @ciderchat Instagram: @ciderchatciderville Cider Chat FaceBook Page Cider Chat YouTube