The Vertical Space

This episode marks a first for our podcast – it’s the first time that we recorded an episode in person, and we did it during the Honeywell Aerospace Second Annual Advanced Air Mobility Summit in Washington DC, where the three of us also shared insights on the industry in front of an impressive audience of government and industry leaders. One of the major themes of the Summit was the upcoming FAA Reauthorization, and so in light of that, we sat down with Dan Elwell – who previously served as the Acting FAA Administrator and also its Deputy Administrator – to do a deep dive into the FAA Reauthorization and other important industry topics. We start the conversation with the pilot shortage problem, the structural and cultural forces at play, and how technology can help solve it. The discussion surfaces the currently somewhat controversial topic of the role that simulators play in the “1,500 hour” rule. Listen to why Dan believes pilots should be allowed to accumulate even the entirety of the 1500hrs requirement in modern high tech simulators.Most of our conversation, however, takes us back to the roots and foundational principles of regulating aviation, including an overview of the evolution of the FAA mandate since its founding in 1958. Although not novel, the balance between ensuring safety and promoting the growth of the industry is more important today than it ever was before. We hover on this topic quite a bit and, among other things, draw analogies to how commercial space flights are regulated. Listen to what Dan thinks is one of the most important issues that the FAA needs to figure out, and how what he calls the 737 Max PTSD phenomenon and other factors create a chilling effect on the FAA workforce and their ability to be an effective regulator.

Welcome to our conversation with Damon Vander Lind, co-founder and CEO of Magpie Aviation, a company enabling long-range flights with zero emissions. Damon and Magpie are offering a solution that is fresh and new – a lot of you will be both fascinated by his vision and at the same time find reasons to challenge his assumptions – and you have to admire his bold approach to the market.  Listen to Damon's views on the evolution of advanced air mobility, of electric aviation, and the use-cases being addressed. Damon believes the industry needs solutions that address sustainability and carbon reduction – and that sustainability will become more essential in the years to come. He challenges and gives his perspectives on some of the current hopeful solutions for sustainability, including sustainable aviation fuel (SAF), which many of the airlines are betting on today.  There are those who will criticize some of today’s eVTOL companies for overstating the impact of their solution on the environment. With Magpie – and their promise of extended range – they have the opportunity to provide zero-carbon flights to longer range trips. So he’s all-in on sustainability – because customers will be paying a premium for the extended range, as well as some additional tradeoffs – and Magpie is betting the greater value of sustainability will offset the slightly higher price of his proposed solution.  So listen to this podcast for a number of reasons, listen: to one of the leading engineers talk about the evolution of the industry; to the different approaches to sustainable aviation and the electrification of the industry; to an informed person’s fresh perspective on AAM and the near-term value eVTOLs; and to Damon’s perspective on his proposed solution with Magpie Aviation.  Damon, thanks for joining us! 

Welcome to our conversation with Thomas Neubauer, Co-founder and CEO of Dimetor. We discuss connectivity using cellular networks and the intersection of cellular networks and aviation. Thomas discusses the requirement of having a pilot in command – and that you must have good, reliable digital communication to ensure connectivity – to fulfill this pilot in command requirement.We discuss how BVLOS operations are being enabled via cellular networks. It’s also interesting to hear about the gap between communications service providers and aviation ecosystems – why it’s relevant – and what can be done about it.We go in depth on the strengths, weaknesses, and risks of cellular for command and control – as well as other options that may be available in place of or to complement cellular.Thomas is the architect of Europe’s UTM interface standard – so he discusses the standard and why it was developed. He also discusses how a drone could be considered an IoT device, or Aerial IoT. Finally, we discuss Thomas’ company and product, AirborneRF, the problems they’re addressing, their customers, and how they generate revenue.Thanks for joining The Vertical Space Thomas!

Today we revisit the topic of batteries with Venkat Viswanathan,  Associate Professor of Mechanical Engineering at Carnegie Mellon University.  As someone who relatively recently started his journey in electric aviation, Venkat is massively inspired by the challenge and opportunity of electrifying aviation. We sat down to discuss why he is optimistic about 1,000 Wh/kg energy density at the battery pack level becoming commercially available in the next 10-15 years, a goal that many of his fellow battery experts find tough to believe. However, this is not a “boring” lesson in battery chemistry. We talked about what it takes to commercialize new battery chemistries and who will carry the burden of funding new R&D to improve battery energy and power densities now that there is no incentive to pursue such efforts by the automotive industry. Listen also how Venkat describes the AND problem, which stands for the challenge for batteries to achieve both high energy density and also high power density, and how hybrid batteries with different chemistries might help solve this challenge. We also talked about the differences between batteries for VTOL vs CTOL aircraft, about the different and sometimes conflicting requirements for different types of aircraft and missions, about innovation in non-destructive diagnostics to figure out power and energy remaining, and also about how generative AI can accelerate the development of new battery chemistries. 

Today we introduce the maritime world to AAM -  with a conversation with Billy Thalheimer, CEO and Co-Founder of Regent. We’ve been hearing such positive news about Regent – as I’m sure you’ve heard as well. But what makes Regent so darn attractive? They’re not just getting orders for their aircraft – as many are – but they’re getting firm orders.  First – Billy makes it clear that Regent is addressing a multi-modal coastal transportation opportunity – with a novel vehicle – the sea glider.  Listen to the use-case. The technology. The range with existing battery technologies – and why. But listen to the challenges that others don’t have as well. A terrific conversation around the maritime certification with the Coast Guard and other organizations around the world vs. the FAA and other aviation regulators. They’ve seemingly minimized some of the more obvious risks that others have in AAM – FAA certification, landing infrastructure, air traffic control and congestion, range for electric aviation, size of vehicle and its passenger comfort, and so on. Bill expresses skepticism on whether or not some of the current AAM vehicles will actually hit their projected timelines – given what they said they would accomplish 5 years ago – and what has accomplished since – and the herculean feats, as Billy says, that some of them have to pull off to meet their objectives. Love the gut punches. And, like many of our guests, Billy is thoughtful, smart, visionary and leader. Listen to his advice to other business leaders and innovators, what he learned from working as an intern with Jeff Bezos at Blue Origin, and how he leads his team today. And what technologies he thinks you should be focusing on. 

Our guest today is Brian Yutko, Chief Executive Officer at Wisk, a California-based advanced air mobility company developing a fully autonomous electric vertical takeoff and landing air taxi. “Demystifying autonomy” is a fitting title for the insightful and fascinating conversation we had with Brian. He thoughtfully argues that autonomous electric flight for small aircraft, the likes of Wisk’s eVTOL, will become a commercial reality much sooner than most people think, only a few years from now. Of course, when making such a bold statement that most would push back on, definitions and details matter, and in the case of Wisk, the concept of operations involves flying on an IFR flight plan in extremely controlled scenarios using very high levels of integrity and assurance in the underlying systems, both on-board and on the ground. Listen to Brian explain the state of technology as well as the systems engineering and product development standing in the way of this ambitious goal. We also discussed a few myths and misconceptions that exist in the industry, namely that the value of autonomy is in eliminating pilot cost, or that the future is either piloted or autonomous. This has been such an insights-packed conversation that it’s tough to summarize it. If you’re interested in autonomous flight, the systems architecture that will support it, certification pathways for autonomous flight, sustainable flight, or just what it’s like to build a business in advanced air mobility – you don’t want to miss this episode. 

Eric Allison, Joby's Head of Product, discusses Joby Aviation's focus on minimizing aircraft noise, market strategies, certification processes, autonomous operations, and pricing strategies. The conversation delves into the importance of intentional design for noise reduction in electric planes, challenges in urban air mobility, and the revolutionizing impact of air taxis on transportation systems.

An in-depth discussion on UTM with Chris Kucera, co-founder of OneSky, discussing the fascinating and complex world of UAS traffic management, or UTM.  UTM is a rapidly evolving area – it’s done differently throughout the world with various degrees of application and value. Listen to what UTM is, how its formulated, its value, when its needed, and when its not.  Those of you who can understand the complexity and value of UTM will not only be better equipped to deploy, realize value from, and invest in UTM providers, but will better operate your OEM and service businesses going forward. Listen to the importance of operators sharing information, including positional and surveillance information – and the integration and synthesis of this information, and how essential this information sharing is to an effective, safe system.  Listen to the different types of UTM service providers and how UTM is deployed and by whom – and how they’re deployed in the US and throughout the world, and an important discussion of the EU’s U-space.   We cover what data is needed for different parts of the UTM process where Chris explains the data, its source, value, and application.  It’s great hearing how OneSky started, it’s unique advantages, and how they expect to provide value and make money in the years to come.  We thank Chris for a terrific discussion! 

Welcome to our conversation with Svilen Rangelov, Co-Founder and CEO of Dronamics, a business with the goal to change how the world moves goods.We start with a discussion around the broader drone/UAS market and then the cargo drone delivery market – including use-cases and early demand, challenges and opportunities, and the overall landscape. Then we talk about Dronamics, the problems they’re solving for customers near and long term with their middle mile solutions. Listen to how Svilen believes they’ll be providing a better and less expensive solution than today’s alternatives, especially with their initial focus on underserved markets. We also discuss his challenges and opportunities and why middle mile vs. last mile solutions, where last mile are where many others are focused. We also discuss their vehicle, the Black Swan, and how they plan to be an OEM, an operator, and manager of droneports. Listen to the really interesting requirements and capabilities of the droneports, the costs and challenges, and how they believe these droneports are an essential part of their competitive advantage and customer value. Svilen also discusses his conversations with logistics companies and their focus on cost. We also discuss his work with European regulators and the regulatory approvals, including for design verification. Many thanks to Svilen and Dronamics for a substantial discussion!

Today’s topic is the exciting world of pilot training innovation, an area that has become a high priority to militaries and airlines around the world given the pilot shortage that the industry is grappling with.  Helping us examine this topic is Ryan Riley, a retired USAF F-16 fighter pilot who most recently led Pilot Training Next, an initiative that leveraged advanced training technologies and learning methods to cut the USAF pilot training in half. Ryan also currently happens to be going through training with a major U.S. airline which we also discuss in our conversation.  The USAF is short approximately 2,000 pilots, which is about a third more than its annual theoretical capacity to produce pilots. At the same time, major airlines are accelerating their pilot hiring and are signaling concern about insufficient pilot supply. This has sparked a wave of flight training innovation to solve two major pain points: training time and throughput. Ryan walked us through the current Air Force pilot training pipeline, what prompted urgency to revisit the decade old training formula, what innovations the Air Force experimented with, and what the outcomes were. We talked about the pros and cons of mixed reality and synthetic training, and the importance of student-centric and distributed learning in both military and civil training environments.Naturally, we also discussed the controversial topic of the 1,500 hour rule, the related hours versus competencies dilemma, single pilot operations, and then extrapolated the discussion to autonomous systems, and how novel concepts in flight training might help the industry think through building trust in autonomous wingmen or virtual copilots. And to stay true to our roots, Ryan highlights what remaining pain points exist for innovators to go and solve.Ryan recently retired from the USAF where he flew F-16s, both operationally as a fighter pilot with multiple combat deployments as well as a Thunderbird pilot. In addition to flying, Ryan’s career included a number of leadership roles including deputy division chief 19th Air Force, Chief of Offense at the 613 Air Operations Center, contingency and crisis action planner, Pacific Air Forces lead technology integrator, and most recently Detachment 24 Commander leading Pilot Training Next.