Sunday School Dropouts

This week on Sunday School Dropouts, we're joined by author Sarah Henn Hayward for an honest, insightful conversation about her journey from devout Christianity to agnostic atheism.Sarah, author of Giving Up God, opens up about her upbringing in the Evangelical Free Church and the slow, freeing path of deconstruction that followed. She reflects on purity culture, youth group experiences, and the internal conflicts that led her to start questioning her faith.We also talk about what it’s like to navigate relationships—especially marriage—when belief systems diverge. Sarah shares how she’s held onto values like love, humility, and generosity, even as her theology shifted. She offers a refreshing take on parenting, spirituality, and staying connected to a sense of wonder outside of religion.Learn more about Sarah and her work at sarahhennhayward.comOn Instagram she is: @shaywardwrites Buy Sarah’s book, “Giving Up God” anywhere where books are available! This podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at www.kevincrowe.co

The holidays are over and we are back into our purity culture mini-series! This month we are talking about purity culture and it’s impact on individuals who grew up male in this system. We are thrilled to have Dr. Bradley Onishi on the podcast today as our professional who has done research and client-facing work in this area as well as being a purity culture poster boy himself. Join Brad and Laura as they discuss the unique impacts of purity culture on men, shame, the expectations of being a “Godly man” and what happens when you don’t measure up to that, as well as the importance of men learning how to step out of of the prescribed roles and mentality that both purity culture and patriarchy prop up. Resources Mentioned: Fair Play (book and game) by Eve Rodsky Mild at Heart podcast series (can be found on the website below and using “Mild” in the search bar)Guest: Brad OnishiWebsite: https://www.straightwhiteamericanjesus.comInstagram/TT: @straightwhitejc This podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at  www.kevincrowe.co

We are thrilled to have with us today Dr. Tina Schermer Seller who is an author, researcher, professor, and psychotherapist specializing in the impacts of purity culture, shame resilience, gender, and sexuality. In this episode, Dr. Tina shares her research and how she came to realize the psychological and physiological impact of purity culture and how that shaped the direction of her work with clients, students, and her writing. In the episode, Dr. Tina shares an incredible definition of sexual shame (see below) that can help us understand the felt sense experience of purity culture! But before we talk to Dr. Tina, we have a vocabulary lesson on what are porn and sex addictions really and why religion is so quick to diagnoses people with them, and we’ll also be taking some prayer requests! This is an episode you won’t want to miss!Dr. Tina’s definition of sexual shame (taken from the dissertation of Noel Clarke): Sexual shame is a visceral feeling of humiliation and disgust toward one’s own body and identity as a sexual being and a belief of being abnormal, inferior and unworthy. this feeling can be internalized but also manifests in interpersonal relationships having a negative impact on trust, communication, and physical and emotional intimacy. Sexual shame develops across the lifespan in interactions with interpersonal relationships, one’s culture and society, and subsequent critical self-appraisal (a continuous feedback loop). There is also a fear and uncertainty related to one’s power or right to make decisions, including safety decisions, related to sexual encounters, along with an internalized judgement toward one’s own sexual desire. You can find Dr. Tina at: Instagram: @drtinashameless  Facebook: @TinaSSellers Twitter: @TinaSSellersWebsite: https://www.tinaschermersellers.comPsychedelic assisted psychotherapy: www.Inannarising.org Dr. Tina’s Books:Sex, God, and the Conservative ChurchShameless Parenting – Everything You Need to Raise Shame-free, Confident, Kids and Heal Your Shame TooThis podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at  www.kevincrowe.co

In this episode of Sunday School Dropouts, Andrew Pledger opens up about his journey growing up in the Independent Fundamental Baptist (IFB) movement and the lasting effects of religious trauma on his mental health, sexuality, and sense of identity. He shares his experiences navigating legalism, spiritual abuse, and the pressure to conform, including his time at Bob Jones University and the emotional toll of leaving such a high-control environment. Andrew discusses the coping mechanisms he developed, such as dissociation, and how creativity, storytelling, and community have played a vital role in his healing. Through vulnerability and reflection, he offers encouragement to others seeking freedom, self-acceptance, and authentic love beyond oppressive systems.This podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at  www.kevincrowe.co

Today we are joined by Andrew Pledger to talk about the financial burden that going to a religious college/university can cause. We get into not only the cost of these institutions but the extended control they have over all aspects of someone’s life, even when it’s the time in life where you’re developmentally ready to have more freedom. Andrew shares his story with us about how he chose to go to Bob Jones University, what was required when he got there, the rules he had to follow and the financial consequences he had when he didn’t follow the rules. To follow Andrew or learn more about his work, go to: @andrewpledgerwrites on Instagram Check out his podcast series “Surviving Bob Jones University” wherever you listen to podcasts!All of Andrew’s links and projects can be found hereTo learn more about the support groups offered at the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery or to sign up, click hereThis podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at kevincrowe.co

In this conversation, Zach Anderson shares his journey of growing up in the Mormon Church, navigating his identity as a gay man, and the impact of high control religions on mental health and body image. He discusses his process of resigning from the church, the challenges of coming out, and how these experiences shaped his approach to nutrition coaching.The conversation also explores the intersections of purity culture, diet culture, and the nuances of intuitive eating, emphasizing the importance of self-acceptance and healing from trauma. In this conversation, Zach Anderson discusses the importance of nutrition, the impact of metabolic adaptation, and the psychological barriers many face regarding food.He emphasizes the need to break free from scarcity mindsets and perfectionism, particularly in the context of fundamentalist beliefs. The discussion also touches on the long-term effects of food restrictions and the importance of self-compassion in the journey of healing and growth. Zach shares insights on how to navigate rigidity in beliefs about food and body image, ultimately aiming to foster a healthier relationship with nutrition and oneself.Connect with Zach:IG: @motionsustainedWebsite: motionsustained.comFind out  more about working with Zach on his Kate Lyman webpageTo learn more about the support groups offered at the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery or to sign up, click hereThis podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at  kevincrowe.co

Now more than ever, many of us are having to navigate relationships with family members and friends who are grappling with choosing relationships with people over their belief/doctrines. Perhaps you are wrestling through that too? We are revisiting one of our favorite episodes with guests Beecher and April who share with us their own story of choosing relationship with each other over rigid theology and doctrine. Also, the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery is offering their spring support groups! Whether it’s learning boundaries, how to navigate family members, deconstructing common issues post-religion, healing from toxic religion, embodying pleasure and safety after high control religion, or getting in touch with your inner child, we have support for you! To learn more about the support groups offered at the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery or to sign up, click here This podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at  www.kevincrowe.co

Today we are excited to have Dr. Celeste Holbrook on the podcast! Celeste is a sex educator, author, speaker, and sexologist with her own story of healing after purity culture. She uses her personal experiences to inspire her professional work and helps folks untangle the long-lasting, embodied impacts of the messages they were taught about their bodies, sex, and pleasure. Today we are talking about all the sex education your Sunday school teachers never taught you! Connect with Celeste!Website: www.drcelesteholbrook.com Instagram: @drcelesteholbrookThis podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at  www.kevincrowe.co

In this episode of Sunday School Dropouts, Rikki Herbst shares her journey of leaving the Orthodox Jewish community in New York. She reflects on growing up in a tightly knit, insular environment and the emotional challenges of stepping away. Drawing parallels to other religious exits—like evangelicalism—she explores the complexities of reclaiming autonomy and finding support. As a therapist, Rikki offers insights on religious trauma from both personal and professional perspectives.You’re listening to Sunday School DropoutsBoth of us grew up in high control religion and spent years trying to live up to the rules and standards until one day, we couldn’t do it anymore. We spent our lives aspiring to be true followers of God and all we got from it was religious trauma.So now, we’re taking our lived experiences along with our education, training, and work with clients to create this podcast–a podcast that goes beyond deconstruction and focuses on the unique aspects healing and recovery for folks coming out of high control religions, cults, fundamentalism, purity culture and those with religious trauma. Each episode we’ll be talking with other experts, mental health practitioners, coaches, advocates, therapists and folks who have survived fundamentalist systems, to learn from their experiences and offer resources and support for healing. This podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.comAnd before we get started, it’s important for you to know that: The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and REcovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.We are not anti-religion but we are anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. We are two individuals using our academic backgrounds and training and personal experiences to provide a safe and supportive space for those recovering from fundamentalist groups and systems.If you’re interested in finding a trauma-informed practitioner, go to https://www.traumaresolutionandrecovery.com to schedule your free inquiry call with a practitioner of your choice.Follow us on Instagram:https://www.instagram.com/traumaresolutionandrecoveryhttps://www.instagram.com/deconstruct_everythinghttps://www.instagram.com/drlauraeandersonYou can also find Laura at https://www.drlauraeanderson.com.

This week we are excited to be joined by Dr. Eric Sprankle (@drsprankle on Instagram). Dr. Sprankle is a clinical psychologist and professor of human sexuality and author of the recently released: “DIY: The Wonderfully Weird History and Science of Masturbation”. He’s joining us today to talk about what a porn addiction *actually* is (hint, it’s not what religion teaches us!), our innate sexuality, and how it’s the messages around sexuality, porn, and masturbation that creates the guilt, shame, and other negative responses…not the acts themselves. It’s a great episode for all of those post-purity culture folks who weren’t taught about healthy sexuality and sexual development! Connect with Dr. Eric SprankleWebsite: https://www.drsprankle.com/ Social Media: @drsprankle Buy his new book! DIY: The Wonderfully Weird History and Science of MasturbationThis podcast is brought to you by the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery: an online trauma coaching company whose practitioners are trauma informed and trauma trained to work with individuals, couples and families who have experienced high control religion, cults, and religious trauma. For more information on the support that CTRR provides, for resources–including courses, workshops, and more–head to traumaresolutionandrecovery.com or follow us on Instagram: @traumaresolutionandrecovery The views and opinions expressed by Sunday School Dropouts are those of the hosts and not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Center for Trauma Resolution and Recovery. Any of the content provided by our guests, sponsors, authors, or bloggers are their own ideas and opinions.The Sunday School Dropouts podcast is not anti-religion but it is anti -harm, -power and control, -oppression and, -abuse and will speak to the harmful practices and messaging of fundamentalist groups. Follow Andrew on Instagram and TikTok @deconstruct_everything Follow Laura on Instagram and TikTok @drlauraeanderson or on her website: www.drlauraeanderson.com Hosts: Laura Anderson and Andrew KerbsMusic by Benjamin Faye Music @heytherebenji Editing and Production by Kevin Crowe and can be found at  kevincrowe.co