ASPI Podcast: Policy, Guns & Money
The Australian Strategic Policy Institute
Policy, Guns & Money is produced by the Australian Strategic Policy Institute (ASPI).
ASPI is an independent, non-partisan think tank that produces expert and timely advice for strategic and defence leaders. ASPI has offices in Canberra, Australia and Washington DC, USA.
ASPI is an independent, non-partisan think tank that produces expert and timely advice for strategic and defence leaders. ASPI has offices in Canberra, Australia and Washington DC, USA.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Nov 6, 2020 • 45min
Climate investment and renewable energy, Australia’s submarines – your questions answered
Anastasia Kapetas, National Security Editor at The Strategist speaks to Emma Herd, CEO of the Investor Group on Climate Change about the ‘Climate League 2030’ initiative, a private-sector focused initiative with the goal of deeper emissions reductions for Australia. They also discuss climate investment and the significant rise in renewable energy investments.
Peter Jennings speaks to Professor James Goldrick, Adjunct Professor at UNSW with over 35 years’ service in the Royal Australian Navy. They discuss ASPI’s recently launched report ‘Submarines: Your questions answered’ and explain the complexities of Australia’s submarine program.
Mentioned in this episode:
‘Submarines: Your questions answered’ report: https://www.aspi.org.au/report/submarines-your-questions-answered
Climate League 2030 initiative: https://igcc.org.au/new-ten-year-private-sector-focused-initiative-launched-to-back-deeper-australian-emissions-reductions/
Guests:
Anastasia Kapetas: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/anastasia-kapetas
Emma Herd: https://igcc.org.au/team/emma-herd/
Peter Jennings: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/peter-jennings
James Goldrick: https://www.unsw.adfa.edu.au/our-people/professor-james-goldrick
Credits: Music: "Blurry Vision" by Corbyn Kites via the You Tube Audio Library. Image: NeedPix.com

Oct 30, 2020 • 45min
Special Episode: Cultural destruction and detention facilities in Xinjiang
In this podcast special, Anastasia Kapetas speaks to some of the team behind ASPI’s research on Xinjiang about their recently launched Xinjiang Data Project and the potential global implications of China’s treatment of the Uyghurs in Xinjiang.
ASPI’s Kelsey Munro and Nathan Ruser, and James Leibold, Senior ASPI Fellow and Head of Department of Politics, Media & Philosophy at La Trobe University discuss their research which extensively mapped out 380 detention facilities in Xinjiang that have been built or expanded on since 2017.
They also talk about their research on cultural erasure in Xinjiang which traced the destruction of mosques and other significant Uyghur cultural sites in the region and estimated that 16,000 mosques have been destroyed or damaged since 2017.
Mentioned in this episode:
Xinjiang Data Project: https://xjdp.aspi.org.au/
‘Cultural erasure’ report: https://www.aspi.org.au/report/cultural-erasure
Guests:
Anastasia Kapetas: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/anastasia-kapetas
Kelsey Munro: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/kelsey-munro
James Leibold: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/james-leibold
Nathan Ruser: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/nathan-ruser
Music: "Allegro" by Emmit Fenn, via the YouTube Audio Library.

Oct 23, 2020 • 43min
The Cost of Defence, terrorism in France, and social licence and policing.
This week on Policy, Guns and Money, Michael Shoebridge talks to Dr. Marcus Hellyer about his latest report "The cost of Defence - Part 2". They examine the recent government budget announcements and how they align with the 2020 Defence Strategic Update.
Leanne Close, Head of ASPI’s Counterterrorism Program, explores the trends of counterterrorism throughout Covid-19 in light of the recent attack in France, in conversation with The Strategist’s Brendan Nicholson.
Also in this episode, John Coyne, Head of ASPI’s Policing Program, talks to Vern White, former Canadian Senator and Police Commissioner about the impact of Covid-19 on social licence and policing and the lessons learned in Victoria.
Referenced in this episode:
The Cost of Defence:
- Part 1: https://www.aspi.org.au/report/cost-defence-2020-2021-part-1-aspi-2020-strategic-update-brief
- Part 2: https://www.aspi.org.au/report/cost-defence-2020-2021-part-2-aspi-defence-budget-brief
Michael Shoebridge: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/michael-shoebridge
Dr. Marcus Hellyer: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/marcus-hellyer
Leanne Close: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/leanne-close
Brendan Nicholson: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/brendan-nicholson
John Coyne: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/john-coyne
Vern White: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/vern-white
Background music: "Average" by Dramatic - via the You Tube Audio Library.

Oct 16, 2020 • 40min
Reflections on After Covid-19 Vol 2
In this weeks episode of Policy, Guns and Money, we speak with some of the authors of ASPI's 'After Covid vol 2' publication. Included are discussions on Soft power, the EU’s approach to China and Australia’s relations with Southeast Asia.
Lisa Sharland and Professor Caitlin Byrne, Director of the Griffith Asia Institute discuss how soft power is being used by the US and China, and opportunities for middle and small powers to utilise soft power in multilateral settings.
Bart Hogeveen speaks to research interns Alexandra Pascoe and Daria Impiombato about the EU’s approach to China and where the opportunities lie for greater cooperation between Australia and the EU on approaches towards China.
Emily French speaks to Dr Huong Le Thu about the impacts of Covid-19 in Southeast Asia and regional unity, and whether the region will align more closely with Australia as a result of the pandemic.
Mentioned in this episode:
https://www.aspi.org.au/report/after-covid-19-australia-region-and-multilateralism-volume-2
Guests:
Lisa Sharland: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/lisa-sharland
Professor Caitlin Byrne: https://experts.griffith.edu.au/18608-caitlin-byrne
Dr Huong Le Thu: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/huong-le-thu
Bart Hogeveen: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/bart-hogeveen
Alexandra Pascoe: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/alexandra-pascoe
Daria Impiombato: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/daria-impiombato
Emily French: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/emily-french
Background music: "Sprint Thaw" by Asher Fulero - via the YouTube Audio Library.

Oct 12, 2020 • 38min
US elections, Germany’s Indo-Pacific Strategy & social media in the Azerbaijan-Armenia conflict
In this week's episode of Policy, Guns & Money; Brendan Nicholson and Anastasia Kapetas discuss the upcoming US elections, the chances of President Trump being re-elected and the potential impacts of social media on the elections.
Dr Huong Le Thu is joined by Ms Petra Sigmund, Director-General for East Asia, Southeast Asia and the Pacific at the German Federal Foreign Office to discuss Germany’s recently launched Indo-Pacific Strategy, how it was developed and how it will shape Germany’s future engagement in the Indo-Pacific region.
Elise Thomas and Research Intern Albert Zhang discuss their report ‘Snapshot of a shadow war’ which looks at the social media elements of the Armenia and Azerbaijan conflict and the battle on social media for control of the international narrative about the conflict.
Mentioned in this episode:
https://www.aspi.org.au/report/snapshot-shadow-war
https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/en/aussenpolitik/regionaleschwerpunkte/asien/german-government-policy-guidelines-indo-pacific/2380510
Guests:
Brendan Nicholson: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/brendan-nicholson
Anastasia Kapetas: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/anastasia-kapetas
Dr Huong Le Thu: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/huong-le-thu
Petra Sigmund: @GERonAsia (Twitter)
Elise Thomas: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/elise-thomas
Albert Zhang: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/albert-zhang
Image: via WikiMedia: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:2004_US_elections_map_electoral_votes.png
Background music: "BeeyornandRaysd" by 'Noir Et Blanc Vie', via the You Tube Audio Library.

Oct 2, 2020 • 41min
Climate & national security. A secure 5G ecosystem. The North Queensland Defence Strategy
In this episode of Policy, Guns & Money, Dr Robert Glasser and Anastasia Kapetas discuss climate change and national security in the first conversation in our new ongoing series that will put climate change front and center in the national security debate.
Tom Uren speaks with ASPI Fellow Rajiv Shah about his recent report ‘Ensuring a trusted 5G ecosystem of vendors and technology’. They discuss the importance of setting international standards and the need to encourage network providers to use multiple vendors to ensure a secure 5G network.
John Coyne speaks to David Burke, Defence Engagement Officer at the Townsville City Council, about the Townsville North Queensland Defence Strategy which was released earlier this year. David tells us a little about the Council’s strategy and how it came about.
Mentioned in this episode: https://www.aspi.org.au/report/ensuring-trusted-5g-ecosystem-vendors-and-technology
Guests:
Dr Robert Glasser: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/robert-glasser
Anastasia Kapetas: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/anastasia-kapetas
Tom Uren: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/tom-uren
Rajiv Shah: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/rajiv-shah
Dr John Coyne: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/john-coyne
David Burke.
Music: "Pluckandplay" by 'Kwon' via the You Tube Audio Library.
Image: "Broken Hill solar plant" by Jeremy Buckingham via WikiMedia: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Broken_Hill_solar_plant_aerial.jpg

Sep 21, 2020 • 42min
Special Episode: 75th United Nations General Assembly
Leaders Week kicks off this week with a High-level Meeting on Monday commemorating the 75th Anniversary of the United Nations under the theme ‘The future we want, the United Nations we need: reaffirming our collective commitment to multilateralism.’ To mark this occasion, ASPI has produced this podcast episode and with special guests to discuss the importance and relevance of the United Nations at 75.
Lisa Sharland speaks with Australia’s Ambassador and Permanent Representative to the United Nations Mitch Fifield about what Leaders Week will look like this year and Australia’s priorities in the 75th UN General Assembly. The Ambassador also offers some anecdotes from his time in the post so far.
Brendan Nicholson speaks to Dr Marty Natalegawa, Indonesia’s former Minister for Foreign Affairs and former Permanent Representative to the UN, and current member of the UN Secretary-General’s Advisory Board on Disarmament. They discuss the importance of the UN as countries are increasingly inward-focused and how the UN can maintain relevance and better reflect the current global power dynamics.
Genevieve Feely chats with Dr Courtney Fung, Assistant Professor at the University of Hong Kong and Associate Fellow with the Chatham House Asia-Pacific Programme. They discuss the potential challenges of a virtual UN General Assembly, the increased competition for senior positions at the UN and opportunities for reform.
In this episode:
Lisa Sharland: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/lisa-sharland
Ambassador Mitch Fifield: https://usa.embassy.gov.au/our-people/ambassador-and-permanent-representative-united-nations-new-york
Brendan Nicholson: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/brendan-nicholson
Dr Marty Natalegawa: https://peacemaker.un.org/node/3044
Genevieve Feely: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/genevieve-feely
Dr Courtney Fung: https://www.courtneyfung.com/bio
Background music: "QuangerineCream" by Noir Et Blanc Vie, via the You Tube Audio Library.

Sep 18, 2020 • 36min
Right-wing extremism and conspiracies, recovering from Covid-19 and ASEAN meetings
In this episode of Policy, Guns and Money, Leanne Close and Elise Thomas discuss right-wing extremism, conspiracy theories and some of the different groups of conspiracy theorists. They consider the responses from social media companies and offer suggestions on how governments should respond to these growing challenges.
Brendan Nicholson and Michael Shoebridge discuss Volume Two of ASPI’s After Covid-19 report series which focuses on Australia, the region and multilateralism and offers policy recommendations on how Australia and its neighbours can recover from Covid-19.
Research intern Alexandra Pascoe chatted with Dr Huong Le Thu about some of the key outcomes from the recent ASEAN Foreign Ministerial Meetings and ASEAN Regional Forum, including the focus on Covid-19 and the South China Sea in the discussions.
Mentioned in this episode:
After Covid-19 Volume 2: https://www.aspi.org.au/report/after-covid-19-australia-region-and-multilateralism-volume-2
Guests:
Leanne Close: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/leanne-close
Elise Thomas: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/elise-thomas
Brendan Nicholson: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/brendan-nicholson
Michael Shoebridge: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/michael-shoebridge
Dr Huong Le Thu: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/huong-le-thu
Alexandra Pascoe: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/alexandra-pascoe
Background Music: "Plaidness" by Francis Preve, via the You Tube Audio Library.

Sep 11, 2020 • 40min
India's maritime power, Challenges of journalism in China & TikTok Censorship
In this episode of Policy, Guns and Money, Michael Shoebridge speaks with Darshana Baruah, Non-resident scholar at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. They discuss India's Navy and maritime goals, the Quad and Australia-India relations.
Peter Jennings and Brendan Nicholson consider the return of Australian journalists Bill Birtles and Mike Smith from China and the general state of the Australia - China relationship.
Authors Fergus Ryan and Daria Impiombato speak to Tom Uren about their recent report into censorship on TikTok and WeChat.
Report:
https://www.aspi.org.au/report/tiktok-wechat
People:
Peter Jennings: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/peter-jennings
Brendan Nicholson: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/brendan-nicholson
Michael Shoebridge: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/michael-shoebridge
Darshana Baruah: https://carnegieindia.org/experts/1253
Fergus Ryan: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/fergus-ryan
Daria Impiombato: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/daria-impiombato
Tom Uren: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/tom-uren
Background music: "RhythmOrganyzer" by 'Noir Et Blanc Vie' via the YouTube Audio Library.

Sep 4, 2020 • 34min
Fuel Security, the Australia - China relationship and Coercive Diplomacy research
In this episode of Policy, Guns & Money; Brendan Nicholson, Anastasia Kapetas and Jack Norton of ASPI's 'The Strategist' discuss some of the latest movements in the vexed Australia - China relationship. Michael Shoebridge and John Coyne consider the ongoing issue of improving Fuel Security for Australia and our allies and Emilia Currey and Tracy Beattie talk to Olivia Nelson about the findings of their recently released report: "The Chinese Communist Party’s coercive diplomacy".
Report:
https://www.aspi.org.au/report/chinese-communist-partys-coercive-diplomacy
People:
Brendan Nicholson: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/brendan-nicholson
Anastasia Kapetas: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/anastasia-kapetas
Jack Norton: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/jack-norton
Michael Shoebridge: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/michael-shoebridge
Dr John Coyne: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/john-coyne
Emilia Currey: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/emilia-currey
Tracy Beattie: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/tracy-beattie
Olivia Nelson: https://www.aspi.org.au/bio/olivia-nelson
Background Music: "Into It" by 'Kwon' via the You Tube Audio Library.
Cover Image: © Commonwealth of Australia: "A Royal Australian Air Force KC-30A Multi-Role Tanker Transport A39-005 aircraft conducts an air-to-air refuelling serial with two F/A-18A Hornets during the Regional Presence Deployment."


