Agile and Project Management - DrunkenPM Radio

Andrew Stellman and Jenny Green are back with a new book “Head First Agile: A Brain Friendly Guide to Agile and the PMI-ACP Certification”, which offers a strong foundational understanding in the most widely used Agile practices. The book is also intended as a PMI-ACP Exam preparation resource, providing complete coverage of the material included on the certification exam. In this podcast, Jenny and Andrew explain why they wrote the book, how PMI-ACP has evolved and why reaching a level where you are no longer concerned about the tools you use to get work done are traditional or agile is a great place to be. SHOW NOTES 01:19 Interview Begins 01:50 Background on Jenny and Andrew 03:30 Who the book IS NOT for 04:48 Who is book IS for and how it can help you move beyond simply going through the motions 06:29 The debate over principles vs. practices and it has impacted Andrew and Jenny’s approach 11:55 If you are new to Agile of have no experience working with Agile practices, how can this book help? 14:32 Why PMI-ACP prep is the secondary goal of this book. (And what the primary goal is.) 16:05 How the PMI-ACP exam has evolved and how Jenny and Andrew approached the topics for this book 19:23 How the authors ensured the book covers 100% of the material included on the PMI-ACP exam 20:21 Is is harder for a PMP to learn Agile, or harder for an Agilist to learn traditional Project Management? 21:40 Reaching the “Ri” level of project management where Agile vs. Waterfall is no longer a concern 22:43 Agile has moved beyond software, even reaching into construction, and how the is impacting PMI’s approach to Agile 24:46 Agile and the PMO: Is the PMO a dead man walking? 26:10 Scaling Agile is large organizations 27:44 What is the most dynamic/challenging area of Agile that we need to pay attention to? 28:29 Getting in touch with Andrew and Jenny THE BOOK You can find “Head First Agile: A Brain Friendly Guide to Agile and the PMI-ACP Certification” here: https://www.amazon.com/Head-First-Agile/dp/1449314333/ CONTACTING ANDREW AND JENNY If you’d like to reach Jenny and Andrew, here is how to find them: Their Website: https://www.stellman-greene.com Andrew on Twitter: ‎https://twitter.com/AndrewStellman Jenny on Twitter: https://twitter.com/jennygreene

In preparing for my How to Hack Agile for Digital Agencies at the 2017 Digital PM Summit I did a lot of research and conducted a lot of interview. This conversation, with Lance Hammond and Robert Sfeir from HUGE Atlanta was the last one I did before the Summit. During this discussion Lance and Robert share many of the lessons they’ve learned in bringing Agile to HUGE and they provide clarity on what it takes to make Agile work in a Digital Agency. SHOW NOTES 00:08 Podcast Begins 01:42 Some background on Robert and Lance 03:17 How long HUGE has been working on introducing Agile 04:40 Resistance from Design when switching to an Agile approach 06:08 Why Kanban may be a better approach for Design 07:39 How the Designers at HUGE approach their work without having all the requirements up front 09:30 Establishing Vision up front with the client and prioritizing options with them 10:33 The client needs to own the delivery from the very beginning and become part of the process 11:50 Making the client your partner in the workflow and decision making process 14:17 Why teaching the client how to work in Agile has to be an accepted cost 16:07 Why those with experience in Agile transformation can be so beneficial for Digital Agencies and what you need to watch out for 17:52 Changing how the work gets funded 20:22 How to change your Statement of Work to support Agile practices 21:47 Tips for convincing your client to want to use Agile to manage the work 24:11 Caring and feeding of the client during an Agile project at a Digital Agency 27:53 Should you include the client in the retrospective? 28:46 Do you need to have cross-functional, stable teams that are each working on only one project? 32:04 How long did it take HUGE to get to stable teams 34:02 Use Lean metrics to find and remove waste 34:20 How critical is it to move to a retainer (fund the team) model 35:30 You have to know why you want Agile, which approach you’ll take, and what you want from it 37:05 Scrum may have you thrashing for a bit before you switch to Kanban… and there is value in that 37:49 Why you need to switch the entire Digital Agency over to an Agile approach (including sales) 39:22: What is the hardest part about implementing/working with Agile in a Digital Agency 42:32 Defining what you are willing (and not willing) to try changing, when you switch to an Agile approach 44:30 How HUGE approaches estimating work 48:40 Why it is so important to watch and learn (inspect) before you start trying to change things (adapt) 50:45 Why Robert and Lance do not believe Scrum can work in a Digital Agency that wants Agile, but why you need to try it first to unlock the value of Kanban 53:00 Contacting Lance and Robert 54:06 Podcast Ends LINKS FROM THE PODCAST HUGE http://www.hugeinc.com/ Agile in Digital Agencies - Dave and Lance from the Atlanta Scrum User Group Meeting https://www.pscp.tv/leadingagile/1YqxomWqrwMGv (there is some static that persists until the interview begins at about 1 minute in) CONTACTING LANCE Twitter: https://twitter.com/lance5684 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lance-hammond-7288914/ CONTACTING ROBERT Twitter: https://twitter.com/robertsfeir LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robertsfeir/

In this interview Agile Alliance Board Member Declan Whelan makes the case for reframing Technical Debt and having organizations develop practices and programs supporting Technical Health. During the interview we discuss what technical debt it, how our perception of it has evolved and why taking a more positive and proactive stance for it can be so beneficial for organizations that are trying to improve flow and remain competitive in the marketplace. Declan also shares details on the Agile Alliance’s OnAgile 2017 virtual conference which is taking place on October 25, 2017. SHOW NOTES 00:09 Interview Begins 00:36 Background on Declan 02:35 What is Technical Debt? 03:55 How the definition of Technical Debt has evolved 05:11 Impediments to flow 06:15 Why it makes sense to think of Technical Debt as Technical Health 09:42 How does technical debt happen? 11:15 The environment (or system) may be set up to support increased technical debt 13:12 Explaining to management why technical wellness is so important 14:26 Measuring technical health (and debt) 15:58 Explaining the debt in dollars and showing the value of investing in technical health 16:22 How much faster could you go? 17:25 Why Declan enjoys legacy code and why some folks get frustrated with it 19:00 Finding the right people to work on it 20:16 Should technical debt go in the Product Backlog? 20:55 Employing the Boy Scout rule 24:25 Does Leadership and the PMO understand the importance of dealing with technical debt? 26:00 How the PMO can have a positive impact on technical wellness 30:55 OnAgile 2017 - the Online Conference (10/25) 30:04 What is Psychlomatic Complexity? 34:16 The things in Agile that Declan is focusing on learning about 36:00 Contacting Declan OnAgile 2017 http://bit.ly/2i3G0f6 CONTACTING DECLAN Leanintuit http://leanintuit.com Twitter https://twitter.com/dwhelan LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/declanwhelan/ Agile Alliance https://www.agilealliance.org/

Bob Tarne provides an overview of his upcoming PMI Global Congress presentation "Agile and Design Thinking, the Perfect Pairing for a Successful Project". Bob is a seasoned Project Management Professional whose work focuses primarily on helping organizations refine their approach to Agile. In this interview Bob explain what Design Thinking is and how it fits with Agile. He also talks about the book "How Successful Organizations Implement Change" which he contributed a chapter to. And the book "Project Managers at Work" by Bruce Harpham, which features a chapter all about Bob. During the interview Bob also shares details on the upcoming P2P Conference which will be taking place in Egypt on December 9-10. If you are attending the PMI Global Congress and would like to check out Bob's session: Agile and Design Thinking, the Perfect Pairing for a Successful Project Monday, October 30 8:30 AM to 10 AM http://sched.co/BKKk The book “How Successful Organizations Implement Change” which was put together by Emad Aziz, is available here: http://amzn.to/2ym38ia The book "Project Managers at Work" by Bruce Harpham can be found here: http://amzn.to/2ygxaVq The P2P Conference is being held on December 9-10 in Cairo, Egypt (link will be posted soon) If you'd like to contact Bob directly, here is how to reach him: http://twitter.com/btarne http://zen-pm.blogspot.com

In this episode o DrunkenPM Radio, Digital PM Summit co-founder, Brett Harned, talks about his new book “Project Management for Humans”, the upcoming (and 5th annual) Digital PM Summit and the new podcast he’s been working on. Show Notes 00:08 Interview Starts 00:37 Who is the book for? 02:44 What are the pieces that are missing we teach people how to be project managers? 04:25 The project manager is more than just a box checker. But how technical do they have to be? 08:04 What is Brett’s ideal version of the job of a project manager 11:18 What is the biggest misconception that new PMs have about the job when they first get started? 12:30 What is the thing about the job of being a PM that keeps Brett motivated even on the days that totally suck 15:19 What is the Digital PM Summit and why did they put it together in the first place? 17:52 Why the Bureau of Digital’s events are so focused on community 19:21 Sharing and debating… and why it is different in Digital PM than in traditional PM 21:20 Details on the Digital PM Summit and Brett’s workshop right after the conference 21:44 How to get tickets to the conference after registration closes on September 30th 22:17 Following the event online if you can’t make it 23:31 Brett’s new podcast Sprints and Milestones (URL to be posted later) 25:04 Getting in touch with Brett directly 25:24 Hacking Agile at the DPM Summit 25:32 Special events happening at the conference 26:30 Interview ends Brett’s book Project Management for Humans Publisher http://bit.ly/2fGmpAI Amazon: http://amzn.to/2yUlEMQ For more on the 2017 Digital Pm Summit Web: http://bureauofdigital.com/summits/digital-pm-2017/ Email: dpm@bureauofdigital.com Twitter Hashtag: #dpm2017 To contact Brett directly Web: http://brettharned.com Email: brett@brettharned.com Twitter: https://twitter.com/brettharned

In this podcast Michael de la Maza and Dhaval Panchal talk about their new book “Agile Coaching: Wisdom from Practitioners”. Michael and Dhaval are the co-editors of the book which is full of stories, tips, and advice from experienced, Agile coaches and trainers. In addition to talking about the book, Michael and Dhaval also share their own thoughts on topics around coaching and they offer advice for those who are headed down the coaching path. SHOW NOTES 01:28 Podcast Begins 02:01 Who is the book for 02:26 What misconceptions do clients have when an Agile coach walks in the door 03:52 How do you provide coaching in an organization that is not ready for it 05:04 How do you (as a coach) coach yourself when you are trying to work with individuals that do not want your help 07:12 Some tips for getting started with a coaching engagement 10:27 What does it take to become an Agile coach 13:17 What is the job of an Agile coach 13:53 When the client wants to pay large sums for you to MAKE them agile 19:06 When will we evolve past waterfall? 23:41 Do you have to be an expert in Agile to be a good coach? What do you need to do before you can be qualified to be a coach? 29:01 Are there people who should not be coaches? 32:05 Getting in touch with Michael and Dhaval THE BOOK Agile Coaching: Wisdom From Practitioners http://amzn.to/2fEV31F TO CONTACT MICHAEL Michael Email: michael.delamaza@gmail.com Michael Twitter: https://twitter.com/hearthealthyscr TO CONTACT DHAVAL LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dhavalpanchal/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/dhavalpanchal

Edward Kay, the Founder of Tall Projects, has been managing software and digital projects for over 14 years. A few months ago Edward posted an article on The Digital Project Manager called “Agency Agile: 10 Agile Methods for Agencies”. In this interview, Edward and I discuss his article, some of the key things you need to do in order to get agile to work in digital, and why Scrum may be the one thing that just won’t work in an agency model. 04:04 - Interview Begins 04:48 - Background on Edward and Tall Projects 05:55 - How Edward got started doing agile 06:31 - How Edward’s clients develop a desire to try Agile 09:11 - Are the clients who want to “Go Agile” aware of what that will require and willing to take the steps needed to implement the change? 11:25 - Where in the organization is agile getting started? 12:17 - Why the clients bring Edward in 13:34 - There is no one true way 14:50 - Critical challenges facing Digital Agencies trying to adopt Agile 16:32 - Understanding how to look at work across the portfolio 17:32 - Different ways of measuring work in agencies that are using Agile 20:07 - “Why don’t we just smoke crack at work?” 23:52 - Tracking Happiness 25:10 - Quantifying value and limiting WIP 28:26 - What is the client actually paying you for? 30:50 - Determining value at the project deliverable level 32:40 - Having a conversation about limiting WIP 35:38 - Getting the client to trust the practices agile team’s employ 36:16 - Multitasking is bad and doesn’t work… but it is still expected 37:45 - What Agile practices just do not work in an Agency model 38:49 - “The on system that is not well suited for Digital Agencies in Scrum” 41:15 - Kanban as an alternative for Digital Agencies 42:10 - What Agile tool/technique is the key to making it work in an Agency model? 43:17 - What is the piece that is missing when trying to make Agile fit in an Agency model? 44:18 - How to get in touch with Edward Contacting Edward Website - https://www.tallprojects.co.uk Email: edward@tallprojects.co.uk LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/edwardkay/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/edwardkay or https://twitter.com/tallprojects Edward’s article on The Digital Project Manager: Agency Agile: 10 Agile Methods For Agencies http://www.thedigitalprojectmanager.com/agency-agile-process/ CSM Training and the 2017 Digital PM Summit For information on the Certified Scrum Master class being held right before the 2017 Digital PM Summit, go to https://www.leadingagile.com/event/certified-scrummaster-training-nevada-10-14-17/. Special Discounts are available for conference attendees. Contact training@leadingagile.com. For information on the 2017 Digital PM Summit, go to http://bureauofdigital.com/summits/digital-pm-2017/.

Justin Handler is the Head of Accounts at O3 World, a Philadelphia based Digital Agency. O3 World has been integrating Agile practices into their workflow for the past few years and Justin has been leading that charge every step of the way. In this interview, Justin shares stories about what has worked for O3, some things that didn’t, and he offers advice for Digital Agencies that are moving down the path towards Agile. Justin is also one of the folks heading up the Digital PM group in Philadelphia. If you’d like to learn more about the group, check out http://twitter.com/dpmphilly or https://www.meetup.com/DPM-Philly/ SHOW NOTES 03:24 Interview begins 03:44 Background on Justin and his role at O3 06:48 How O3 got started with implementing Agile 08:00 O3’s first experiments with Agile estimation practices 09:40 What O3 tried that didn’t work and what they learned from it 11:57 Debating the value of a Daily Standup and O3’s alternative solution 14:15 Does the client get access to the Trello Board and Slack? 14:34 The key to making Agile practices work in an Agency 16:05 Fitting UX into Agile at O3 19:25 Involving Developers with UX work 20:03 Capturing and prioritizing requirements at O3 22:30 Development and UX working in parallel 23:27 Helping the client with adopting Agile (or not) 25:39 Changing the nature of the relationship with the client 27:14 Advice for agencies getting started with Agile 29:23 How to reach Justin JUSTIN’S ARTICLE During the interview Justin references an article he wrote called “Agile In The Agency. Is It Possible?” You can find it here: http://www.thedigitalprojectmanager.com/managing-agile-projects-in-agency/ CONTACTING JUSTIN Web: http://www.o3world.com Email: handler@o3world.com Twitter: @justinhandler

Darren Petersen is a Senior Technical Project Manager at Lullabot. He’s also incredibly knowledgeable about Agile. In this interview Darren and I discuss how Agile has been implemented at Lullabot. We dig into what works, what doesn’t, why he moved away from Story Points and all, and how Lullabot has been able to get dedicated teams in place. Note: During the interview Darren and I have a brief conversation about why it makes no sense to force yourself into the As a (some user) I want to (some action) so I can (some benefit) format just for the sake of using it. I promised to get him an official answer. You can find that here: SHOW NOTES 00:08 Interview Begins 00:47 Background on Lullabot 01:33 Managing 50 distributed team members 03:04 Using social media tools to stay connected with remote staff 05:57 Using Agile at Lullabot for client work 12:02 Making the case for some upfront planning, before using Agile during Development 12:50 Taking on the cost of teaching Agile to the client (who doesn’t care about Agile) 14:22 The way Lullabot sets up Teams to use Agile for client work 15:22 How can a digital agency maintain the business with dedicated teams 20:35 How dedicated teams impact the staff members morale and performance at Lullabot 23:27 Teaching customers to write decent User Stories 28:07 Should you force yourself into a User Story format when it doesn’t make sense? * 29:32 Why Darren doesn’t like using Story Points 33:00 How did Darren get so deep with Agile and what drives him to keep learning about it 36:19 Getting in touch with Darren 37:01 Interview Ends CONTACTING DARREN Twitter https://twitter.com/dsayswhat Email: darren.petersen@lullalbot.com About: https://www.lullabot.com/about/darren-petersen Lullabot https://www.lullabot.com LINKS MENTIONED IN THIS PODCAST User Stories Applied by Mike Cohn http://amzn.to/2vKv4JI Troy Magennis & Focused Objective http://focusedobjective.com User Story Mapping by Jeff Patton http://amzn.to/2wckyOg Agile Manifesto http://agilemanifesto.org

Jack Skeels is the CEO and Founder of AgencyAgile. There are many organizations devoted to helping companies transform to agile, but AgencyAgile is the only one that is solely focused on helping Digital Agencies adopt Agile. In this interview Jack shares his thoughts on Agile and what makes it succeed or fail in a Digital Agency context. SHOW NOTES 00:10 Interview Begins 00:40 Background on Jack and Agency Agile 01:24 How Jack ended up helping Digital Agencies adopt Agile 05:10 Trying out different types of Agile 06:10 Taking a job so you can run experiments in how to manage projects 08:12 You can’t make people trust 09:13 Jack’s initial questions for management: How much pain are you in? How much gain do you want? 09:52 What is the hardest part for a Digital Agency adopting Agile? 11:52 Transforming the agency AND their clients. Training is not enough 13:40 Do we need a new flavor of Agile tailored to Digital Agencies? 17:26 Does Agile actually make things work better? Are there actual business benefits? 18:38 How does AgencyAgile “sell” Agile to companies? 21:32 We need to stop disempower team members. They care as much as we do. 24:39 Can we actually get consistent cross-functional teams in an Agency? 25:22 Designing work stream teams of 25 26:07 Transforming the whole agency at once 27:31 Are there clients who are not ready to transform yet? 31:10 Letting go of learned behavior 32:30 What do we need for Agile to work in a Digital Agency? 33:19 Agile will work when it becomes a management initiative NOT a Project Management Initiative 34:53 How you can learn more about the AgencyAgile approach 36:10 Books about Agile that Jack recommends 37:00 Jack response to “We can’t do Agile because we’re fixed bid.” 38:10 Advice from Jack for those who want to adopt Agile in a digital agency 39:07 Where you can learn more about Jack 40:11 Interview Ends Links Mentioned in the Podcast 2017 Digital PM Summit: http://bureauofdigital.com/summits/digital-pm-2017/ Books by Bas Vodde and Craig Larman Practices for Scaling Lean & Agile Development http://amzn.to/2uCR6AV Scaling Lean & Agile Development http://amzn.to/2wXVKWG Contacting Jack: Website: https://www.agencyagile.com Blog: https://www.agencyagile.com/insights/ Medium: https://medium.com/@jackskeels Twitter : https://twitter.com/agencyagile LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jackaskeels/ If you are interested in this topic, please stay tuned for more. In preparation for a session I am leading at the 2017 Digital PM Summit (ttp://bureauofdigital.com/summits/digital-pm-2017/), I have been doing lots of interviews about how to make Agile work in a digital environment.