Endgame with Amanda Cassatt

What happens when crypto stops optimizing purely for profit and starts optimizing for people, planet, and long-term coordination?In this episode, Amanda Cassatt sits down with Gitcoin founder Kevin Owocki to discuss Ethereum’s public goods, swallowing the Green Pill, and what onchain coordination will look like in the future.Owocki maps the cultural fault lines inside Ethereum: the libertarian and cypherpunk roots, the rise of hyper-financialized degen culture, and the parallel effort to build something different: a regenerative ecosystem that funds public goods, sustains open source, and solves coordination failures instead of reproducing them.The two unpack what Green Pill really means and the choice it asks of builders, how Gitcoin funded $70 million in public goods and why grants and vibes aren’t enough anymore. Timestamps:00:00 Introduction to Regen and Degen02:57 The Green Pill Movement06:13 Public Goods in Ethereum09:10 Funding Challenges in the Ethereum Ecosystem12:07 Comparing Ethereum to Traditional Governments15:00 The Evolution of Public Goods Funding17:48 Incentive Alignment and the Tragedy of the Commons21:04 Building Proofs for Public Goods24:11 Ethereum's Unique Approach to Public Goods26:48 Meditations on Moloch and Coordination Failures29:39 Exploring Moloch and Ginsberg's Influence30:04 Addressing Coordination Failures in Ethereum34:48 The Future of Capitalism and Its Alternatives39:40 Balancing Different Forms of Capital45:03 Navigating Financial Nihilism Among Youth47:41 Success Stories in Building Parallel InstitutionsSubscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast  Kevin on X: https://x.com/owockiAmanda on X:  https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@UCInZsV3L1nDGoFjxoNUnPQQ

Crypto was supposed to be the escape hatch. So why does it increasingly feel like it’s being absorbed by the very systems it set out to challenge?In this candid conversation, Amanda Cassatt sits down with cyberpunk crypto lawyer Gabriel Shapiro about the “fintech-ization” of crypto, where the industry stands in the post-Gary Gensler era and the fading relevance of the four-year cycle.Is crypto a tool for resisting power, or just a more efficient version of traditional finance waiting to be regulated into submission? Regulation isn’t a complete negative for the space; Gabriel believes that certain aspects, such as antitrust law, are beneficial. But while some laws age like a fine wine, others aren’t as relevant as technology evolves.Amanda and Gabriel also discussed KYC and how it’s evolving, zero-knowledge proofs, and what Tornado Cash did wrong. Timestamps: 00:00 Current State of Crypto and Market Cycles02:53 The Debate on Decentralization vs. Centralization05:47 The Role of Government and Regulation in Crypto08:43 Crypto as an Alternative to Traditional Legal Systems11:49 The Impact of Incumbent Protection on Innovation15:03 The Future of Crypto in a Regulated Environment17:51 The Importance of Privacy and Programmability in Crypto26:18 The Imperative of Privacy in Crypto34:52 Navigating Legal Compliance and Privacy39:41 The Dilemma of Civil Disobedience46:24 The Future of KYC in Crypto48:40 Zero Knowledge Technology and Its Potential

Is crypto’s biggest rival artificial intelligence? As AI absorbs talent and capital, it’s not clear yet if crypto and AI are competing or converging but crypto’s focus on human agency may matter more than ever in an automated world.Amanda Cassatt is joined by Aaron Wright, crypto lawyer, former Wikia general counsel and CEO of Tribute Labs, to unpack the battle between crypto and AI and what the explosive growth of stablecoins actually means for the U.S. dollar as both institutions and corporations look to gain exposure to crypto. Outside of the technological battle we’re seeing, Aaron believes we’re also undergoing a structural shift that’ll see the separation of the U.S. dollar from U.S. banks. He discusses the slow erosion of smaller national currencies, and the rise of open, permissionless financial infrastructure that anyone can access. What looks incremental today may ultimately reshape who controls money and how power flows in a dollar-dominated world.The conversation spans across artificial intelligence, dollar hegemony, central bank authority, as well as the growing divide between institutional crypto and the onchain “trenches.”Timestamps: 00:00 – Cold Open: Stablecoins and the End of Dollar Hegemony05:00 – Splitting the Dollar from the Banks10:00 – Do Stablecoins Weaken Central Banks?15:00 – Should Local Currencies Even Exist?20:00 – The Paradox of American Decline25:00 – Regulation, Law, and Crypto’s Lost Years30:00 – Institutional Crypto vs. the Trenches35:00 – Is Crypto Still About Technology?40:00 – AI vs. Crypto45:00 – Open Systems, Wikipedia, and Internet Decay50:00 – KYC, Surveillance, and Enshittification55:00 – Identity, Reputation, and ZK Proofs1:00:00 – Crypto’s Endgame: Human AgencyResources: Follow Aaron Wright @awrigh01 https://x.com/awrigh01Learn more about Aaron's work: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/cf_dev/AbsByAuth.cfm?per_id=2373233Subscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast  Amanda on X:  https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@UCInZsV3L1nDGoFjxoNUnPQQ

What if the biggest forces shaping crypto today are hidden behind VPNs?In this episode of Endgame, host Amanda Cassatt sits down with Mable Jiang, Trends co-founder, former Multicoin partner and founding member of the Solana Foundation Council,for a rare, unfiltered look at the Chinese and Asian crypto markets — the traders, the memes, the exchanges, and the invisible liquidity that moves the entire ecosystem.From the rise of Bybit and Binance to the cultural phenomenon of Chinese tickers and global “trenchers,” Jiang dives into the real size of the Chinese crypto market and why so much of that activity is “concealed” and never shows up in Western reports.Cassatt and Jiang explore Hong Kong’s resurgence and what’s led to it in comparison to the “Westworld effect” Singapore has. The two also touch on Solana’s “Lala” moment, creator-coin culture and what Western builders don’t understand about Asia.The US may have claimed the crypto capital for now, but Asia, and China, may dominate crypto’s next chapter.Timecodes: 00:00 The Evolution of Dance and Technology05:01 The Chinese Crypto Market Landscape11:18 Centralized Exchanges and Their Impact17:06 Institutional Participation in Crypto22:43 The Role of Education in Innovation27:23 The Gaokao System and Its Implications34:39 Stereotypes of Chinese Tech Culture39:02 Government Perspectives on Crypto43:09 Opportunities and Risks in Crypto Adoption50:44 Navigating the Chinese Market for Crypto ProjectsSubscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast  Amanda on X:  https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@UCInZsV3L1nDGoFjxoNUnPQQ

What happens when the country that taught the world inflation becomes the testing ground for the future of money?In this episode of Endgame, Amanda sits down with Camila Russo, author of The Infinite Machine and founder of The Defiant, to trace how growing up in Latin America shaped her understanding of money, power, and why crypto matters long before the West noticed. Before becoming one of crypto’s most influential journalists, Camila was a Bloomberg reporter living in Buenos Aires during the peso’s collapse, covering Argentina’s economy as her own salary evaporated under currency controls.Camila explains how living through Argentina’s currency controls made Bitcoin feel inevitable, why DeFi was the first time crypto felt real, and why stablecoins have become the economic backbone of everyday life across the region. She breaks down why LATAM became a proving ground for UX-driven financial apps, how its developers are quietly building one of crypto’s most important talent hubs, and why countries like Argentina and Brazil may define the next phase of mainstream adoption.This is a look at crypto through the eyes of someone who’s lived the problem before meeting the technology.Timestamps0:00 – How We Met & Crypto Beginnings1:37 – Working in Argentina & Bloomberg5:07 – Living Through Hyperinflation6:07 – Discovering Bitcoin11:43 – Crypto in Argentina vs US12:25 – Back to New York & Crypto Coverage14:41 – Choosing Ethereum for a Book16:37 – Early DeFi & Starting The Defiant21:19 – Crypto Media Landscape23:15 – Conflicts of Interest in Crypto Media26:53 – Global Media Insights31:54 – Broken Media Business Model36:36 – Incentivizing Investigative Journalism38:16 – Argentina Today & Crypto Use Case44:48 – Innovation in LatAm CryptoRESOURCES:Follow Cami: https://x.com/CamiRussoFollow The Defiant: https://x.com/DefiantNewsCheck out The Defiant: https://thedefiant.io/Subscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast  Amanda on X:  https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@UCInZsV3L1nDGoFjxoNUnPQQ

In this episode of Endgame, Ethereum Foundation Co-Executive Director Tomasz K. Stańczak joins Amanda to discuss how the organization behind Ethereum is changing.Together they talk about why institutions on Wall Street are now asking for more decentralization, open source, and censorship resistance, and what it means for Ethereum to actively defend its values while staying credibly neutral. Tomasz also breaks down how the Foundation is preparing for AI, quantum, and agent-based finance, and the biggest risk he sees.Tomasz argues that If Ethereum “wins,” the world will look like intermediaries quietly melting into the network, basic financial functions trending toward zero fees, and the systems that run money, institutions, and governments become open source by default.Timestamps:00:00 Ethereum Foundation’s Changing Direction04:06 Reaching Institutions & Improving Communication07:43 Decision-Making, Decentralization, and Innovation12:32 Defending Core Ethereum Values15:51 Technology vs. Culture: Can Ethereum Stay True to Its Vision?18:36 Institutions Building Their Own Blockchains20:10 Ethereum as a Global Consensus Layer21:50 AI, Quantum, and the Future of Ethereum23:22 Proof of Stake, Security, and Governance24:35 Risks and Wins for Ethereum in 10 Years26:19 The Path to Zero-Fees & Open Source CoordinationRESOURCES:Follow Tomasz: https://x.com/tkstanczakSubscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast  Amanda on X:  https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@UCInZsV3L1nDGoFjxoNUnPQQ

In this episode of Endgame, Milk Road’s Co-Owner and Head of Research, Kyle Reidhead, joins Amanda Cassatt to share his take on how crypto works today, across markets, media, and the broader tech cycle. Kyle outlines why he thinks crypto cycles follow global liquidity rather than the Bitcoin halving, and why he believes the surge in AI infrastructure spending could stretch this bull market longer than most assume.He also describes his perspective on how information moves through the industry, from the early signals on X to why he prefers creators and analysts who hold crypto over those who don’t. This episode dives deep into Kyle’s own mental model of markets, media, and where he thinks the next phase of adoption will come from.Timestamps:0:00 The Milk Road Origin Story5:00 Building a Fun Crypto Newsletter10:00 Crypto Transparency & Accountability15:00 Prediction Markets & Market Accountability20:00 Bull Markets, AI, and Liquidity Cycles25:00 AI Buildout & the Future of Tech Infrastructure30:00 AI Usage Explosion & Computing Demands40:00 Speculation on Space & the Future Beyond EarthRESOURCES: Follow Milk Road: https://x.com/MilkRoadFollow Kyle: https://x.com/KyleReidheadSubscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast Amanda on X: https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@amandacassatt?utm_source=about-page

What happens when the American empire goes offline?In this episode of Endgame, Amanda Cassatt sits down with Balaji Srinivasan to explore a world run by China and the internet.Balaji outlines the forces driving that shift, from America’s unacknowledged debt spiral and split into “Blue, Red, and Tech America,” to an approaching reality check that will reveal how much value the West has already lost.He argues the next global order won’t be decided by governments or currencies, but by code and that the ideals of liberty, capitalism, and equality before the law have already been backed up to the cloud.Together, they map what comes after collapse: the transition from nation-states to network states.Timestamps:00:00 Reflections on the Network State's Predictions09:12 The Global Competition for Tech Talent17:48 The Trifurcation of America: Blue, Red, and Tech29:57 Class Warfare and the Rise of Tech Resentment31:57 The Complexities of Capitalism and Technology34:57 Navigating the Disruption of AI38:10 The Mark to Market Dilemma41:30 The Shift of Economic Gravity46:42 The Future of Global Power Dynamics58:09 Restoring American Values in a Digital AgeRESOURCES: Follow Balaji: @balajis https://x.com/balajisSubscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast Amanda on X: https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@amandacassatt?utm_source=about-page

What happens when Ethereum staking outperforms U.S. Treasuries?In this episode of Endgame, Alluvial CEO Mara Schmiedt joins Amanda Cassatt to unpack how Ethereum staking evolved from a technical mechanism into the internet’s first native yield.They examine why traditional finance is starting to experiment with onchain systems, how liquid staking tokens are collapsing the boundary between DeFi and TradFi, and what it means when the world’s most risk-averse capital begins earning yield from a decentralized protocol instead of a central bank.Amanda and Mara compare staking to what search ads were to Google, a sustainable revenue engine for an entire ecosystem, and trace the macro implications of that idea. If protocol-native yield exists outside government debt and monetary policy, it redefines how value is created and who controls it.From ETF staking models to custodians bridging into DeFi, this episode unpacks how crypto’s yield engine is threading its way into the heart of global finance and what that might reveal about where the real change is happening.Timestamps:00:01 – Amanda & Mara Introduce the Episode00:12 – Mara’s Crypto Origin Story03:32 – What is Staking & Why It Matters10:04 – Non-Correlated Yield vs. TradFi11:27 – LSTs Explained19:15 – The Technology Behind Secure Staking27:31 – Defining “Institutional” in Crypto35:28 – Who’s Not Staking Yet?40:03 – Staking & DeFi Convergence43:52 – Vision for the Future of Open FinanceRESOURCES: Follow Mara: https://x.com/MaraSchmiedt Subscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast Amanda on X: https://x.com/amandacassatt  Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin  Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd   Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440  Substack: https://substack.com/@amandacassatt?utm_source=about-page

Silicon Valley is building AI on the wrong assumptions, says Microsoft economist and researcher Glen Weyl.Glen Weyl has spent his life at the intersection of tech and politics and sees a critical gap in tech driven by Bay Area culture, where the voices of religious and culturally grounded communities are almost entirely absent. He argues that this lack of perspective has shaped Silicon Valley’s AI culture, creating blind spots with enormous consequences.  Rather than viewing history through the "great man" lens, as driven by virtuosic leaders often acting unilaterally, Glen takes a systems view of what drives progress and his current work focuses on bringing religious conservatives into the conversation, balancing tech’s internal logic with the realities of the world it seeks to reshape. This week on Endgame, Glen joins Amanda to explore a future where AI may replace capitalism with a 'Gaia'-like system. He draws on examples from India and Taiwan, where tech and religion are integrated to drive innovation, design public infrastructure, and create neutral protocols that produce hyper-competitive markets, offering a model for how Bay Area–driven tech could close its own gaps.TIMESTAMPS:00:00 The Future of Labor and Capital05:18 Eschatology and AI Doomerism11:09 The Role of Religion in Technology17:01 Human Value in an AI-Driven World22:57 Rethinking Value and Hierarchies29:50 Global Perspectives on Innovation and Governance31:45 The Role of Individuals vs. Collective Systems37:09 Democracy in the Age of Information43:42 Balancing Spirituality and Technological Advancement50:59 Decentralization through Technology: The India Stack55:38 Government Intervention and Economic GrowthRESOURCES:Follow Glen: https://x.com/glenweylSubscribe to Endgame: https://www.youtube.com/@endgamepodcast Amanda on X: https://x.com/amandacassatt Serotonin on X: https://x.com/serotonin Endgame on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6iSvbKOJWoEPiAoGmiulkd Endgame on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/endgame-with-amanda-cassatt/id1801809440 Substack: https://substack.com/@UCInZsV3L1nDGoFjxoNUnPQQ