

Experience by Design
Gary David
This is Experience by Design, a podcast that brings new perspectives to the experiences we have everyday. Does standing in line always have to suck? Why are airports so uncomfortable? What does it mean to be loyal to a brand? Why do you love being connected but dislike feeling tethered to your smart phone? Can we train people to care about the climate?
Join Sociologist Gary David and Anthropologist Adam Gamwell on an expedition to the frontiers of culture and business through the lens of human experience. We're here to make sense of the madness with leading psychologists, cognitive and social scientists, entrepreneurs, and business leaders.
Join Sociologist Gary David and Anthropologist Adam Gamwell on an expedition to the frontiers of culture and business through the lens of human experience. We're here to make sense of the madness with leading psychologists, cognitive and social scientists, entrepreneurs, and business leaders.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Sep 21, 2022 • 1h 5min
Accelerated Leadership with Jennifer Chapman
The field of leadership coaching has been expanding with many different types of offerings provided by just as many different approaches. And it is hard to say that it is not needed. People in management positions can be beset on all sides by demands and limitations, making even thinking about leadership just another thing to add onto an already packed to-do list. In some fields of work, the situation is even more challenging. For instance, those who are working in engineering fields might get next to no training on how to work with one of the most complex machines: people. While they might want to be in a position to help people who work for them, they have never been shown how. Furthermore, they likely are not into the “foofy”, meaning they want to cut to the chase in terms of how to create change. To talk about how to cut to the chase and avoid the “foof”, we have Jennifer Chapman from Ambition Leadership. Jennifer focuses her efforts on STEM managers and leaders, a unique niche that she is well suited to take on. Besides being married to an engineer, she has worked with the Internal Revenue Services as well as the National Science Foundation, the Red Cross, and others. One thing these organizations have in common is that they turn more like cruise ships than jet skis. The other thing is that they are made up of people, and people who want a purpose. We talk with Jennifer about how the most effective leaders are the ones who empower their employees. We also explore the unique aspects of working with data-driven and task-focused sectors. She discusses how mindset is the primary obstacle to making changes, and how more resources need to be devoted to training. Finally, we talk about how people matter because those are the ones who are going to make things happen. And when designing leadership and employee experiences, your people need to come first.

Sep 2, 2022 • 1h 4min
Doing Design that Drives Change with Michael Kirkpatrick
In many ways, Experience Design is a new field of work in terms of how it has become focused on and prioritized in companies and across sectors. In other ways, there is nothing new about it at its core. Experiences have been designed and delivered throughout human history. Perhaps what is most different about today is the awareness and intentionally behind experience design. But what is the purpose of all this experience designing? Are we just trying to increase bottom-line revenues? Are we trying to create better outcomes beyond profit? How about creating more equitable environments? Perhaps we are trying to effect some kind of positive change through the interactions that we orchestrate, the environments that we construct, and the perceptions that result. Or maybe all of the above?To discuss these questions and more, today on Experience by Design we welcome Michael Kirkpatrick of Centric Park. Michael has had a long career as a designer, working as the Executive Vice President of Client Experience and Strategy at Mad*Pow before starting Centric Park and serving as its CEO. We talk about not just talking about design, but using experience design to transform business and outcomes. Specifically, we talk about how experience design needs to be a people (or human)-centered activity, constantly coming back to the question of what is best for those who are involved. Using a systems perspective, this requires the designer to take ethnographic noticings, stakeholder input, and designer vision to achieve those goals, which first and foremost includes designing products and services that will help people. Finally we talk about gaming in the age of CD-ROMs, and how Monopoly and Risk are really tough games to finish.

Aug 21, 2022 • 1h 4min
Architecting Curiosity and Designing Wonder
We might have all heard that curiosity killed the cat. But as with all stories, the reality of that statement is a bit more complicated. It turns out that the initial version of that phrase referred to how excessive worry or concern for others killed the cat, and that is a concept we can all relate to. Curiosity, on the other hand, did not cause harm to the cat, and may in fact have improved its life. Afterall, curiosity is one of the things that we see in babies as they explore their environments, children when they go off to school, or for anyone who is exploring a new environment. Where then, does curiosity go in our lives? It seems that as we get older, or more settled, or more busy and preoccupied, curiosity feels more like an obligation than an opportunity. How might we reinvigorate that sense of curiosity in our lives and ourselves? How can we integrate curiosity to make it once again part of who we are? And how can we have curiosity with care and intentionality, being aimed at a positive end that we are directing? Today on Experience by Design we Monica Canfield-Lenfest and Pim Schachtschabel from Architecting Curiosity. They describe their company as a community and school to practice and train your natural muscle of inquiry. That curiosity is part of our natural self is central to their work, and how they work with clients to tap back into it and exercise it. Like all muscles, curiosity can atrophy from lack of use. The good news is that Architecting Curiosity are like curiosity therapists, working with people who want to reinvigorate their inquisitive self.We talk to Pim and Monica about their work and how it started. We discuss the “Huh” moment when that first noticing becomes a pathway to explore new worlds. They take us through their framework to guide their clients back into curiosity and discovery. Ultimately their work is to help people go beyond the limitations they have created for themselves, freeing their minds to explore and discover. We also learn what is served at parties in the Netherlands.

Aug 3, 2022 • 57min
Breathing Oxygen into Culture with Jason Barger
As ethnographers, we are used to the idea that big discoveries can come from everyday observations. There are possibilities for discovery all around us. All it takes is for us to notice, and noticing can be the hardest thing to teach. An observation becomes a noticing, which then becomes a premise, which turns into an idea, and eventually perhaps even a paradigm. Our guest, Jason Barger, today spent a lot of time in airports, and it was a simple observation at the baggage claim that led to his book “Step Back from the Baggage Claim: Change the World, Start at the Airport.” The premise of the book is “how to change our daily world through thoughtful and compassionate action.” Or, the biggest changes can start with the smallest acts of compassion, kindness, and service.He has a new book called “Breathing Oxygen: How Positive Leadership Gives Life to Winning Cultures.” In it, Jason takes his experience of working with some of the biggest brands and combines it with the lessons he has learned from a life spent in service to others. In the episode, we talk about how today’s generation needs fulfillment through their work, and to be part of something larger than themselves. We also explore how busyness is not the same as effectiveness, and how more time to reflect and think can pay dividends when it comes to deciding and doing. Gary also learns that good things can come out of Columbus, Ohio, although it is not clear if he remains convinced.

Jul 23, 2022 • 1h 10min
Jen Briselli and Integrating Ideas for Systems Design
Changing mindsets, behaviors, and organizations are hugely challenging. Design presents a pathway for trying to do so. However, when considering the complexity of systems and all the elements associated with them, the challenge can seem overwhelming. People can either oversimply to the point where their approach is incomplete, or get stuck in the weeds to the extent that nothing gets done. To approach the challenge of systems design, we need to draw on a variety of inspirations and professions.Being a physics teacher, a heavy metal aficionado, hockey player, cookie baker, rhetoritician has come together in interesting ways for our guest. Trying to teach high school students physics was good preparation for trying to keep the attention and reach executives. Heavy metal music allowed her to be sensitive to subtle aspects of a bigger sound. Hockey taught the concept of hard work and team work. Studying rhetoric gave her the understanding of how to communication information to people in ways that connect, along with diagnosing problems that people have when communicating with others. And cookies taught her the importance of …… cookies.The key is to pull all of this together and integrate it into a workable framework that helps expand our capacity to understand and act. As we come to understand the importance of systems, we also understand that the challenges are bigger than any one perspective can understand or handle. This means that to handle bigger design problems, we need more integrated solutions.Today on Experience by Design we have Jen Briselli, the Chief Design Strategy Officer at Mad*Pow, an experience design firm in New England. We explore how changing mindsets and “nudging” can be a key strategy to do so. We also discuss how communication and messaging is a key component to accomplishing behavioral changes. We need to know what makes people tick, what their goals are, and how to use the tools handed to them.But we can’t do this in silos. To tackle the big challenges and wicked problems that we are facing, we need to combine our resources and work together. And ultimately, how keeping a beginner’s mind for every project keeps her engaged in her work and continuously learning.

Jul 8, 2022 • 1h 11min
The Bob Ross Experience with Joan Kowalski
Bob Ross has long been a fixture in the pop cultural landscape. The big hair, the soft voice, the happy little clouds, and the artwork created in an episode made Bob compelling and peaceful viewing. There was something about seeing a canvas transformed into a landscape that was transfixing.Despite his shows being on many decades ago, there is more Bob Ross today than ever. Bobble heads, Chia pets, art supplies, board games, t-shirts, and many other items. You can even watch a marathon of Bob Ross episodes on the live streaming platform Twitch every weekend. Bob, it seems, has never left us and won’t be going anywhere any time soon.Today on Experience by Design to talk about the Bob Ross experience is Joan Kowalski. Joan’s parents were responsible for helping Bob launch into the cultural zeitgeist. From her first job at Bob Ross, Inc., Joan is now the company’s president. In that role, she oversees all things Bob.We talk to Joan about the origins and rise of Bob Ross, Inc, and why she thinks Bob continues to resonate today. We explore the design of the Bob Ross experience in its many forms. We discuss Bob the Sex Symbol, and the rise of “Bobology”, or the study of Bob. We talk about whether Bob will ever get respect from the art world given that he is perhaps one of the most popular culture artist known. Finally she tells us why the world needs more art, and how the curating of Bob’s work is helping to connect people with their creative selves.

Jun 13, 2022 • 1h 6min
Meaningful Experience Measurement Greg Kihlstrom
Anyone engaged in experience design knows the challenges of measuring experiences. Far being being a recent issue, understanding our experiences with the world has long challenged philosophers and social scientists. If centuries of the world's greatest thinkers has yet to be able to figure it out, you know it is a hard nut to crack. To solve this issue, many measurement strategies have evolved, each with this benefits and drawbacks. It can feel overwhelming in terms of trying to what can be the best approach to take.Luckily, there is Greg Kihlström's new book "Meaningful Measurement of the Customer Experience." A prolific writer, speaker, consultant, and podcaster, Greg combines his experience and the experiences of others in a comprehensive overview of measurement strategy, philosophy, and execution.Greg visits the Experience by Design studio to discuss his book, where he gives “guidance on how to create a customer-centric culture that prioritizes customer needs while aligning internal teams around a common goal.” On the podcast, we discuss ‘best practices’ across different companies, and how we might provide ‘better practices’ for increasing our understanding of customers, their experiences, and their worlds. We also discuss the connection between customer and employee experiences, and new directions in CX and experience measurement.

May 25, 2022 • 1h 6min
Making Memories and Place with Julia Beabout
Memories are central to our lives, and how we form a sense of who we are as people. How we remember and engage with the past speaks to our identity in the present. Both events good and bad can form deep impressions in our minds, cutting grooves and building pinnacles that create the topography of our experiences. Low points and high points, trauma and triumphs, all are part of the past brought to present in our memories.But memories are not ours alone to make. Rather, memories can be built, constructed, framed, and recalled in the context of others, society, and culture. We can see this today in American society, where there is a lot of contested territory regarding what is being remembered and how. When we broaden out the voices being represented in these collective memories, the challenge becomes even greater to be inclusive and to negotiate memories in these contested spaces.To explore the creation of memory and place, Julia Beabout from the company Novaby visits the Experience by Design studios. Julia is the CEO and Creative Director at Novaby, and was involved in the Monumental Conversations project in Richmond, VA. The project combined augmented reality with local community institutions to tell different stories about place, history, and memory. She describes herself as “On fire for Fairness”, trying to create engaging experiences that capture the collective memories of community members. ‘Place making’ as she calls it is about co-creation with the community, and then making augmented and virtual memorials to commemorate in ways that are themselves memorable. By doing so, we make environments that are inclusive and representative in a continuous ways as our understanding of who we are evolves.

Apr 28, 2022 • 59min
Frans Melissen and Sustainable Experience Design
While we are celebrating Earth Day on April 22nd, it might feel more appropriate to be planning the Earth’s memorial service. Earth Day was founded in 1970 as a way to learn about environmental issues, highlight sustainability of natural resources, and direct our attention to the fragility of our world. In the intervening 52 years, things haven’t gotten much better. Attempts to change our energy production, usage, and pollution have run into the wall of politics, conspiracy theories, and denial. It seems that when we need action the most, it is hardest to come by. Despite people increasingly coming to terms with the reality of climate change, adequate action is still not being taken, leading to worries about it being too late.To help us explore some of these questions, Professor Frans Melissen visits the Experience by Design studios. Frans has spent a career examining not only the impact of people and society on the environment, but also the larger question of sustainable experiences. We talk about the nature of how systems based on profit cannot necessarily act in ways that are environmentally responsible. He tells us about his idea of being a ‘scholactivist’, or combining scholarship with activism. By finding ways to communicate more broadly through new mediums like TikTok, scholars can have a greater impact.

Apr 14, 2022 • 1h 6min
Transformative Change and Organizational Experiences with Andy McDowell
Organizations may often think of change, but they are also often not serious about actually changing. When it comes down to making changes, where the rubber hits the proverbial road and orgs have to consider resourcing, people, budgets and time horizons, the reality of what it takes to change runs up against actual desire to change. Change can be even more difficult when things seem to be going well. Why change when we don’t need to? Because when things are going well, it might be the best time to start thinking about changes.Andy McDowell, of Generate Your Value, stops by the Experience by Design studios to talk about how self-transformation is the key to making transformative experiences. The mission of Andy's company is "to serve as a powerful catalyst for entrepreneurs to experience extraordinary success in business and life.” To help clients achieve this transformation, he applies organizational change and innovation strategies to individual lives. We talk about how going to and then leaving Boeing lead to his own realization of achieving individual change. We also chat about how it is hard to be heard within your own organization when trying to lead innovation and change initiatives. Anyone who has tried to be recognized and ended up being ignored knows what this feels like. We discuss his own challenges in Boeing to be heard, how he uses this experience to fuel his own work, and how that work has translated into helping others to transform their own work and lives.


