The Systemic Way

In this episode, we reflect on the deeply moving documentary White Nanny, Black Child (2023), which explores Britain’s “farming” system — a practice through which over 70,000 West African children were fostered by white British families between 1955 and 1995.Through the voices of nine adults who reunite to share their experiences, the film opens up tender and painful reflections on identity, belonging, and survival. We listen to the echoes of care and silence that continue to shape lives long after childhood — and we explore how systems of care can become systems of control when infused with colonial legacies and racialised assumptions.We speak with Micheal Henry, the systemic therapist who facilitated the Tree of Life work featured in the film. Himself care-experienced, he shares his personal and professional reflections on holding space for these stories — the tensions of being both witness and participant — and the power of collective narrative practices in reconnecting people with identity, community, and pride.Together, we consider what this story teaches us about how care systems remember, forget, and repair. How do we, as systemic practitioners, listen to what was once unspeakable? How do we make space for histories that live inside the present? And what might healing look like — for individuals, families, and the systems that raised them?An invitation to think, feel, and reflect systemically on survival, silence, and the enduring search for belonging.Film Reference:White Nanny Black Child. Directed by Andy Mundy-Castle, Doc Hearts and Tigerlily Productions, Channel 5, 2023.Micheal Henry Bio:Michael Henry, is an African-centred Systemic Family and Couples Psychotherapist based in North London. With over 30 years of experience supporting individuals, families, and organisations, Michael brings deep insight into complex trauma, relationships, and identity.A UKCP and AFT-accredited clinician, Michael’s approach blends Systemic Psychotherapy, African Psychology, and Integrative practice, drawing on training in Narrative Therapy, Gottman Method, Emotionally Focused Therapy (EFT), EMDR, and Brainspotting.Born and raised in East London to Jamaican parents, Michael’s work is grounded in cultural awareness, compassion, and wisdom. His journey—from youth work and child protection to psychotherapy and organisational consulting—reflects a lifelong commitment to understanding how people grow, heal, and connect.

In this very special episode we sit down with members of the DWP - Race Group (Shakira Nkanang, Calvin Malcom and John Burnham) as we turn our systemic lens on the iconic album by Tracy Chapman (Tracy Chapman 1988). We ask, how does Tracy Chapman's album provide a soundtrack for confronting race, power, and privilege in therapeutic practice?  What do the anthems of our lives reveal about the systems we live in? We unpack how "Talkin' 'bout a Revolution" isn't just a protest song, but a sharp analysis of how power maintains itself by dismissing dissent as a "whisper." We explore "Fast Car" as a devastating map of intergenerational poverty and the gendered family roles that keep people trapped in cycles of false hope. And we listen closely to "Baby Can I Hold You," hearing the profound relational miscommunication and emotional withdrawal that can microcosm the failures of larger systems to truly hear and respond. This episode connects the political, the economic, and the intimately personal, revealing how Chapman's work gives us a language to explore the systems that shape our clients' worlds—and our own. This conversation is more than an analysis of music; it's a living example of how to grapple with systemic themes to transform training, therapeutic practice, and organisations themselves. Join us for a session that bridges art and action, and discover how Chapman’s revolutionary whispers can continue to inspire our own.Calvin Malcolm is a Principal Family and Systemic Psychotherapist working in Devon Partnership Trust Adult Mental Health Services, he is also a Systemic Family Psychotherapist with 26 years of CAMHS experience. He is a Guest Lecturer on the DClinPsy Systemic Teaching at The University of Exeter, and Guest lecturer on the Plymouth University Intermediate level in Family Therapy Course. He is a Systemic Psychotherapy Tutor for doctors in training in Devon. He is also a Systemic Supervisor and a member of The Association of Family Therapy organisation that supports Family and Systemic Psychotherapy training and practice standardsJohn Burnham trained as a Social Worker in 1974 and went on to become Consultant Family and Systemic Psychotherapist in the Inpatient Service for Eating Disorders at Parkview Clinic, Birmingham Women’s and Children’s Hospital, Birmingham. John’s approach to therapy and supervision is under the influence of systemic, narrative, and social construction theories and my working class roots.  His professional passions include ‘thinking theory and talking ordinary’; ‘turning practice into theory’ , ‘creating self and relationally reflexive practices’;  ‘creating solidarity between young people, parents and professionals through multiple family therapy’, and using social and personal GgRRAAAACCEEEESSSS….S to enable clients and practitioners to conceptualise and influence their experiences.  Shakira Nkanang is a Systemic Psychotherapist working for an Independent Fostering Agency, where she conducts therapy sessions with foster carers and social workers. She also delivers foster care and trauma-informed training, as well as systemic training to support supervising social workers. Shakira incorporates an embodied systemic approach in her work and maintains a private practice, working with culturally diverse clients. She is the facilitator of the AFT 'Race' and Diversity Working Party Group.Tracy Chapman - Tracy Chapman is an American singer-songwriter known for her soulful voice and thought-provoking lyrics. Rising to fame in the late 1980s with hits like "Fast Car" and "Give Me One Reason," her music blends folk, rock, and pop with themes of social justice, personal struggle, and hope. With a career spanning decades, Chapman has become an iconic figure in the music world for her powerful storytelling and timeless sound.

In systemic psychotherapy we often focus on the words we use, but what about the sound of them? In this episode, we meet with systemic psychotherapist and social worker Jordan Makmihe to explore the subtle yet significant role of accent in therapeutic practice.Our conversation considers how the nuances of our speech—the melody, the rhythm, the inflection—carry unspoken stories about identity, belonging, and power. We discuss how these vocal cues quietly influence the relationship between therapist and client, shaping perceptions and dynamics in ways that often go unexamined.We gently unpack the concept of the "standard" accent and its quiet authority, and reflect on the experience of speaking—or listening—with a "non-standard" one. This isn't about grand pronouncements, but about the quiet practice of noticing: noticing our assumptions, our reactions, and the small moments of connection or misunderstanding that accent can bring.Join us for a thoughtful discussion on discovering ways to make space for this often overlooked dimension of human difference, and on the simple yet profound, act of listening more closely to how we speak and hear each other.Jordan Bio:Jordan Makmihe is a qualified systemic psychotherapist, systemic supervisor, and social worker. He trains and supervises other therapists, and has had research published. Jordan works in the NHS, social care, education, and independent practice.Paper reference: The forgotten piece of the orchestra: Raising awareness of accent as a key dimension of identity and experience, and ideas for aesthetic explorations in practice – Jordan MakmiheContext 188, August 2023

Dessa Markovic is a therapist, trainer, and clinical director at the School of Life therapy service. She shares insights from her paper on reading, introducing a model that intertwines the Author's View, personal response, critique, and self-reflexivity. The discussion emphasizes the importance of suspending judgment and recognizing biases in reading. Markovic explores how systemic thinking can transform practices in therapy and education, encouraging listeners to engage deeply with texts and reflect on their personal experiences in the process.

In this insightful conversation, Satish Kumar—peace activist, former Jain monk, and author of Radical Love—explores the transformative power of love as a systemic force for healing. He discusses how Radical Love can reshape education, economics, and politics, emphasizing interdependence and compassion. Satish shares personal stories from his epic peace walks and emphasizes the essential connection between soil, soul, and society. Tune in for a refreshing perspective on nurturing resilience through love and challenging societal norms with empathy.

Join Nora Bateson, an award-winning filmmaker and systems thinker, as she delves into the intricate web of human relationships and ecological connections. She emphasizes the importance of "warm data"—the subtle nuances of communication that reveal our interdependence. Nora challenges conventional thinking by advocating for a holistic approach to understanding systems, exploring how systemic psychotherapy intertwines with complex societal issues. Through evocative storytelling, she shows how embracing complexity is essential for fostering resilience and meaningful connections.

In this rich and wide-ranging conversation, we sit down with Umberta Telfener, President of EFTA, and Hans Christian Michaelsen, Vice President, to explore the heart of systemic practice across Europe.Together, they unpack what EFTA (European Family Therapy Association) is, how it’s structured, and what it offers to both long-standing members and curious newcomers. We hear about their personal journeys into systemic therapy, the organization’s current goals, and the evolving landscape of family and systemic practice in response to global challenges—from climate change to social justice.We also dive into the EFTA Task Forces—on Social Justice, Research, Training Standards, Ethics, and External Relationships—and explore how these working groups are shaping the future of systemic thinking and action.Whether you’re a seasoned practitioner or just discovering systemic ideas, this episode offers an open invitation to get involved, attend the upcoming EFTA Congress, and take part in a growing, reflective, and forward-thinking community.

In this episode, we speak with Taiwo Afuape and Sumita Dutta, Co-Directors of the Institute of Family Therapy in London, to explore the rich history and bold new direction of one of the UK’s leading centres for systemic practice. Together, we reflect on IFT’s legacy, its role in shaping generations of family therapists, and how its current leadership is reimagining training and practice through a lens of social justice, inclusivity, and innovation. This is a conversation about change, continuity, and the power of collective vision.https://ift.org.uk/

Join us for an inspiring and thought-provoking interview with Dr. Harlene Anderson, a trailblazer in systemic psychotherapy and co-founder of the Collaborative-Dialogical Approach. In this deep dive, we explore her revolutionary ideas—from challenging traditional therapy hierarchies to redefining power, knowledge, and the role of language in healing.  We’ll unpack:  - The origins of her work—What drew her to the Mental Research Institute (MRI) and constructivist ideas? Who were her early influences?  - The birth of the Collaborative-Dialogical Approach—How did she and Harry Goolishian shift therapy from "expert diagnosis" to conversational meaning-making?  - The myth of "not-knowing*—How has this controversial (and often misunderstood) concept evolved? Is it a political stance, a therapeutic tool, or both?  - Power, reflexivity, and ethics—Can therapists truly "not know"? How do we balance lived experience with professional knowledge without reinforcing oppressive dynamics?  - Real-world applications**—How do these ideas translate beyond therapy into education, organisations, and social justice?  Plus, we include listener questions which tackle the tough critiques: Is "not-knowing" still misused today? Does it risk ignoring systemic power? And how do therapists ethically choose which discourses to engage?  This is a conversation about unlearning, curiosity, and the transformative power of dialogue—one that challenges therapists and listeners alike to rethink how we engage with each other’s stories.  

In this engaging conversation, Dr. John Launer, a retired GP and family therapist, shares his pioneering work in narrative medicine and the Conversations Inviting Change method. He discusses the transformative Seven Cs framework for patient interactions and the importance of storytelling in medicine. Dr. Launer highlights the challenges within the NHS and the need for curiosity-driven practices. With thoughtful anecdotes, he illustrates how systemic approaches can revolutionize healthcare, ultimately enriching both patient care and clinician experiences.