The Sales Compensation Show

In this episode of The Sales Compensation Show, global sales compensation expert Stephen Long joins Forma.ai CEO Nabeil Alazzam to unpack what really breaks inside sales compensation plans—long before a single payout runs.They dig into how unclear end goals, weak data infrastructure, and rushed quotas quietly erode trust, invite gaming, and push reps to work around the plan instead of through it. Stephen shares practical patterns from decades in global sales comp, plus concrete examples of redesigning incentives around contract “health,” not just top line numbers.Resources MentionedBooksThe Elements of Sales Compensation – Jerry Colletti, Mary Fiss, Scott SandsA sales compensation book by Dave Cichelli (referenced by Stephen; title not mentioned in the episode)Organizations & SitesForma.ai – The AI-powered sales performance management platform and host of The Sales Compensation Show podcastWorldatWork – professional association with sales compensation resources and educationIf you enjoy the show, don’t forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share it with a fellow sales compensation leader.The Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

In this episode, Forma.ai CEO Nabeil Alazzam sits down with Les Reif, Senior Director of Sales Compensation at Rogers Communications, for a deep dive into how Rogers designs, governs, and operates sales comp inside one of Canada’s largest telcos.Les shares how he moved into sales comp through data, and why he still sees the function as a business-and-data translation engine more than a pure “math problem.” From there, they walk through how his team balances optionality vs. complexity, keeps stakeholders aligned, and builds a high-performing comp organization in an environment full of legacy systems and constant change.🔎 In this episode, you’ll learn:Why sales compensation is really a data and definition problem, not just calculationHow Rogers balances flexibility vs. complexity and avoids 50+ plan variantsWhen changing the comp plan isn’t the right first move—even when performance is offHow Les structures governance and sign-off across Sales, Finance, and HRThe rollout tactics that actually build rep trust (roadshows, first-paycheck comms, escalation forums)Why the real differentiator in sales comp is people, not tools—and what he looks for when hiringWhether you lead Sales Comp, RevOps, or Sales Ops, this is a rare inside look at how a national carrier runs its comp engine—and a chance to benchmark your own approach against an enterprise at serious scale.💡 About the show The Sales Compensation Show brings you in-depth conversations with the leaders shaping how modern revenue teams design incentives, drive performance, and support go-to-market strategy.Powered by Forma.ai — the data-first, AI-powered sales performance management platform that connects territories, quotas, and incentives on a single foundation.The Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

What if the very thing you use to motivate sellers is unintentionally distorting behavior? In this episode Barracuda’s Director of Sales Compensation, Ryan Farber, joins host Nabeil Alazzam to pressure-test sales incentives—then rethink or offer up pragmatic models and guardrails. The two get into intrinsic vs. extrinsic motivation, exponential vs. logarithmic pay curves, what comp plans simply can’t replace, and how to fix segmentation, pricing, and delivery so the plan stops getting blamed for upstream problems. The episode closes with a peek at adaptive, deal-level incentives powered by cleaner data.Listen in for real quotes, usable frameworks, and a debate that lands in a place with ideas you can actually ship.Host: Nabeil Alazzam, CEO @ Forma.ai Guest: Ryan Farber, Director, Sales Compensation @ BarracudaResources mentionedPunished by Rewards — Alfie KohnThe New Human Rights Movement — Peter JosephChapters00:05 – Ryan’s hot take: “Are comp plans actually driving growth?” Intrinsic vs. extrinsic motivation11:00 – The trouble with “Let the plan weed people out” (Re: leadership avoidance)17:50 – What elite sellers really optimize for32:08 – Pay curves: exponential (x²), logarithmic, and thoughts on a hybrid40:47 – Private aviation lesson: operations, price perception, and the experience reps sell46:13 – Segmentation by buying motion (not company size)50:12 – Book recs and resourcesThe Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

Every meaningful comp change (think plan redesigns, quota models, and SPIFFs) lives or dies on buy-in. And all the best sales compensation leaders are agents of change. In this episode of The Sales Compensation Show, our host, Forma.ai CEO Nabeil Alazzam sits down with Dr. Jack Schafer, former FBI Special Agent and author of The Like Switch, to translate field-tested influence principles into everyday sales compensation leadership.You’ll learn the psychology behind trust and compliance, how to frame proposals to reduce status-quo bias, and ways to navigate high-stakes conversations across Sales, Finance, HR, and the C-suite. Jack breaks down rapport-building, objection handling under pressure, and language patterns that shift meetings from “no” to “let’s explore.” Whether you’re introducing a new comp model or steering a broader transformation, Jack shares tacktics for leading change with confidence.Episode notesGuest: Dr. Jack Schafer — former FBI Special Agent, behavioral analyst, and bestselling author of The Like Switch and The Truth Detector.Host: Nabeil Alazzam — CEO, Forma.ai.What you’ll learn:— A simple “like → trust → compliance” ladder for executive alignment— How to frame comp changes to counter loss aversion and status-quo bias— How to identify psychological and operational blockers The Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

In this special live episode of The Sales Compensation Show, we break from our usual format to spotlight a candid conversation with enterprise leaders running world-class sales performance programs.Guests:Dennis Johnson, Chief Financial Officer, QlikDr. Robert Bieshaar, Go-to-Market Performance Management, AutodeskShawn Rossi, VP Strategic Services, Forma.ai Topics covered:What “flipping the pyramid” means in enterprise sales performanceMaking the case for comp systems: risk reduction and revenue upsideHow you know it's time to evolve from Excel aloneAligning sales compensation to business strategy, not the other way aroundThe importance of cross-functional ownership: sales, finance, HR, opsWhy quota design is the hardest—and most visible—part to get rightHow SPIFFs can spiral into chaos (and what to do instead)Breaking the habit of “rogue comp” and last-minute incentivesAdvice for CFOs and sales leaders embarking on their SPM journeySubscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube to catch more tactical, expert conversations on sales performance management.The Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

When you lead global sales planning and compensation for more than 2,800 reps at a company like Docusign, every decision about territories, quotas, and incentives carries weight. A small tweak can drive alignment and performance — or create confusion and mistrust.That’s where Melissa Fenner, Sr. Director of Revenue Operations at Docusign, thrives. With a career spanning manufacturing, M&A, operational consulting, and SaaS, Melissa brings a rare blend of operational expertise and behavioral insight to the art and science of incentive design.In this episode Melissa shares the lessons she’s learned leading global sales compensation strategy — and what operators everywhere can apply today.Listen in for her takes on:Why overcommunication is non-negotiable: why you need to deliver the same message seven times, seven ways to build rep trust around comp plans.How to run pilots that build champions, not resistance: Including how to consider representative pilot groups to test major compensation changes, uncover blind spots, and create advocates who drove adoption at scale.Keeping planning on track when upstream inputs are shifting: Learn how Melissa’s accounts for guardrails and scenario models to design comp plans even when segmentation and quotas aren't finalized.When to lean into consistency vs. comp changes: Melissa shares her hot take about redesigning comp plans every year...Chapters01:22 — Melissa Fenner's Journey into Sales Compensation03:45 — The Importance of Overcommunication in Sales Compensation09:03 — The Power of Pilots 17:46 — Building and Executing Compensation Plans22:41 — Challenging Conventional Wisdom in Sales CompThe Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

When your organization is in hyper-growth mode, sales planning can quickly turn into organized chaos—or worse, just chaos. The pace of change is relentless, plans are constantly evolving, and keeping reps motivated and aligned can feel like chasing a moving target.That’s why we’re hitting pause on our regular programming to bring you this timely panel discussion from the Sales Planning Summit, featuring:Sid Kumar, Area VP, GTM Strategy & Planning at DatabricksMichael Duncan, Sr. Director, GTM Strategy & Operations at GongThese leaders have navigated the growing pains of scaling fast—and lived to share the playbook.In this episode, you’ll learn:How these pros design a sales planning process that can handle rapid growth without constant reinvention.Real ways to keep Sales, RevOps, and Finance in lockstep as complexity skyrockets.Strategies for keeping stakeholders engaged and confident during frequent plan updates.How to ramp new reps when compensation plans and territories are still shifting.What these leaders would (and wouldn’t) do again when faced with the challenges of scale.If your sales planning cycles feel like a race you’re always running from behind—this conversation will help you get out in front.The Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

How do finance and revenue teams stay aligned on aggressive sales goals and financial guardrails? Hear from senior revenue and finance leaders at ZoomInfo, Red Hat, and Klaviyo on how they negotiate targets, balance priorities, and manage risk—together.In this special edition of The Sales Compensation Show, we're bringing you a timely panel recorded live at the Sales Planning Summit—because aligning sales targets, quotas, and comp mid-year is no small feat.Join Forma.ai's David Gerardi as he moderates a candid discussion between:Mark Harris, SVP of GTM Strategy at ZoomInfoBrian Bolt, Sr. Director of Corporate Finance at Red HatStef Layne, VP of Treasury, Payroll & Sales Compensation at KlaviyoTogether, they dive into:How finance and revenue leaders approach sales planning from different anglesThe tug-of-war between growth and fiscal responsibility when setting targetsStories from the front lines of comp plan negotiationForecasting strategies that inspire confidence and reduce riskLessons learned from high-stakes planning conversationsThe Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

Sales plans aren’t meant to be static and mid-year is a make-or-break moment for revenue teams. Adjust your sales plan too late, and you risk missing your number. Move too fast, and you could disrupt the entire team. In this special episode of The Sales Compensation Show, Forma.ai’s David Gerardi sits down with sales performance leaders from Zoom, Snowflake, and Siemens to explore how the best organizations recognize when a pivot is needed—and how they execute changes without derailing momentum. Featuring guests:Dal Sidhu – Head of Global Sales Compensation, ZoomJames Jackson – Global Head of Sales Planning, Compensation & Systems, Snowflake, andElizabeth Walgram – Senior Director, Sales Compensation, SiemensListen in to learn:How to spot early signs your sales plan needs adjustmentKey metrics to guide data-driven decisionsWhen to realign quotas and territories—and how to do it without disrupting performanceHow to fine-tune compensation plans to keep teams motivatedReal-world mid-year adjustment strategies from these experienced leaders Subscribe to The Sales Compensation Show for more candid insights shaping the future of sales performance!The Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

With planning season in full swing at many organizations, this conversation offers a timely, practical lens into how global companies scale their planning process—and how you can apply the same principles, no matter your org size. Featuring leaders from LinkedIn, Docusign, and Atlassian, our guests explore what best-in-class sales planning looks like at scale.Together we cover how winning organizations align Sales, RevOps, and Finance, build trusted data foundations, and apply lessons from past performance to shape future strategies. The discussion also dives into common planning pitfalls and how to avoid them, as well as the growing role of AI and automation in streamlining the process. With planning season well underway at most orgs, this conversation is especially relevant!Tune in to hear:How these leaders get ahead of and execute sales planning across Sales, RevOps, and FinanceWhat it takes to create a trusted, flexible data foundationHow past performance is used to shape future strategy at these orgsCommon planning breakdowns—and how to avoid themThe increasing role of AI and automation in streamlining planning cyclesSubscribe to catch even more episodes from the Sales Planning Summit series.The Sales Compensation Show is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so