Ibogaine Uncovered

Ben "Doc" Askins is a physician assistant, US army captain, author and podcast host. He has two decades of experience practicing and teaching wilderness, tactical, and expeditionary medicine in the military. As a civilian, he is certified with the Multidisciplinary Association on Psychedelic Studies in MDMA-assisted therapy, and is a Psychiatric Physician Assistant offering ketamine assisted therapy in Kentucky. Doc is a National Outdoor Leadership school alum, a veteran of the Global War on Terrorism, and has postgraduate training in Neuropsychiatry and Genomics with a Masters in Divinity. Doc’s book, The Anti-Hero’s Journey: The Zero with a Thousand Faces, is described as a “warped war memoir about the way to attain enlightenment” (think of it as an integration therapy guide in the form of his life story). You might remember Doc from episode 22 – he was featured in our recap of the Kentucky Summit on Breakthrough Therapies for Opioid Use Disorder. What we discuss: Doc’s presence at the Kentucky Summit Why Doc thinks the idea of investing $42 million in ibogaine research in KY is “a terrible idea” A clinician’s perspective on ibogaine How Doc went from a straight-edge kid and member of the DARE club to a proponent of psychedelic assisted therapy America’s shifting perception of psychedelics Psychedelic assisted therapy for veterans The challenges of treating people suffering from suicidality Doc’s recommendations for post-treatment integration Reflecting on Doc’s book, The Anti-Hero’s JourneyWhy it’s important: With his strict Christian upbringing and army background, Doc might not be the first person you’d expect to be an advocate of breakthrough psychedelic therapies – but it’s precisely that background that qualifies him to speak to the ongoing crisis. As a Kentuckian with close personal connections to both the opioid and suidide crises, an active duty member of the Army National Guard, and a physician assistant (among many other things – he’s the first to call his background ‘eclectic’), Doc’s perspective on the state’s interest in funding ibogaine research is both well-informed and unique. He’s the first person I’ve heard call the plan “a terrible idea,” but not for the reason you might think. Speaking to his experience working in ketamine-assisted therapy, Doc offers insight into the kind of support a person suffering from suicidality requires, and explains why the window after a psychedelic experience is a critical time for people who have been facing treatment-resistant depression. Doc’s story is a testament to how tragedy can change our life’s course in an instant, and proof that even with years of “just say no” indoctrination, there’s hope that even the staunchly opposed could change their minds about psychedelic medicines like ibogaine. Relevant Links: Anti-Hero’s Journey website  Listen to Anti-Hero’s Journey podcast Ben “Doc” Askins on Instagram The Kentucky Summit on Exploring Breakthrough Therapeutic Potential for Opioid Use Disorder The Real Reason KY’s Attorney General Doesn’t Want My Opinion On Psychedelics (Brainz Magazine) An Open Letter To KY Governor Andy Beshear (Brainz Magazine) U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs: Posttraumatic Stress Disorder American Foundation for Suicide Prevention: Statistics

In this episode, host Amanda Siebert recaps the recent Kentucky Summit on Exploring Breakthrough Therapeutic Potential for Opioid Use Disorder, which was held in La Grange, Kentucky on November 30. The event brought together practitioners, researchers, policy makers, caregivers, and members of the community to discuss and learn about ibogaine, a psychedelic medicine that has been shown to interrupt opioid use disorder. Kentucky is considering allocating $42 million to study ibogaine after the state received nearly $900 million in settlements from opioid producers and distributors for their role in exacerbating the overdose crisis. In this episode, Amanda gets vulnerable, opening up for the first time publicly about her personal connection to the overdose crisis, and draws connections between the crisis in the Bluegrass state and the province of British Columbia, before highlighting some key discussion points brought up during the summit.What’s covered Amanda’s personal connection to the overdose crisis By the numbers: the impact of the overdose crisis in BC and beyond Kentucky: one of America’s hardest hit states Learning about psychedelics for substance use The power of story Recapping Kentucky’s interest in ibogaine Summit recap: Rick Doblin, Dr. Deborah Mash, Juliana Mulligan Stories from panelists Ciprianna Quann, Talia Eisenberg, Ben “Doc” Askins, and Karen Butcher Fear and frustration around access to psychedelic treatment, especially for BIPOC communitiesWhy it’s important: The overdose crisis is not limited to Kentucky – It exists in varying degrees in every American state and Canadian province, cutting across demographic lines and impacting urban and rural areas alike. Even as psychedelics become part of the mainstream, it’s jarring to see a place like Kentucky be the first to consider funding ibogaine research. What the summit illustrated is that with all of our differences, whether geographical, political, spiritual, or cultural in nature, the pain associated with substance use disorder and overdose is universal, and can unify us to seek out alternative solutions. By the end of the summit, it was clear everyone in the room agreed on one thing: when it comes to substance use disorder in the state of Kentucky and beyond, it’s time to do something different.Relevant Links: The Kentucky Summit on Exploring Breakthrough Therapeutic Potential for Opioid Use Disorder Overdoses the leading cause of death in B.C. for those aged for 10 to 59: coroner Drug Overdose Deaths Drug Overdose Mortality by State Beyond Drugs: The Universal Experience of Addiction (Dr. Gabor Mate)

Amy Fillinger is a travel agent and mom of three living in Arkansas. When Amy discovered ibogaine through social media, she assumed she’d learned about it to help her ex-husband who was suffering from alcohol use disorder, until she realized it was a tool that could help her on her own healing journey. She underwent ibogaine treatment at Beond about six months prior to the recording of this episode to help her heal from codependency and post-traumatic stress. What we discuss: Codependency and the idea of “relationship addiction” Amy’s path to the medicine and her first impression of ibogaine How Amy was feeling mentally, emotionally and physically before her ibogaine treatment Amy’s understanding of her codependent behavior before treatment Her intentions for the ibogaine experience, including facilitating forgiveness and letting go of anger The insights Amy received in her journey about her life, and particularly about her future Amy’s use of social media to document her (continuing) journey Using movement as an integration tool The self-limiting beliefs Amy experienced as a result of being in a codependent relationship How Amy’s relationship with family and romantic partners have shifted since her treatment Amy’s advice for other people who may be struggling with codependent behaviorWhy it’s important: Codependency is a learned behavior that can be passed down from one generation to another. It is an emotional and behavioral condition that affects an individual’s ability to have a healthy, mutually satisfying relationship. Codependency is sometimes referred to as “relationship addiction” because people with codependency often form or maintain relationships that are one-sided, emotionally destructive or abusive. It often affects a spouse, parent, or sibling of a person suffering from substance use disorder. Some estimates suggest that over 90 percent of the American population demonstrates codependent behavior from time to time. Amy’s experience with ibogaine is another example of how this powerful psychedelic medicine can help us work through an incredible gamut of struggles, issues and maladaptive coping mechanisms, whether we’re dealing with an addiction to a substance, a behavior, or a way of thinking. Relevant Links: Codependency explainer on Mental Health America Prevalence of codependency in the United States Study: Living with Addicted Men and Codependency: The Moderating Effect of Personality Traits Amy’s Instagram

Tricia Eastman is an author, speaker, medicine woman, facilitator, and the founder of Ancestral Heart, a non-profit organization dedicated to the preservation and deeper understanding of ancient ritual and Indigenous wisdom. Tricia is also the founder of Psychedelic Journeys, where she has curated transformative medicine experiences and retreats in different locations around the world and for which she is currently building a retreat center in the Azores Islands. Tricia has trained under two different Bwiti traditions and after nearly a decade of working with iboga, she has a deep understanding of its spiritual technology.What we discuss: Tricia’s introduction to the psychedelic realm and her experience working with different medicines, including iboga How ibogaine helped her overcome a lifelong struggle with eating disorders The different Bwiti traditions that she has been initiated into and trained under How stewardship informs Tricia’s work at Ancestral Heart and beyond The ritualistic use of iboga among the Bwiti for initiation The spiritual technology of iboga The difference between working with iboga in Gabon and receiving ibogaine in a clinic The cost of losing connection with ritual Are we being responsible stewards of this movement, and respectful of traditional practices and medicines that do not belong to us?  If not, what will it take?Why it’s important: Consider the definition of stewardship: the conducting, supervising, or managing of something, especially: the careful and responsible management of something entrusted to one's care. Now consider that word in the context of iboga and ibogaine. In a recent article for Psychedelic Alpha, author and medicine woman Tricia Eastman and co-author Dr. Joseph Barsuglia suggest that we ought to have a nuanced appreciation of stewardship in the context of iboga; considering it both an appreciation of the responsibility we owe to the cultures and ecosystems from which iboga is derived, and also the safety of those who ingest it. In this episode, Tricia, the founder of Ancestral Heart and Psychedelic Journeys, explains how connection to ritual helps build that appreciation, and how, without proper care, rushing to legalize or decriminalize iboga could have unintended consequences. The show ends with the question posed in the title: Are we being responsible stewards of this movement, and respectful of traditional practices and medicines that do not belong to us? Keep listening to find out. Relevant Links: Psychedelic Alpha article, “Ibogaine’s Surge in Popularity Could Be a Huge Loss for the Gabonese People Unless We Shift Course” Ancestral Heart website Psychedelic Journeys website Tricia Eastman on Instagram Stewardship definition, Merriam-Webster

David Nassim is the co-director of Blessings of the Forest (BOTF), an organization that supports environmental and traditionalist associations, Indigenous communities and administrative authorities committed to the preservation and sustainable development of Gabon’s natural and cultural heritage – including the preservation of iboga, the West African plant from which ibogaine is derived. David is also the organization’s international relations and finance officer, and a practitioner and Chinese medicine consultant. You might remember David from our interview at Psychedelic Science 2023, featured in Episode 16.What we discuss: The work that BOTF does and its role in the iboga supply chain The Nagoya Protocol: What it is, and how it informs the protection of the iboga plant and the communities that use it  The unseen challenges of working closely with a large number of different organizations, associations, and communities The role of iboga in David’s life, and the different Bwiti traditions that he has worked with How iboga is viewed globally: the different interpretations and understandings in the United States and Gabon What is at the root of the reverence Gabonese people have for iboga? The implications of Western interest, namely the Kentucky Opioid Abatement Advisory Program and its interest in ibogaine What questions to ask when determining how a practitioner has obtained iboga/ibogaine Is there any overlap between what you’ve learned from Chinese Medicine, and from your work with iboga?Why it’s important: In North America, ibogaine is a compound that most people associate with opioid use disorder, but in West Africa, specifically in Gabon, ibogaine is just one part of a much greater whole. In this episode, David Nassim explains in great detail the implications of increased global interest in the iboga plant for the Bwiti communities that depend on it. By leaning on the Nagoya Protocol on Access and Benefit-sharing, Blessings of the Forest is working to protect and preserve iboga while building meaningful relationships directly with communities that require support. David’s insights and understanding bring the issue of reciprocity into sharp focus, and challenge us to consider the global implications of pursuing a treatment like ibogaine.Relevant Links: Blessings of the Forest website The Nagoya Protocol on Access and Benefit-sharing Blessings of the Forest on Instagram Lucid News story featuring David: Gabon Takes First Step Toward Legal Export of Sustainable Iboga Ibogaine Uncovered: Episode 16 - The State of Ibogaine: A Psychedelic Science Recap ICEERS Report - The Future of Iboga: Perspectives from Central Africa

Dr. Gül Dölen, MD, PhD, is an associate professor of neuroscience at Johns Hopkins University. In her lab, her team focuses on how the brain enables social behaviors through basic neurobiological processes such as neuromodulation and synaptic plasticity. Dölen has led several headline-making studies in the psychedelic field, including one in 2018 that involved giving MDMA to octopuses, and a more recent study that revealed psychedelics can reopen the “critical period” in the brain.What we discuss: How Dr. Dölen became interested in studying psychedelics after focusing on learning and memory as well as the pathogenesis of autism The study that turned things around: why study the effects of psychedelics in an evolutionarily distant species like the octopus? What giving octopuses MDMA revealed about their normally solitary behavior The implications in the world of psychedelic science after studying their effects on this kind of animal Defining critical periods: What are they? What are the benefits of experiencing a critical period? Dr. Dölen’s hypothesis: Could psychedelics be the “master key” to reopening critical periods? Which drugs are best at reopening critical periods? Where does ibogaine stand? Are there any risks associated with experiencing an abundance of critical periods? The problem with the word ‘plasticity’Why it’s important: Dr. Dölen’s pioneering research–both the study of MDMA in octopuses and her more recent work on unlocking critical periods–allows us to look at psychedelic drugs in different ways: in evolutionarily distant species with entirely different brain structures, and as “master keys” that could potentially unlock those periods. While there aren’t many studies that put different psychedelic drugs on a spectrum of efficacy, her work shows that among MDMA, LSD, psilocybin, and ketamine, ibogaine leads the way when it comes to opening critical periods – a piece of information that (hopefully) encourages more scientists in the psychedelic space to study this powerful medicine. Relevant Links: Dr. Dölen’s faculty profile on Johns Hopkins Dr. Dölen, Center for Psychedelic & Consciousness Research, JHU Spectrum News: In Deep Water with Gül Dölen The Tim Ferriss Show: Dr. Gül Dölen  dölenLAB  Nature: Octopuses on ecstasy just want a cuddle Wired: The Psychedelic Scientist Who Sends Brains Back to Childhood The Microdose: 5 Questions for Gul Dolen

Talia Eisenberg, co-founder of Beond, and Vianey Perez, VP of clinical operations, dive into the vital intake process for ibogaine treatment. They discuss how individuals can navigate their journey towards healing, the thorough medical screening involved, and what makes a good candidate for treatment. Topics such as potential challenges clients may face, red flags during the intake, and the role of medical professionals in providing personalized care are explored. Their insights aim to alleviate anxieties related to pursuing ibogaine therapy.

This episode is a little different. Join host Amanda Siebert for an ibogaine-focused recap of the 2023 MAPS Psychedelic Science conference. This episode features audio clips from the closing ceremony featuring Norma Lotsof, and an in-person interview with David Nassim, the co-director of Blessings of the Forest.Topics of discussion: three ongoing ibogaine studies and the researchers behind them Lucy Walker’s latest film, Of Night and Light: The Story of Iboga and Ibogaine, and the (long overdue) recognition of Norma Lotsof the role of veterans in relation to psychedelic policy efforts in Kentucky to study ibogaine for opioid use disorder the implications of increased ibogaine use in North America for communities in Gabon (where iboga is harvested) the important work of the non-profit organization Blessings of the ForestWhy it’s important: Amanda’s mission in attending Psychedelic Science 2023 was to learn as much as she could about where ibogaine is at, not just from a medical or political standpoint, but from a cultural one, too. Tune in to hear her relay knowledge from experts who have been critical to the support we see for ibogaine treatment and therapy, and from advocates who are doing the challenging work of ensuring that this medicine is harvested and used in a sustainable way.Relevant Links: Psychedelic Science 2023 Dr. Nolan Williams’ Pilot Study Dr. Jose Carlos Bouso’s Pilot Study Dr. Deborah Mash’s Study Lucy Walker on Instagram Of Night and Light on Deadline.com Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions (VETS) Recent Lucid News story on Kentucky initiative by Noah Daly Blessings of the Forest ICCERS Indigenous Medicine Conservations Fund

David Bronner is the CEO – that’s Cosmic Engagement Officer – of Dr. Bronner’s, a fifth-generation soap maker, and a board member of the Multidisciplinary Association of Psychedelic Studies. At the helm of the company started by his grandfather in 1948, David is a leader in the fight for GMO labeling, industrial hemp farming in the United States, high-bar organic and fair trade standards, fair minimum wage, and drug policy reform. What we discuss: How a profound psychedelic experience took David from an apolitical college graduate and set him on the path to becoming a counter cultural thought leader I ask him What it means to be passionate about “the responsible integration of psychedelic medicine into  American culture” – especially within the capitalistic framework within which we exist Dr. Bronner being the first company in the U.S. to offer ketamine-assisted therapy as part of employee health coverage How David found iboga through his friend and former Navy SEAL Marcus Capone What iboga/ibogaine can do for the veteran population  Will we see the mainstreaming of ibogaine like we have with psilocybin? What David’s favorite integration tools are Parallels between the overharvesting of certain plant medicines and industrial agricultureWhy it’s important: Given all the ongoing evil in the world, it can be easy to feel swallowed up by capitalism – to feel stuck, hopeless, and afraid for the future. My conversation with David reminded me that even within an ill-structured system, it takes just a few people in positions of leadership – people like David and David’s father and grandfather –  to spark change and inspire more holistic business practices, and ultimately, more holistic ways of living. Relevant Links: Rolling Stone Interview (May 2023) New York Times Profile (Feb 2022) Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions (VETS) Dr. Bronner’s on Instagram Time Magazine story about Marcus Capone’s experience with Ibogaine (April 2021) Blog about David Bronner’s experience with iboga Iboga and ibogaine safety panel featuring David Bronner (April 2020)

Dr. Deborah Mash is a pioneering researcher of ibogaine and one of the world’s foremost experts on the drug. She is a professor (emeritus) of neurology and molecular and cellular pharmacology at the University of Miami School of Medicine, and the founder and CEO of DemeRx, a company developing treatments for opioid use disorder. What we discuss: How Dr. Mash first became interested in ibogaine, including her connection to Howard Lotsof, an early ibogaine advocate The structure of the ibogaine molecule and what makes it unique from other psychedelics Dr. Mash’s early research: the first clinical studies of ibogaine in humans Noribogaine: what it is and what it does  Ibogaine fatalities: is everyone who takes it is at equal risk of death? How far have we come in terms of reframing our view of substance use disorder? If ibogaine was rescheduled, what could the future of treatment look like?Why it’s important: In the excitement of the psychedelic renaissance, it can feel like all of this is “new.” It’s often said that there isn't enough research to support the use of ibogaine in a clinical setting, but Dr. Mash’s work is part of a growing body of evidence that proves otherwise. Reconciling her work and the stories you’ve heard on this show with the fact that ibogaine is still a Schedule I substance in the United States – meaning it has no medical value and a high potential for abuse – is hard to do. Understanding and working to change drug policy through research is a long game. We’re lucky that an expert like Dr. Mash is staying on the field.Relevant Links: Dr. Mash’s research: Breaking the cycle of opioid use disorder with Ibogaine (2017) Noribogaine is a G-protein biased κ-opioid receptor agonist (2015 Medication Development of Ibogaine as a Pharmacotherapy for Drug Dependence (2006) Ibogaine: Complex Pharmacokinetics, Concerns for Safety, and Preliminary Efficacy Measures (2006) Identification of a primary metabolite of ibogaine that targets serotonin transporters and elevates serotonin (1995) Dr. Mash’s company, DemeRx 1996 Interview with Dr. Deborah Mash (archived) Dr. Mash’s Twitter