GeriPal - A Geriatrics and Palliative Care Podcast

Hospitals are hazardous places for older adults. These hazards include delirium, malnutrition, falls, infections, and hospital associated disability (which about ⅓ of older adults get during a hospital stay).  What if, for at least some older adults who need acute-level care, instead of treating them in the hospital, we treat them at home? That’s the focus of the hospital-at-home movement, and the subject we talk about in this week’s podcast. We talk with Bruce Leff and Tacara Soones about the hospital-at-home movement, which has been shown to reduce costs, improve outcomes and improve the patient experience. In addition to discussing these outcomes, we also discuss: The history of the hospital-at-home movement. The practicalities of how it works including who are good candidates, where does it start (the ED?), what happens at home, do you need a caregiver, what happens if they need something like imaging? How is it financed and what comes next? If you are interested in learning more and meeting a community of folks interested in hospital-at-home, check out the hospital-at-home user group at hahusersgroup.org or some of these publications:  Hospital-Level Care at Home for Acutely Ill Adults: A Randomized Controlled Trial. Annals of Int Med. 2020 Hospital at Home-Plus: A Platform of Facility-Based Care. JAGS Hospital-at-Home Interventions vs In-Hospital Stay for Patients With Chronic Disease Who Present to the Emergency Department: A Systematic Review and Meta-analysis. JAMA Network Open  

The comprehensive geriatric assessment is one of the cornerstones of geriatrics.  But does the geriatric assessment do anything?  Does it improve outcomes that patients, caregivers, and clinicians care about? Evidence has been mounting about the importance of the geriatric assessment for older adults with cancer, the subject of today’s podcast.  The geriatric assessment has been shown in two landmark studies (Lancet and JAMA Oncology) to reduce high grade toxicity, improve patient and caregiver satisfaction, and improve completion of advance directives (can listen to our prior podcast on this issue here).  Based on this surge in evidence, the American Society of Clinical Oncologists recently updated their guidelines for care of older adults to state that all older adults receiving systemic therapy (including chemo, immuno, targeted, hormonal therapy) should receive geriatric assessment guided care.  We talk about these new guidelines today with William Dale, a geriatrician at City of Hope and lead author of the guideline update in the Journal of Clinical Oncology, Mazie Tsang, palliative care/heme/onc physician-researcher at Mayo Clinic Arizona who authored a study of geriatric and palliative conditions in older adults with poor prognosis cancers published in JAGS, and John Simmons, a retired heme/onc doctor, cancer survivor, and patient advocate.  We talk about: What is a practical geriatric assessment and how can busy oncologists actually do one? (hint: 80% can be done in advance by patients or caregivers) Why is it that some oncologists are resistant to conducting a geriatric assessment, yet have no problem ordering tests that cost thousands of dollars? What can you do with the results of a geriatric assessment? How does the geriatric assessment lead to improved completion of advance directives, when the assessment doesn’t address advance care planning/directives at all? How does palliative care fit into all this?  Precision medicine? What groups are being left out of trials? What are the incentives to get oncologists and health systems to adopt the geriatric assessment?   And Mazie, who is from Hawaii, requested the song Hawaii Aloha in honor of the victims of the wildfire disaster on Maui.  You can donate to the Hawaii Red Cross here. Aloha, -@AlexSmithMD   Additional Links: Brief ASCO Video of how to conduct a practical geriatrics assessment Brief ASCO Video of how to use the results of a practical geriatrics assessment Time to stop saying the geriatric assessment is too time consuming    

How do people react when they hear they have a serious illness?  Shock, “like a car is rushing straight at me” (says Bill Gardner on our podcast).  After the shock?  Many people strive, struggle, crawl even back toward a “normal” life.  And some people, in addition or instead, engage in deep introspection on how to make meaning or live with or understand this experience of serious illness.  Today we talk with deep thinkers about this issue.  Bill Gardner is a psychologist living with advanced cancer who blogs “I have serious news,” Brad Stuart is an internist and former hospice director whose book is titled, “Facing Death: Spirituality, Science, and Surrender at the End of Life,” and Juliet Jacobson is a palliative care doc who wrote a paper finding that geriatricians do NOT consider aging a serious illness.   We have a wide ranging conversation that touches on how to place aging, disability, and multimorbidity in the context of serious illness conversations, “striving toward normal,” stoicism, existentialism, psychedelics, the goals of medicine, medical aid in dying and more.  We could have talked for hours! And I get to play a Bob Dylan song that’s been on my bucket list to learn. Enjoy! -@AlexSmithMD   Additional links: Bill Gardner’s article about MAID in Comment Magazine https://comment.org/death-by-referral/ Bill Gardner’s articles about living with terminal cancer in Mockingbird Magazine: https://mbird.com/art/cancer-in-advent/ https://mbird.com/religion/testimony/in-the-electors-school/ Brad Stuat’s website: https://bradstuartmd.com Juliet mentioned: On existential threat and terror management: The Worm at the Core: On the role of death in life by Soloman, Greenberg, and Pyszczynski On how existential threat is stored in the brain. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31401240/   Papers on “striving toward normalcy” in the setting of serious illness https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36893571/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35729779/    

I hear the word dignity used a lot in the medical setting, but I’m never sure what people mean when they use it.  You’d imagine that as a seasoned palliative care doc, I’d have a pretty good definition by now of what “maintaining dignity” or “loss of dignity” means, but you’d be sadly wrong. Well that all changes today as we’ve invited the world's foremost expert in dignity at the end of life, Dr. Harvey Max Chochinov, to join us on the podcast.  Harvey is probably best known for his work in developing dignity therapy, a psychological intervention designed specifically to address many of the psychological, existential, and spiritual challenges that patients and their families face as death approaches. We talk with Harvey about how he defines “dignity” and how we can understand what it means to our patients. We also talk about easy and quick ways to address dignity and personhood by using the Patient Dignity Question (PDQ), which asks “what do I need to know about you as a person to give you the best care possible.”  In addition, we talk with Harvey about some other recent publications he has written, including one on “Intensive Caring” and one on the “Platinum Rule” (do unto others as they would want done unto themselves). So take a listen and if you are interested in learning more, check out these wonderful links: Harvey’s latest book is called, Dignity in Care: The Human Side of Medicine Intensive Caring: Reminding Patients They Matter  Michael J. Fox gives patients hope there may be a place that illness doesn’t touch Depression is a Liar Why is Being a Patient Such a Difficult Pill to Swallow Better Patient Care Calls for a ‘Platinum Rule’ to Replace the Golden One. Scientific American  Letter to the Editor: Response to Downar et al. Medical Assistance in Dying and Palliative Care: Shared Trajectories   

It's been over two years since one of the worst product launches of all time - Aduhelm (aducanumab).  Praised by the FDA, Alzheimer’s Association (AA), and Pharma as a “game changer”, but derided by others for the drug’s lack of clinical efficacy, risk of severe adverse effects, absence of diversity in trial populations, high costs, and an FDA approval process that was in the kindest words “rife with irregularities”. Instead of Biogen’s expected billions of dollars of revenue from Aduhelm, they brought in only $3 million in revenue for all of 2021 (here is my Twitter summary of this fiasco). The outlook on amyloid antibodies are looking brighter though in 2023.  Phase III studies for lecanemab and donanemab have been published showing less worsening of cognition and function receiving these agents versus placebo. This led the FDA to give full approval for lecanemab, which will likely be followed by full approval of donanemab sometime this year. However, as noted in our editorial published with the donanemab trial, the modest benefits of amyloid antibodies would likely not be questioned by patients, clinicians, or payers if amyloid antibodies were low risk, inexpensive, and simple to administer.  However, they are none of these.  So what is the role of individuals like geriatricians in prescribing amyloid antibodies and caring for individuals who are receiving them?  We invited three geriatricians and memory care doctors, Nate Chin, Sharon Brangman, and Jason Karlawish, to talk about this question and many others swirling around on how to safely prescribe these drugs and manage patients on them (like what to do about anticoagulation). Lastly, we also spend a little bit of time talking about the NIA-AA draft statement on redefining Alzhiemers disease.  There is a lot to digest with these draft clinical guidelines but the big change from the 2018 guideline is moving Alzheimers to a biological diagnosis (biomarker evidence only) not just for a research framework but now from a clinical one.  One outcome would be a very large population of older adults with normal cognition could now be classified as having Alzheimer's disease (maybe about a 1/3 of cognitively normal 75 year olds based on PET). So if you have thoughts on the matter, please give your feedback here to the NIA and AA. https://aaic.alz.org/nia-aa.asp By: Eric Widera

Insomnia. We’ve all had it. Lying in bed at 2 am staring at the ceiling, getting anxious every hour that you’re not falling asleep as you have a busy day coming up. Insomnia sucks.  Chronic insomnia sucks even more. For those with serious illness, sleep problems and insomnia are all too common.  Instead of reflexively jumping to melatonin or ambien, on today's podcast we talk with two sleep experts, Cathy Alessi and Brienne Miner, about a better approach to sleep problems and insomnia. We will go over epidemiology of insomnia, how these experts think about work up including which medications to avoid or discontinue, non-pharmacological treatment such as cognitive behavioral therapy for insomnia (CBT-I), and what if any is the role of pharmacological therapy in including newer agents like melatonin receptor agonists (ramelteon) and dual orexin receptor antagonists (like suvorexant).

There’s a saying, “never let a crisis go to waste.”  The pandemic was horrific in many ways.  One positive change that came about was the lifting of restrictions around the use of telemedicine.  Clinicians could care for patients across state lines, could prescribe opioids without in person visits, could bill at higher rates for telemedicine than previous to the pandemic.  Many patients benefited, not only those isolating due to covid, but also patients in rural areas, patients who are homebound, and many others.  So now that the emergency response has ended, what’s to be done?  In this podcast, Joe Rotella, Chief Medical Officer of the American Academy of Hospice and Palliative Medicine, Brook Calton, Palliative Care doc at Massachusetts General Hospital and Medical Director at Devoted Health, and Carly Zapata, Palliative Care doc at UCSF and fellowship director, talk about the importance of maintaining access to telehealth for the good of patients with serious illness.  This DEA is taking 6-months to consider how to move forward vis a vis restrictions and requirements for telehealth in a post-pandemic world.  Now is the time to act, dear listeners!  You can: Write an Op-Ed to your local paper as Carly Zapata and colleagues did.  Start with a story as Carly did in her Op Ed.  Stories trump data. Write to your congressperson. See the AAHPM Legislative Action Center https://www.votervoice.net/AAHPMORG/home Write to the DEA, with guidance from AAHPM’s comments to the DEA March 2023. Advocate for the CONNECT for Health Act, which would permanently expand access to telehealth for Medicare beneficiaries: https://www.schatz.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/connect_for_health_act_2023_summary1.pdf Much more on this podcast, including puzzling out who the characters in Space Oddity by David Bowie might represent in an extended analogy to telehealth.  Enjoy! -@AlexSmithMD

Today’s podcast is a follow up to our 2018 podcast with Randy Curtis about the Jumpstart intervention.  On that podcast he and collaborators tested a combined patient and clinician facing communication priming intervention to promote goals of care conversations.  Today we discuss a new paper in JAMA that tests a stripped down version of the clinician only facing intervention in a pragmatic randomized trial for older adults with serious illness and those 80+.  They found a difference of 4% in documented goals of care discussions.  Is 4% meaningful?  You’ll have to decide for yourself, though it likely is meaningful on a population basis.  Intriguingly, in a sub-analysis, they found a much higher rate of difference among minoritized older adults - more like 10%.  In a compelling editorial, Doug White and Sarah Anderson argue that even a 4% difference is important on a population basis, and that higher rates of difference among minoritized older adults demonstrate the potential of the intervention to address long-standing disparities in goals of care. Randy Curtis was first author of the JAMA paper.  Randy died February 26, 2023.  We begin today’s podcast asking his co-authors Erin Kross, Bob Lee, and Ruth Engelberg, all from the University of Washington and the Cambia Palliative Care Center of Excellence, to reflect on Randy and his dedication to seeing this work completed while living with ALS.  Eric and I also reflect on the podcast Randy generously did with us on his experience living with and studying serious illness.  We have lost a giant.  He is sorely missed, and celebrated. And…the guests torture me about songs I can’t play with the word Jump. -@AlexSmithMD  

You may have heard of Area Agencies on Aging, but do you really know what they do or how they do it?  What about State Departments of Aging or state master plans for aging?  Do you know how these agencies fit in with programs like Meals-on-Wheels or other nutritional support programs? Is your brain hurting yet with all these questions?  No?  Ok, what about Aging and Disability Resource Connection (ADRC) services? Well, if you are like me, you’ve probably heard of these programs but are at a loss to know exactly what they do.  On today's podcast we dive deep into how state and local governments are addressing the needs of older adults, answering all of these questions and more thanks to our three amazing guests: Susan DeMarois (the Director of California Department of Aging), Greg Olsen (the Director of the New York State Office for the Aging), and Lindsey Yourman (the Chief Geriatric Officer for the County of San Diego). It’s a fun podcast with our guest bringing in a ton of knowledge and passion for the work that they do.  If there is one take-away from the podcast, it is something Dr. Yourman emailed me after we met: “My hope is that every geriatrics clinician/Geriatrics Department/Division that listens to our podcast will be motivated to reach out to their Area Agency on Aging (if they haven't done so previously) to ask for a meet and greet and to learn about their resources, services, and recommended community-based organizations for older people.” To learn more about what we talked about, check out the following links: Eldercare Locator, a public service of the U.S. Administration on Aging connecting you to services for older adults and their families California’s Master Plan for Aging New York’s Master Plan for Aging  

I don't know 'bout religion I only know what I see And in the end when I hold their hand It's both of us set free These are the ending lyrics to Bonnie Raitt’s song “Down the Hall”, an ode to the Pastoral Care Workers who care for their fellow inmates in the hospice unit at the California Medical Facility in Vacaville, California. On last week’s podcast we interviewed the medical director and the chaplain of the prison’s hospice unit (Hospice in Prison Part 1).  This week we turn our attention to the inmates. Pastoral Care Workers are inmates who volunteer time to care for the dying who come from all around California to spend their last days, weeks or months in the prison’s hospice unit, fulfilling a mission that “no prisoner dies alone.” On today's podcast we talk with three of these Pastoral Care Workers, Jerry Judson, Jeffrey Maria, and Allan Krenitzky. We discuss with them why they decided to volunteer for the hospice unit, what a day in the life of a Pastoral Care Worker looks like, and among other things their thoughts on forgiveness, redemption, rehabilitation, and compassionate release. We also had the pleasure to take a walk through the hospice unit garden with Mr. Gerald Hite. He taught us a little about the different flowers and plants, and along the way a little about why he does what he does. While this is a podcast about volunteers in a prison hospice, I think it also serves as a lesson for us all about how we make meaning to our own lives and define ourselves by not only what we have done in the past, but what we do now.  One story that Allan told perfectly sums this up. He said one day his son asked his wife what he does for a living, and his wife said “Papa helps sick people.”