Her journey started with wearing a black armband to school and proceeded to the landmark United States Supreme Court case Tinker v. Des Moines Independent School District (1969). But it by no means stopped there: Mary Beth Tinker, namesake of the “Tinker” decision, continues to be a free speech icon.   On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we share with you an unabridged version of a 2016 conversation between Tinker and attorney Robert Corn-Revere, in which Tinker sheds light on her case and the state of student speech rights nearly 50 years later. Show notes: Podcast transcript Abridged video of the conversation Tinker v. Des Moines Independent School District (1969) The picture of a young Mary Beth Tinker with her mother and father, as described in the episode Past podcasts with Robert Corn-Revere: Free speech at the U.S. Supreme Court, Censorship: the ‘bastard child of technology’, Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission debate www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

Against ‘Free Speech’ with Anthony Leaker What does it mean to be “against ‘free speech?’” On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we speak with Anthony Leaker. Earlier this year he wrote an essay for Cato Unbound called “Against ‘Free Speech’,” in which he professes skepticism of the prevailing free speech narrative in the West and argues that it is often used as a Trojan Horse for far-right wing and fascist propaganda. Leaker is a principal lecturer in cultural and critical theory at the University of Brighton in England. Show notes: Podcast transcript Against “Free Speech” by Anthony Leaker Cato Unbound, June 2018: Free Speech in International Perspective www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

Has every fact we’ve ever known undergone revision or reversal? It’s a provocative and consequential idea, and one that complexity scientist Samuel Arbesman argues has some truth to it — even if he wouldn’t state it that strongly. On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we talk with Arbesman about his 2012 book, The Half-Life of Facts: Why Everything We Know Has an Expiration Date. If facts about our world are constantly shifting, shouldn’t the protection of free speech — the right to openly question the world and all we believe about it — become even more critical? We explore what, if any, implications Arbesman’s argument has for those who care about free speech and open inquiry. Show notes: Podcast transcript http://www.Arbesman.net “World citation and collaboration networks: uncovering the role of geography in science” “Non-compete Agreements: Barriers to Entry … and Exit?” “How a Copyright Mistake Created the Modern Zombie” “Undiscovered Public Knowledge” by Don R. Swanson www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

Zachary Wood has become comfortable with uncomfortable conversations. He’s engaged in them his entire life — with his mom who suffers from schizoaffective disorder, with his neighbors in Washington, D.C.’s impoverished Ward 8 community, and with his friends at the elite private high school he commuted four hours round trip to each day. So when Wood arrived at Williams College in 2014, he was prepared for the uncomfortable learning that comes along with uncomfortable conversations about the world’s most important and controversial issues. Unfortunately, he was quick to learn not everyone was up for the challenge — including his college president. On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we talk with Wood about his new memoir, Uncensored: My Life and Uncomfortable Conversations at the Intersection of Black and White America. Show notes: Podcast transcript Randall Kennedy So to Speak podcast “Williams College Bars ‘Uncomfortable Learning’ Speaker from Campus, Declares ‘Hate Speech’ Too Uncomfortable” “The Condescending Paternalism of Williams President Adam Falk” The Chicago Statement “In Response to the ‘Chicago Statement’ Petition” (Williams College student petition) www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

“Words are weapons in the world’s most lyrical sport.” That’s how competitive battle rap is described by the makers of “Bodied,” a new satirical film produced by Eminem about a college student who decides to write a thesis paper on battle rap and through a twist of fate finds himself becoming a prodigy in the sport. On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we speak with“Bodied” director Joseph Kahn. Kahn is a filmmaker and Grammy-award winning music video director, who has directed videos for Taylor Swift, Imagine Dragons, Blink 182, Britney Spears, Maroon 5, and many other best-selling artists. Kahn describes himself as a free speech absolutist. During the course of this conversation, we unpack what that means and take a look at the free speech interests in his new, controversial film. Show notes: Joseph Kahn podcast transcript Bodied movie trailer: https://youtube.com/watch?v=oUry7CpMpCE Bodied is in theaters now and will be available on YouTube Premium on Nov. 28 BodiedMovie.com JosephKahn.com “Joseph Kahn doesn’t care if he’s ‘canceled’” — Vulture, Nov. 2, 2018 “Power/Rangers (unauthorized NSFW bootleg)” www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we discuss how decision-making, “information liquidity,” and luck fit into our daily lives — and how a solid understanding of these concepts can point to an underappreciated benefit of free expression. Our guest is Annie Duke. She is a decision strategist, renowned poker player, and author of Thinking in Bets: Making Smarter Decisions When You Don’t Have All the Facts. Duke won more than $4 million in tournament poker during her career, and in 2004 she won the World Series of Poker Tournament of Champions. Show notes: Podcast transcript AnnieDuke.com Thinking in Bets: Making Smarter Decisions When You Don’t Have All the Facts Friedrich Hayek’s “The Use of Knowledge in Society” www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we speak with Jameel Jaffer, executive director of the Knight First Amendment Institute at Columbia University. Jaffer and the Knight Institute seek to defend “the freedoms of speech and the press in the digital era through strategic litigation, research, and public education.” Show notes: Podcast transcript Knight First Amendment Institute website Clapper v. Amnesty International, the U.S. Supreme Court case Jaffer argued challenging the constitutionality of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. So to Speak podcast with Glenn Greenwald on free speech and privacy Knight Institute v. Trump, the Knight Institute’s legal challenge to President Donald Trump’s blocking of critics on Twitter. “Knight Institute calls on Facebook to lift restrictions on digital journalism and research” www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we partner with the First Amendment Salon to present a conversation between former Solicitor General of the United States Donald B. Verrilli Jr. and University of Washington School of Law scholar Ronald Collins. Verrilli was solicitor general of the United States from June 2011 to June 2016 and during that time he argued dozens of cases in front of the U.S. Supreme Court, including many First Amendment cases. He is now a partner with Munger, Tolles & Olson, and the founder of its Washington, D.C. office. During this conversation, Verrilli and Collins discuss Verrilli’s advocacy in front of the Supreme Court on First Amendment cases and beyond. Verrilli also provides his take on the future of the court. The First Amendment Salon is a quarterly gathering of members of the First Amendment community for a 90-minute discussion with leading thinkers concerning a timely topic related to freedom of expression.A video version of this and past First Amendment Salon conversations can be found on FIRE’s YouTube page. To learn more about the First Amendment Salon, visit the Salon’s archive on FIRE’s First Amendment Library. www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: facebook.com/sotospeakpodcastEmail us: sotospeak@thefire.org

There are very few exceptions to the First Amendment, and a “true threat” is one of them. But defining a true threat isn’t easy. Ever since the U.S. Supreme Court first examined true threats in the 1969 case Watts v. United States, it’s been a messy doctrine. The court didn’t provide a definition of a true threat until many years after Watts, and even then questions still remained. On today’s episode of So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast, we discuss the true threats doctrine with First Amendment scholar and FIRE Legal Fellow David L. Hudson Jr. He is the author of an ABA Journal article about true threats titled “When do rants exceed First Amendment boundaries and become true threats?” Also, don’t miss Hudson tell the story of many important student free speech court cases as part of our “FIRE Starter” video series. You can watch the short videos on FIRE’s YouTube channel at YouTube.com/theFIREorg. www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org

Tribalism and group polarization are on the rise. So too are rates of anxiety, depression, and suicide. On campuses, professors and students are afraid to speak out. And on social media, outrage mobs rule the day. How did we get here? On today’s episode of So to Speak, we are joined by FIRE President and CEO Greg Lukianoff to discuss his new co-authored book with New York University professor Jonathan Haidt, “The Coddling of the American Mind: How Good Intentions and Bad Ideas Are Setting Up a Generation for Failure.” It’s a social science detective story that seeks to explain “the growing inability of Americans to live, work, and cooperate across party lines” — and in this discussion, Greg points us toward all the clues. www.sotospeakpodcast.com Follow us on Twitter: twitter.com/freespeechtalk Like us on Facebook: facebook.com/sotospeakpodcast Email us: sotospeak@thefire.org