Urban Warfare Project

In this episode, John Spencer is joined by Dr. Deane Baker, an associate professor at the University of New South Wales, Canberra at the Australian Defence Force Academy. He specializes in the ethics of armed conflict, and he joins the podcast to discuss his research on military ethics and how ethical dilemmas present themselves on the battlefield. In particular, he explains why urban warfare creates a context that generates unique ethical concerns—concerns that remain unresolved and are of interest to both warfighters and ethicists.

Almost immediately after Hamas launched its brutal set of terrorist attacks in Israel, it became clear that the Israel Defense Forces would respond militarily. That meant a campaign against Hamas targets in Gaza. Because of Gaza's heavily urban terrain and the specific location of Hamas military forces, the fight has occurred—and will continue to occur—in deeply challenging environments for military forces, places where the law of armed conflict's provisions aimed at protecting civilians must be followed. To understand the specific measures in place to do so, John Spencer is joined on this episode by Lieutenant Colonel Jonathan Conricus, a spokesman for the Israel Defense Forces. He describes the range of mechanisms adopted by Israeli forces to minimize incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, and damage to civilian property in urban warfare.

If the Israel Defense Forces conduct a ground campaign in Gaza, the threat of Hamas tunnels will be one of the most significant challenges to contend with. But how many of these tunnels are there? What can Israeli forces do about the tunnels when they encounter them? Can they seal them? Can they destroy them with bunker-buster munitions or other explosives? The answers to these questions are not simple. In this episode, John Spencer welcomes Dr. Daphne Richemond-Barak back to the show. She is a professor at the Lauder School of Government, Diplomacy, and Strategy at Reichman University, author of the book Underground Warfare, and creator of the International Working Group on Subterranean Warfare.

On October 7, when the militant group Hamas launched a large-scale set of coordinated attacks against Israel, the tragic result was the deadliest day in the country's history. In this episode, host John Spencer is joined by Dr. Jacob Stoil, the chair of applied history at the Modern War Institute and an associate professor of military history at the US Army School of Advanced Military Studies. Together, they trace the Israel Defense Forces' initial response and contextualize the massive mobilization of three hundred thousand military reservists. This sets the stage for the discussion to explore an important question: If Israel launches a ground campaign into Gaza, what can they expect to encounter?

What incentives do armed actors have to operate in subterranean environments? What are some of the unique challenges that underground spaces pose to military forces? And why is underground warfare occurring increasingly frequently? To explore those questions and other features of conflict in the exceptional terrain of the subterranean, this episode features a conversation with Dr. Daphne Richemond-Barak, an assistant professor at the Lauder School of Government, Diplomacy, and Strategy, head of the international law desk of the International Institute for Counter-Terrorism at IDC Herzliya, and author of the book Underground Warfare.

On February 24, 2022, when Russian forces invaded Ukraine, they quickly targeted several key cities. One of those was the industrial hub of Mariupol. For three months, Ukrainian forces defending the city held out, until they were told to surrender on May 20. While thousands were taken into captivity, many whom are still being held as prisoners of wars, at least one civilian fighter, a man named Gennadiy, survived and remained in the city. In this episode of MWI’s Urban Warfare Project Podcast, John Spencer tells the story of the man who fought the Russian invaders at the Battle of Mariupol, was captured and tortured, resisted, escaped, and survived in the rubble of the city for nine months, before he was rescued in an operation by Ukrainian special operations forces.

In this discussion, Erik Kramer, a retired US Army Lieutenant Colonel and co-founder of the Ukraine Defense Support Group, shares his experience training Ukrainian forces in urban warfare. He elaborates on the evolution of Ukraine's military from a Soviet model to a modernized structure. Kramer highlights the unique challenges of urban combat and the importance of adapting training methods to real-world scenarios. He also addresses misconceptions about military tactics and the vital role of hands-on training for Ukrainian soldiers amid ongoing conflict.

Stuart Lyle, Urban Operations Research Lead for the UK's Defence Science and Technology Laboratory, discusses the innovative Phalanx unit designed for urban warfare. He shares insights on historical influences shaping this approach and the need for military adaptation to urban environments. The conversation highlights changes in British Army infantry structures and the integration of advanced technologies like drones. Lyle emphasizes the tactical innovations required to tackle the unique challenges of modern urban battlefields.

Since Russia's invasion of Ukraine last year, a series of battles have taken place for control of cities—Kherson, Mariupol, Kharkiv, and many more. Each of those fights have shared a common characteristic—the presence of civilians—that also represents one of the greatest challenges in urban warfare. Specifically, how can a military force protect noncombatants while it seeks to accomplish its objectives in a city? To explore this question, John Spencer is joined on this episode by Sahr Muhammedally from the Center for Civilians in Conflict, a nongovernmental organization that seeks to convince parties to armed conflicts to recognize the dignity and rights of civilians.

When Russia invaded Ukraine in February 2022, one of its first targets was the city of Mariupol. Despite being outnumbered by—and less well equipped than—their adversaries, Ukrainian defenders held out for three months. As the Russian siege of the city intensified, Ukrainian forces defended a shrinking perimeter with a command post in the Azovstal steel plant. One of those Ukrainian defenders was Sergeant Arseniy Fedosiuk. He joins John Spencer on this episode, relaying his experience in Mariupol, exploring the unique challenges of defending urban terrain against a superior enemy, and describing what happened at the end of the three-month battle, when he was taken prisoner by Russian forces.