21 Hats Podcast

All businesses have ups and downs. This week, Tracy Bech, CEO of Starboard Collectives and co-author of the “60 Minute CFO,” offers some guidance on when to ride out a slow period and when to take action. Plus, she also talks about how she’s building an AI tool to help with financial analysis and when it makes sense to hire a fractional CFO.

This week, in episode 184, Mel Gravely, Liz Picarazzi, and Jaci Russo talk about how they set prices. Jaci explains why she refuses to respond to requests for proposals. “We have not participated in a single RFP in 15 years,” she says, “and we won’t under my watch.” Mel explains how his construction company manages to get work despite always being among the highest-priced bidders (which is why he never gets government jobs). And Liz tells us what happened when she was forced to raise prices because of the tariffs placed on goods manufactured in China. But first, she tells us what she’s thinking now that there’s a possibility those tariffs could go to 60 percent. Plus: We review how the three owners handle employee reviews.

This week, Gene tells Loren Feldman about a little experiment he ran recently in which he boosted a post on X, formerly known as Twitter, that was designed to send people interested in his book on customer relations software to a landing page on his website. X reported that the post was a big success. But was it? Gene offers a slightly profane rebuttal. Plus: He also talks about three Jeff Bezos quotes that he believes can change how you run your business, and he explains how companies can commit wage theft without even realizing it.

This week, in episode 183, Paul Downs, Jay Goltz, and Sarah Segal talk about sexual harassment and where you draw the line with employees. Is it sexual harassment for one employee to ask another for a date? Is it sexual harassment to ask twice? Does it make sense to have a policy of zero tolerance? Or is it better to leave room for discretion and judgment? The conversation was sparked by a recent situation Jay experienced with an employee who had been with the company for almost three decades, having started at the age of 17. “It was a very sad thing,” Jay tells us.Plus: Sarah Segal asks whether it’s better to build her business on a bunch of small clients or a smaller number of large clients. And is being CEO a health risk? We begin the episode by talking about an eye-catching story the Wall Street Journal recently published noting that an increasing number of CEOs have been dying on the job, presumably because of the heightened levels of stress. I asked the three CEOs on the episode if they’ve been taking care of themselves—but they weren’t having it. Instead of thanking me for my concern, they chided me for highlighting an article they consider complete BS. Which, of course, is what we love about these guys. They call ‘em the way they see ‘em.

This week, Shawn Busse, who soon will be boarding an Alaska Airlines plane made by the Boeing Company to attend the 21 Hats Live event in Fort Worth, finds lessons for smaller businesses in Boeing’s struggles. For one thing, there’s always danger when combining the cultures of two different companies. Plus: Shawn, whose company, Kinesis, has been a certified B corp since 2016, talks about whether the certification is losing its luster.

This week, in episode 182, Shawn Busse, Jay Goltz, and Jennifer Kerhin respond to a somewhat depressing view of business ownership offered by an investor who buys businesses for a living. That view, essentially, is that for most owners, building a business is a daily knife fight of long hours, unexpected risks, slow growth, and meager returns. In this episode, I read most of the investor’s observations to Shawn, Jay, and Jennifer, and get their reactions, which hit upon a bunch of issues that are not widely understood—including how fast growth can destroy a business, how even a profitable company can go bust, and why a good metric to assess the health of a small business might be how many people have been crying in the bathroom this year. While Shawn, Jay, and Jennifer disagree vehemently with a few of the investor’s assertions—”Kiss my ass!” says Jay in response to one—they do acknowledge that he makes a lot of good points, which leads to an obvious question: Why would anyone do this? Why would anyone subject themselves to this kind of life? As you might expect, Shawn, Jennifer, and Jay have a response to that as well.

That, at least, is what Gene Marks is planning to do. Gene tells Loren Feldman that the new rules, which are scheduled to take effect in March, would have a profound impact on many businesses, including his—if they are actually enforced. But Gene’s not convinced that’s going to happen. Before you relax, though, Gene’s even more worked up about the new guidelines coming from the EEOC regarding harassment in the workplace. Very few businesses, he says, are prepared for what’s coming. One warning: when Gene talks about regulation, his language tends to get a little salty.

This week, in episode 181, Mel Gravely, Jaci Russo, and William Vanderbloemen talk about the possibility that, after several years of the Great Resignation and the labor shortage, some owners may have given away the store. We all know the risks of not offering employees enough. What are the risks of offering too much? How do you even know when you’ve crossed the line? The owners also discuss why this might be a good time to consider acquiring other businesses. “I think this is a time to double-down,” says Mel. And Jaci explains how she and her team are reviewing everything the company does to see if AI can be employed to improve each and every process. Oh, and one last thing: How exactly, in this day and age, are business owners supposed to keep track of all of the subscriptions—and all of the subscription log-ins—that they and their employees have acquired through the years? How much money are they spending on stuff they no longer use? “Thanks a lot,” responds Mel. “I’m starting to sweat.”

This week, Gene Marks tells Loren Feldman that while he’s excited about all of the great stuff we will eventually be able to do with artificial intelligence, business owners should stay away from Copilot for now. As with a lot of Microsoft products, Gene says, you just don’t want to be an early adopter. Plus, Gene explains his not-completely-obvious fraud-prevention strategy: Make your people take vacations.

This week, in episode 180, Jay Goltz, Jennifer Kerhin, and Liz Picarazzi discuss their efforts to get a better grasp of what drives their profits. They ask how much of their finances they should manage themselves. And how much should they rely on an accountant or a fractional CFO? When does delegation become abdication? Jennifer says she’s benefitted from hiring a fractional CFO who has taken an active leadership role, including setting up a database that helps Jennifer see in real time whether the fees she’s charging cover the labor she’s deploying. “Whatever she's charging me,” says Jennifer of her CFO, “it's absolutely worth it.” Liz, meanwhile, thinks she should be doing more herself. And Jay says he was paying big bucks for a full-time CFO until late last year. “And it was a complete waste of money,” he says, which is why he’s decided not to replace her. Plus: Liz reveals her secret strategy for marketing directly to municipal government officials, some of whom have started to use the term “Citibin” generically. And the owners respond to a question from the head of a cost-reduction service who wonders why she’s struggling so much to get business owners to try her risk-free service.