
MinistryWatch Podcast
Transparency and accountability are vital to the renewal of the evangelical church in America. Hosts Warren Smith and Natasha Smith highlight the top stories of the week from the unique MinistryWatch perspective and give you a peek behind the curtain to show why and how we do the investigations we do.
Latest episodes

Nov 20, 2024 • 15min
Ep. 416: Don’t Waste Your Life
Christian ministries need volunteers. Christian retirees need purpose and meaning. It’s a match that models for the world the Kingdom of God.
Articles or other resources mentioned in today’s podcast:
Article in Yahoo Finance explaining a trend among rich older Americans to pay millions of dollars to get into luxury retirement campuses.
A recent article in the Stanford Social Innovation Review noted that in 19th century America every major aspect of daily life was age integrated.
Bruce Bruinsma has been a champion of what he calls a “Retirement Reformation.” Bruinsma says he is “on a mission to shake up our ‘me-centered’ retirement culture, and inject God-given purpose, joy, and real contentment into the Golden Years.” Bruinsma says, “When asked what they plan to do in retirement, most people say: “Nothing!” They’re clear about what they’re retiring FROM — but not what they’re retiring TO.” He goes on to say, “Thirty years is a long time to do nothing.”
Since “retiring” again from The Colson Center, Steve Verleye has become a mentor and coach to other Christian entrepreneurs part of an organization called C-12, which is itself quietly making its mark as a networking and support group for Christian businesspeople.
Evangelical pastor and theologian John Piper’s famous “Seashell Sermon.”

Nov 15, 2024 • 20min
Ep. 415: Missionary Murder for Hire, Archbishop of Canterbury Resigns
On today’s program, the wife of slain missionary Beau Shroyer has been arrested in connection with his death—investigators suspect she hired the man she was having an affair with to kill her husband. We’ll have details.
And, a Pennsylvania church trying to disassociate from the Evangelical Presbyterian Church has been charged for sharing information with MinistryWatch. We’ll take a look.
Plus, South Carolina pastor John-Paul Miller—whose wife Mica Miller died by suicide earlier this year—has been hit with an assault charge just days after FBI raided his house.
But first, the Church of England head Justice Welby has resigned over his handling of a sexual abuse case. Archbishop of Canterbury Justin Welby, head of the Church of England and spiritual leader of the global Anglican Communion, resigned Tuesday.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Danica Kirka, Jessica Eturralde, Kim Roberts, Tony Mator, Marissa Greene, Shannon Cuthrell, and Brittany Smith.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Christina:
And I’m Christina Darnell, in for Natasha Cowden this week, also coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, the wife of slain missionary Beau Shroyer has been arrested in connection with his death—investigators suspect she hired the man she was having an affair with to kill her husband. We’ll have details.
And, a Pennsylvania church trying to disassociate from the Evangelical Presbyterian Church has been charged for sharing information with MinistryWatch. We’ll take a look.
Plus, South Carolina pastor John-Paul Miller—whose wife Mica Miller died by suicide earlier this year—has been hit with an assault charge just days after FBI raided his house.
Christina:
But first, the Church of England head Justice Welby has resigned over his handling of a sexual abuse case.
Warren:
Archbishop of Canterbury Justin Welby, head of the Church of England and spiritual leader of the global Anglican Communion, resigned Tuesday.
The resignation came after an investigation found that he failed to tell police about serial physical and sexual abuse by a volunteer at Christian summer camps as soon as he became aware of it.
Pressure on Welby had been building since Thursday, when release of the inquiry’s findings kindled anger about a lack of accountability at the highest reaches of the church.
Welby’s resignation comes against the backdrop of widespread historical sexual abuse in the Church of England. A 2022 report by the Independent Inquiry Child Sexual Abuse found that the Church of England had become “a place where abusers could hide.”
Christina:
Welby’s supporters had argued that he had been instrumental in changing the culture of the church since he became Archbishop of Canterbury in 2013.
Warren:
But it was an investigation into crimes that began long before that date that ultimately led to his downfall.
The church on Thursday released the results of an independent investigation into Smyth, who sexually, psychologically and physically abused about 30 boys and young men in the United Kingdom and 85 in Africa beginning in the 1970s.
The 251-page report of the Makin Review concluded that Welby failed to report Smyth to authorities when he was informed of the abuse in August 2013, soon after he became Archbishop of Canterbury.
Christina:
Our next story is a sad and strange tale involving American missionaries in Angola.
Warren:
Investigators suspect the wife of a slain missionary in the West African country of Angola was the "mastermind" of his killing and was having an affair with one of the men...

Nov 13, 2024 • 36min
Ep. 414 : Randall Goodgame Calls The Church to Sing Scripture How the Musician’s Career Evolved from Regional Success to Impacting the Church with Scripture-Centered Music
Randall Goodgame is one of my favorite people. For one thing, he is unfailingly nice, one of the nicest guys I know. And he’s enormously talented. He began his musical career while still an undergraduate in the 1990s playing keyboards for a southern rock band called Black Creek that had regional success and developed a cult following even though it released only a single live album. But, man, that album rocks. Randall’s senior thesis at Birmingham Southern College was an account of his year on the road with the band.
From there he released a couple of independent solo albums before finding success as a songwriter for such Christian artists as Andrew Peterson, Caedmon’s Call, and Jason Gray. As an artist, he toured with these artists as well as Jars of Clay.
His career took yet another turn when he collaborated with Andrew Peterson to produce a children’s album called “Slugs and Bugs and Lullabies.” This album led to more “Slugs and Bugs” albums, albums that combine a high artistic sensibility with solid biblical teaching. His album “Sing The Bible with Slugs and Bugs” takes Bible verses – not paraphrases, but word for word Scripture – and sets them to music.
The success of that album led to his latest project, “Scripture Hymnal.” Scripture Hymnal contains more than 100 Bible passages set to music. The book has sheet music, and a link to fully produced versions of every song in the book. It’s really a massive project, and one that is sure to have a big impact on the church and take its place in a growing movement of modern hymn writing we are seeing today.
It was a pleasure to talk with Randall Goodgame. We had this conversation last week, via zoom. He joined me from his studio near Nashville.
That brings to a close my interview with Randall Goodgame. His newest project is ”Scripture Hymnal.” I’ve got a copy of it myself, and I couldn’t recommend it more highly.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. Until next time, may God bless you.
Article Topics
An Interview with Randall Goodgame: The Man Behind 'Scripture Hymnal'
From Southern Rock to Scripture Songs: Randall Goodgame’s Musical Evolution

Nov 8, 2024 • 27min
Ep. 413: My Faith Votes, Turning Point USA, Gateway Church
On today’s program, Jason Yates—the former president of the Christian advocacy group My Faith Votes—has been charged with possession of child pornography. We’ll have details.
Plus, Charlie Kirk’s Turning Point USA is rallying young people to become active in politics by establishing chapters on Christian college campuses. We’ll take a look.
And, results from our quarterly survey of ministry leaders—revenue decline remains the top ministry challenge.
But first, Gateway Church has removed four of its elders over former pastor Robert Morris’ sexual abuse scandal. Four elders at Gateway Church, whose senior pastor Robert Morris stepped down earlier this year, have been removed after the results of a law firm’s investigation of sexual abuse allegations against the pastor were announced in a sermon on Sunday (Nov. 3).
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Kathryn Post, Tony Mator, James Russell, Brittany Smith, and Christina Darnell.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, Jason Yates—the former president of the Christian advocacy group My Faith Votes—has been charged with possession of child pornography. We’ll have details.
Plus, Charlie Kirk’s Turning Point USA is rallying young people to become active in politics by establishing chapters on Christian college campuses. We’ll take a look.
And, results from our quarterly survey of ministry leaders—revenue decline remains the top ministry challenge.
Natasha:
But first, Gateway Church has removed four of its elders over former pastor Robert Morris’ sexual abuse scandal.
Warren:
Four elders at Gateway Church, whose senior pastor Robert Morris stepped down earlier this year, have been removed after the results of a law firm’s investigation of sexual abuse allegations against the pastor were announced in a sermon on Sunday (Nov. 3).
The removals are the latest responses by one of the country’s largest evangelical Christian churches to allegations brought by Cindy Clemishire in June that Gateway’s founding pastor, Robert Morris, 63, had molested her in the 1980s, when Morris was in his 20s and she was 12.
Natasha:
Soon afterward, also in June, the church retained law firm Haynes and Boone to conduct an investigation, what did they find?
Warren:
Church elder Tra Willbanks announced on Sunday, the investigation found that all but three elders had been aware of Morris’ history with Clemishire, now 54, and her age at the time of the alleged abuse.
While Willbanks declined to identify the elders who were removed, the names of elders Jeremy Carrasco, Kevin Grove, Gayland Lawshe and Thomas Miller no longer appear on the church website, according to multiple news accounts.
Natasha:
The investigation’s results also prompted reforms to Gateway’s leadership structure and bylaws.
Warren:
Church staff will no longer serve as elders. Willbanks said, “We must bring this level of independence and objectivity to our eldership, and it has been lacking in the years past,”
The summer’s allegations prompted state legislators to call for changing the statute of limitations for sexual assault, harsher penalties for mandatory reporters who fail to follow up on accusations and reforming nondisclosure agreements for sexual abuse survivors. Secular and religious advocacy organizations have been pushing for such reforms, as well as the elimination of the use of nondisclosure agreements in sexual assault cases.
Natasha:
Next, Former MY Faith Votes CEO has been charged with serious crime...

Nov 6, 2024 • 28min
Ep. 412: Care Net’s Roland Warren on Pro (ABUNDANT) Life
If you’ve been around me for a while, you know that I’m a fan of Roland Warren.
He’s been the president of Care Net, the nation’s largest network of pregnancy resource centers, for more than a decade. He’s been an advocate for the unborn for much longer than that. Roland Warren has also helped bring fathers into the pro-life conversation, in part because of a tenure as president of the National Fatherhood Initiative, a post he held before coming to Care Net.
I’ve interviewed Roland Warren many times over the years, including twice for my “Listening In” podcast, a podcast I did for a decade for WORLD News Group. I’ll include links to those interviews in today’s show notes.
Those links are here and here.
I have gone back to Roland again and again because…well…he always has something interesting and provocative to say. And that’s certainly the case today. We’re discussing his new book The Alternative to Abortion: Why We Must be Pro Abundant Life. I found this book to be challenging and encouraging and I think you’ll find our conversation to be so, too.
Roland Warren has degrees from Princeton University and the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, and he’s the author of many books on fatherhood and the prolife movement. We had this conversation via zoom last week.
Thanks to Jeff McIntosh for producing today’s program.
Until next time, may God bless you.

Nov 1, 2024 • 27min
Ep. 411: Hillsdale College, GRACE, Operation Underground Railroad
On today’s program, a lawsuit against Hillsdale College has been dismissed after students alleging they were raped sued the college for Title 9 violations. We’ll have details.
And, the nonprofit Godly Response to Abuse in the Christian Environment—known as GRACE for short—turns 20 years old. We’ll look back at where they started—and where they’re going.
Plus, those subscriptions you forgot your paying for?...A new law will make it easy for you to unsubscribe, but it could also impact the recurring gifts to Christian ministries.
But first, Operation Underground Railroad…who continues distancing itself from its embroiled founder Tim Ballard…is moving its headquarters. Operation Underground Railroad Rescue is moving its headquarters from Salt Lake City, Utah, to Minneapolis, Minnesota, according to reporting by Twin Cities Business.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Jessica Eturralde, Paul Clolery, Richard Levey, and Christina Darnell.
A special thanks to The NonProfit Times for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, a lawsuit against Hillsdale College has been dismissed after students alleging they were raped sued the college for Title 9 violations. We’ll have details.
And, the nonprofit Godly Response to Abuse in the Christian Environment—known as GRACE for short—turns 20 years old. We’ll look back at where they started—and where they’re going.
Plus, those subscriptions you forgot your paying for?...World Vision is encouraging donors to cancel those and give to people in need around the world. They’re calling it Subscribe to World Change. We’ll take a look.
Natasha:
But first, Operation Underground Railroad…who continues distancing itself from its embroiled founder Tim Ballard…is moving its headquarters.
Warren:
Operation Underground Railroad Rescue is moving its headquarters from Salt Lake City, Utah, to Minneapolis, Minnesota, according to reporting by Twin Cities Business.
Tammy Lee, OUR Rescue CEO said about Minneapolis. “There is such a strong foundation here, in the legal community as well as the philanthropic community and the survivor support community,”
The global headquarters’ relocation is planned for January 2025. Lee also said the mission of the organization will adjust to focus more on domestic trafficking and rescues.
Natasha:
How do they plan to do that?
Warren:
Lee said, “In this coming year, we’re going to be building out direct services for survivors of human trafficking and sexual exploitation,” “We’re also looking at supporting key populations that are really underserved, looking at the indigenous populations and partnerships with other non-governmental organizations to do that work.”
Lee joined OUR Rescue as CEO in February 2024 with the task of rebuilding and rebranding the organization.
OUR Rescue was founded by former homeland security agent Tim Ballard in 2013 as Operation Underground Railroad. In April, Lee and the board renamed the group OUR Rescue.
In the MinistryWatch database, Operation Underground Railroad has a 1-star financial efficiency rating, a C transparency grade, and a donor confidence score of 45, meaning donors should exercise caution when giving to this group.
Natasha:
Next up, A lawsuit against Hillsdale college has been dismissed
Warren:
Last October, one present and one former student of Hillsdale College filed a federal lawsuit alleging the institution failed to adequately investigate their claims of ...

Oct 30, 2024 • 12min
Ep. 410: Unsung Heroes Honored For Work in Middle East, North Africa
In an era of celebrity and platform, it’s easy to forget that God uses the “least and the lost” to advance His Kingdom.
The men and women I discuss in today’s podcast are not media celebrities. They don’t have “platforms” or book deals. But they have been quietly going about the business of the Kingdom of God. At MinistryWatch we often report on Christian leaders behaving badly. Sometimes it’s right and proper to pause and recognize those men and women who have quietly been engaged in what Eugene Peterson calls “long obedience in the same direction.”
May we all be encouraged by their lives and – more importantly – may be all go and do likewise.
To read this story, click here.

Oct 25, 2024 • 25min
Ep. 409: Operation Underground Railroad, Eric Metaxas, Joni and Friends
On today’s program, Operation Underground Railroad founder Tim Ballard sues for defamation after six women accuse him of sexual assault. We’ll have details.
And, MinistryWatch reporter Marci Seither visits Joni & Friends in Tennessee as the ministry ships off hundreds of donated wheelchairs. They head to a prison, where inmates are repairing the equipment, even as they work to repair their own lives.
Also, the National Hispanic Christian Leadership Conference announces the launch of new health initiatives, including mental health and financial health. We’ll take a look.
But first, relatives and scholars of Dietrich Bonhoeffer have issued a warning to Eric Metaxas and others, accusing them of misusing his legacy for political reasons.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Bob Smietana, Kim Roberts, Marci Seither, Aleja Hertzler-McCain, and Brittany Smith.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you this week from our nation’s capital, Washington, DC.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, Operation Underground Railroad founder Tim Ballard sues for defamation after six women accuse him of sexual assault. We’ll have details.
And, MinistryWatch reporter Marci Seither visits Joni & Friends in Tennessee as the ministry ships off hundreds of donated wheelchairs. They head to a prison, where inmates are repairing the equipment, even as they work to repair their own lives.
Also, the National Hispanic Christian Leadership Conference announces the launch of new health initiatives, including mental health and financial health. We’ll take a look.
Natasha:
But first, relatives and scholars of Dietrich Bonhoeffer have issued a warning to Eric Metaxas and others, accusing them of misusing his legacy for political reasons.
Warren:
In recent years, author and radio host Eric Metaxas and other conservative Christian supporters of Donald Trump have compared themselves to the famed German theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer — who was put to death, in part, for participating in a plan to assassinate Adolph Hitler.
In a recent interview on Flashpoint, a Christian television talk show on the Victory network, both Metaxas — author of a bestselling biography of Bonhoeffer — and the show’s host called the current election a “Bonhoeffer moment” and urged Christians to rise up and oppose evil.
His newest book, “Religionless Christianity” — a phrase used by Bonhoeffer — describes America’s current politics as a spiritual war and sign of the end times.
Natasha:
A group of Bonhoeffer scholars — and the theologian’s descendants — have had enough.
Warren:
In a statement issued Friday (Oct. 18) members of the International Bonhoeffer Society called on Metaxas and others to stop comparing the current election to the rise of the Nazis. The statement, in particular, called out Metaxas for social media posts featuring a gun and a Bible and his support of Jan. 6 rioters.
“This portrayal glorifies violence and draws inappropriate analogies between our political system and that of Nazi Germany,” the scholars said in a statement, which has been signed by more than 800 Bonhoeffer scholars and other Christian leaders.
Natasha:
What prompted the statement?
Warren:
In part by the upcoming release of a new Bonhoeffer biopic, which will be out in theaters in late November. One of the posters for the film shows Bonhoeffer with a gun, and a trailer for the film shows his involvement in the plot to kill Hitler. Some of the early social media tweets about the film included messages about the “battle against tyranny” and a line from the trailer,

Oct 23, 2024 • 25min
Ep. 408: What Does Generosity Really Look Like? A Conversation with missionary Anthony Sytsma
Most Christians who are active in church have been in this situation before. You’ve just listened to a compelling presentation about a need in some far-away corner of the world. Or perhaps it was a television program, or a commercial on your favorite Christian radio station. The need seems so great, and the story tugs at your heart strings. I’ve never heard of this organization before, but maybe it’s the Holy Spirit prompting me to give. What should I do?
Hello, everyone, I’m Warren Smith, the president of MinistryWatch. And I think it is biblical to test the spirits, to make sure that the spirit moving you is actually the Holy Spirit. That’s why an article I saw in Christianity Today magazine by my guest today, Anthony Sytsma, caught my attention. It’s called “God Calls Me To Give. But to Everyone?” He has some guidance for us on how to test whether that tug we are feeling is actually from God…or from some clever advertising executives.
Anthony Sytsma is himself a missionary, so he’s not trying to discourage giving. In fact, he believes, as do I, that when we have confidence in our giving decisions, we’ll actually give more.
If you’d like to read his article in Christianity Today, click here.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. Until next time, may God bless you.

Oct 18, 2024 • 27min
Ep. 407: Cru and LGBTQ Issues, United Methodists, and Pastor Burnout
On today’s program, Cru will stop using its current LGBTQ training program for staff by the end of this year. The change comes after facing accusations that the long-time campus ministry is compromising on biblical sexuality. We’ll have details.
Meanwhile, United Methodist churches in Liberia face protests and unrest as it deals with the fallout of the global denomination’s shift on LGBTQ issues. We’ll take a look.
And, American pastors are burned out and exhausted—but experts say that can change.
But first, a group of people affiliated with Morningstar church in South Carolina are calling for founder Rick Joyner’s resignation—and Joyner is not having it. A group of former MorningStar church members, students, and staff members have signed an open statement calling for MorningStar founder Rick Joyner to resign, among other accountability measures.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you this week from Amsterdam, in the Netherlands, where I’m attending a conference on Bible translation.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, Cru will stop using its current LGBTQ training program for staff by the end of this year. The change comes after facing accusations that the long-time campus ministry is compromising on biblical sexuality. We’ll have details.
Meanwhile, United Methodist churches in Liberia face protests and unrest as it deals with the fallout of the global denomination’s shift on LGBTQ issues. We’ll take a look.
And, American pastors are burned out and exhausted—but experts say that can change.
Natasha:
But first, a group of people affiliated with Morningstar church in South Carolina are calling for founder Rick Joyner’s resignation—and Joyner is not having it.
Warren:
A group of former MorningStar church members, students, and staff members have signed an open statement calling for MorningStar founder Rick Joyner to resign, among other accountability measures.
The statement, published by MorningStar Accountability Now on September 23, follows the filing of three lawsuits by victims who alleged child sexual abuse by Erickson Lee during MorningStar programs. The lawsuits also seek to hold the ministry liable for not preventing the alleged abuse.
Natasha:
How has the founder responded?
Warren:
In an email on October 5 to Emily Elston, a leader of the MorningStar Accountability Now group, Joyner said, “I am the one God gave to raise up MorningStar, and I will not abandon my post except by His clearly revealed will.”
The accountability statement has over 200 named signatories, some of whom are former teachers at the church’s Comenius School for Creative Leadership, as well as church attendees, Morningstar staff, and others affiliated with the Morningstar School of Ministry.
Natasha:
In addition to calling for Joyner’s resignation, the statement also calls for an independent audit of the MorningStar board, the credentials of its members, and its policies and procedures.
Warren:
MorningStar does not file an informational Form 990 with the Internal Revenue Service where the board members’ names would be listed, nor does it have them easily accessible on its ministry website.
The accountability statement also calls for an independent audit of the ministry’s child protection policies and for the audit results to be released publicly.
The statement says MorningStar should implement mandatory training on sexual abuse against minors for all staff and volunteers who interact with children.
Natasha:
On September 24, MorningStar’s leadership released a statement saying they “stand with the victims” and are “fully committed to their healing and restoration.”
Warren:
The statement claims MorningStar is working with independent third-party inves...