Ancestral Kitchen

Chocolate has a secret life. One where, instead of being formed into industrial bars, women combine it by hand with local herbs to make drinks. One where it is a healer, not a creator of addiction. One where it’s revered - held so sacred that it’s used in ceremony and as currency, not bought for a few pennies, wrapper discarded. One where it’s bitter, potent and intense, not sweet and sickly. And one where nobody feels guilt when they imbibe it. There’s no-one more qualified to open the door to this world than Marcos Patchett, author of the 700-page The Secret Life of Chocolate. This book, which covers everything you could possibly want to know about cacao - including how it was ancestrally used, it’s pharmacology and it’s mythology - will completely change your view of cacao.“There’s a lifetime’s worth of research in this book.” Come join us as we dive into a cacao-flavoured world!The run-down:1:52 About the book7:20 Why Marcos wrote the book12:19 The effect of imbibing extracted plant compounds v. the whole plant 15:10 How cacao was originally drunk and how chocolate is eaten in the West now20:25 The book-writing high point 26:40 Alison, Andrea and Marcos talk about their relationships with chocolate34:00 Chocolate and disordered eating36:58 Cacao’s medicinal effects44:00 How chocolate’s effects are mediated by the eater’s intention59.40 The cultural side of cacao's history1:07:25 Self-medicating with chocolate as part of disordered eating1.10:25 Practical steps to start eating chocolate ancestrally/authentically“It blew my mind to realise I’ve been blocking benefits of chocolate by feeling guilt” Alison*Due to equipment failure, this episode does not have as good audio quality as normal. But it's totally listenable and wonderful content!*If you want to buy your own copy of the book, Marcos is offering a 20% discount. Use the code CHOC20 on the publishers website:For those in the US: https://bit.ly/3dVRX1dFor rest of world: https://www.aeonbooks.co.uk“The modern research suggests quite strongly that cacao is protective against heart disease and stroke and type 2 diabetes.” MarcosResources mentioned:Our 6 Books We Love episode Jonathan Ott - The Cacahuatl Eater Susana Trilling - Seasons of my HeartMama Coca“Only eating the chocolate mindfully produced a positive increase in mood” MarcosWhere to find Marcos and his work:Marcos’ book’s website: https://thesecretlifeofchocolate.com/Marcos’ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nocturnalherbalist/Marcos’ herbalist website: http://nocturnalherbalist.co.ukYou Tube The Nocturnal HerbalistSourcing your own cacao:“You learn so much doing it from scratch, and the quality is so much better” AlisonTo source your own cacao as beans: Look for raw (i.e. not previously roasted) Criollo or Forastero beans. Europe: Where Alison has sourced organic cacao beans:http://macrolibrarsi.it and http://cacaopuro.comShe is currently working on European sourcing of a known single-origin bean, in home-chocolate-maker quantities. Stay connected with her if you’d like to know what she finds.USA:Organic arriba criollo cacao beansForastero CacaoTo source ready-made roasted and ground cacao ‘paste’ search for cacao liquor or cacao paste.Marcos suggested cacao amor (UK-based), you can get a 20% discount with the code: nocturnalherbalist20 Rebekah Shaman also sells this in the UK Blocks of organic ground cacao paste (US) Valrhona industrially-roasted ‘couverture’ (this is the ‘base’ chocolate that many fine chocolate-makers use to make more complicated bars and small chocolates)Other resources:All about metates and grinding stonesSnippet of someone grinding cacao in a metate (You can also watch Marcos doing this on the cacao preparation videos on his You Tube channel (linked above))Mexgrocer (scroll down to read a description of Mexican chocolate drinks):Video of preparing traditional drinking chocolate in Oaxaca, Mexico "Dark chocolate has fuelled many things in my life" MarcosWe'd love to continue the conversation. Come find us on Instagram:Andrea is at Farm and HearthAlison is at Ancestral KitchenThe podcast is at Ancestral Kitchen PodcastOriginal Music, Episode Mixing and Post-Production by Robert Michael KayLove what we're doing?We'd love you to be part of our Patreon community!For $9 a month (or equivalent in your currency) you'll be helping us with the costs of recording, editing and putting this work into the world. And you'll get to be part of our world on a deeper level - we've got a monthly intimate patron-exclusive podcast called Kitchen Table Chats and we're also going to share cooking classes, extra interviews and much more.Check out www.patreon.com/ancestralkitchenpodcast for all the details!If you like us and use Apple Podcasts, we'd love it if you left a review! Here's how:Open the Apple Podcast appFind Ancestral Kitchen Podcast in your library (you can search for it)Scroll down to 'ratings and reviews'Click on 'write a review', choose how many wonderful stars you would like to give us (!), title your review and then, in the lower box type a review of up to 300 words. Thank you. We really appreciate you taking the time to support us!

"Everything about getting rid of my iPhone came down to health. " -AlisonIn just two short generations, tech has slowly crept into our lives in more and more ways, eating away at our time and our sanity in so many insidious ways. In this episode, Andrea interviews Alison and Rob about their tech use, the over-use that caused Alison to re-evaluate the way she was implementing tech in her life, and why they decided to get rid of their smart phones. Rob will provide tips on the technical side, and we will all discuss how to live fully with less distractions! "Tech can steal from us. It sneaks into our lives in little ways, here and there." -Alison What we cover:As always, we start out discussing what we ate before getting on to record! Skip the food intro: 11:20Summarise the Issue: What are the Two Key Problems? 11:39 You Gave Away Your iPhone ... What Else Has Changed: 15:55What Do You Use Now: 17:00How Are You Using & Receiving Differently Now? 21:15How Do You Approach It Now: 24:24The Physical Effects: 26:40Meeting Rob: 29:15Rob's Story: 29:58The Process of Recovery: 37:00The Physical Effect Screens Have on Us: 38:30What is an e-Ink Screen: 41:05Electronic Frequency Patterns: 45:00How Do We Mitigate Screen Damage? 46:18The Effects of Wi-Fi: 51:30How Do We Mitigate Wi-Fi Damage? 53:08EMF Test Apps: 57:00"I had to balance the technology I was using with the impact it had on me." -RobAlison Comes Back In: 57:43Upcoming - Patreon Feed Interview with Rob: 58:25Introducing The Psychological Effects: 59:45How I Work Now: 01:00:53"Life opens up so much more ..." AlisonResults of the Social Media Break: 01:09:51Time Blocking Social Media Engagement: 01:11:51Taking Sundays Off: 01:12:18Moon Time: 01:15:15Follow or Unfollow? 01:16:44"I have to trust that what I'm doing with Ancestral Kitchen will grow through me doing things that bring me joy, not through things that I think I should be doing... It's been an incredibly hard thing for me to do to trust myself... " - Alison 01:18:40Time Frame for Tech Usage: 01:23:53A Positive Approach to Tech Limiting: 01:25:19"My self-trust has deepened." - AlisonSummarizing the Changes: 01:28:07Alison's Final Thoughts: 01:29:07Access to the Exclusive Patreon Feed: 01:31:12"Sometimes you're gonna fail and you'll get sucked back in - but not all the time." - AlisonResources MentionedeReader tablet link: Onyx books"Life opens up more when you don’t have a phone." -AlisonIris Software (bluelight and eye protection software)Rob's MusicPhones apps to test EMFThe Boza Course on Ancestral KitchenListen to Alison read Wuthering Heights! Commonplace Read-aloud PodcastWe'd love to continue the conversation! Come find us on Instagram:Andrea is at Farm and HearthAlison is at Ancestral KitchenThe podcast is at Ancestral Kitchen PodcastOriginal Music, Episode Mixing and Post-Production by Robert Michael Kay"We have our evenings back." -AlisonLove what we're doing?We'd love you to be part of our Patreon community!For $9 a month (or equivalent in your currency) you'll be helping us with the costs of recording, editing and putting this work into the world. And you'll get to be part of our world on a deeper level - we've got a monthly intimate patron-exclusive podcast called Kitchen Table Chats and we're also going to share cooking classes, extra interviews and much more.Check out www.patreon.com/ancestralkitchenpodcast for all the details!If you like us and use Apple Podcasts, we'd love it if you left a review! Here's how:Open the Apple Podcast appFind Ancestral Kitchen Podcast in your library (you can search for it)Scroll down to 'ratings and reviews'Click on 'write a review', choose how many wonderful stars you would like to give us (!), title your review and then, in the lower box type a review of up to 300 words. Thank you. We really appreciate you taking the time to support us!

"One of the great illusions is that we can escape the cycle of life and death."Andrea watched Wild Quetzal's Instagram videos about ancestral foodways and knew she wanted to talk to him!We're bringing you this special interview in between our normal episodes. It's recorded directly on Zoom, so the audio's not as pristine as usual, but the content is great.Andrea and Quetzal talk about:How ancestral communities eatConnection to nature and its cyclesTransitioning from vegan to ancestral foodsWestern society's discomfort with deathHealth as a by-product of being in tune with one's body and environmentFertility as a sign of healthEating locallyDealing with internet abuse"Animal foods demand that you have reverence"Andrea's in Washington State and Quetzal's in Hawaii, the recording was night-time for Alison hence her absence! Still, Alison and Andrea got together to record a brief introduction to this interview, so you'll hear Alison's perspective on the interview, including some of her own raw vegan journey, in the introductory chat.There is some mild swearing, so if you're in sensitive company, you might want to pop in earbuds.Resources mentioned:The Holistic Mother on InstagramWe'd love to continue the conversation. Come find us on Instagram:Andrea is at Farm and HearthAlison is at Ancestral KitchenThe podcast is at Ancestral Kitchen PodcastOriginal Music, Episode Mixing and Post-Production by Robert Michael KayLove what we're doing?We'd love you to be part of our Patreon community!For $9 a month (or equivalent in your currency) you'll be helping us with the costs of recording, editing and putting this work into the world. And you'll get to be part of our world on a deeper level - we've got a monthly intimate patron-exclusive podcast called Kitchen Table Chats and we're also going to share cooking classes, extra interviews and much more.Check out www.patreon.com/ancestralkitchenpodcast for all the details!

In this episode, Andrea and Alison talk about the cookbook that has healed the way they view, cook and eat food, THE ancestral cookbook, Sally Fallon's Nourishing Traditions.Technical Note: Andrea's microphone cord was touching part of the microphone stand, so you can hear a subtle metallic brushing every so often. This unusual issue has been resolved for future recordings. Our apologies for this audio interruption!“If Alison the raw vegan could see me now she would see someone who is a lot happier, more content, and more in touch with things than I was back then. A lot of it comes with taking a journey and embracing it, stepping forward into the unknown, even though it's scary, and changing. That’s what Nourishing Traditions helped me to do.” - AlisonWhat we cover:09:30 The upcoming Nourishing Traditions Zoom cook-up!11:10 What is Nourishing Traditions?16:45 When Andrea got the book and what it changed for her20:30 When Alison got the book and how it helped guide her journey to restored fertility34:30 The contents of the book39:30 Andrea’s favourite recipes 41:20 Alison’s favourite recipes48:00 A dive into the footnotes57:00 Recipes we want to cook from it!1:01:20 The importance of rhythm in ancestral cooking1:03:50 Sally’s other booksResources mentioned:Nourishing Traditions blog: https://nourishingtraditions.com/Andrea's old blogIn Bibi's Kitchen by Hawa Hassan and Julia TurshenNourished Kitchen - Natural Whole Foods RecipesThe "sparks of light" quote from Nourishing Traditions that Andrea read came from page 401Les aliments fermentés traditionnels : Une richesse méconnue by Claude AubertAgeless Remedies from Mother's Kitchen - Hannah KroegerWe love Nourishing Traditions so much, we’ve decided to host a live cook-up on zoom of three of its recipes. This interactive event is available free to Patrons of Ancestral Kitchen Podcast - they can come on live or download it (in audio or video format) at any time in the future by accessing our exclusive-to-patrons conent feed. If you would like to come join, check below for more details:If you love what we're doing, we'd love you to be part of our Patreon community!For $9 a month (or equivalent in your currency) you'll be helping us with the costs of recording, editing and putting this work into the world. And you'll get to be part of our world on a deeper level - we've got a monthly intimate patron-exclusive podcast called Kitchen Table Chats and we're also sharing cooking classes, extra interviews and much more.Check out www.patreon.com/ancestralkitchenpodcast for all the details!Let's continue the conversation. Come find us on Instagram!Andrea is at Farm and HearthAlison is at Ancestral KitchenThe podcast is at Ancestral Kitchen PodcastOriginal Music, Episode Mixing and Post-Production by Robert Michael Kay

"You can make really, really good bread using simple methods"We're so excited to welcome our first guest - Elly from Elly's Everyday to talk about sourdough-baking and soap-making!"My bread-making methods were developed when I was working full time in really difficult jobs and I needed it to be a no-brainer...I didn’t want to plan out my whole week around bread-making"What we cover:15:26 How we met Elly18:55 Elly talking about being a bread new-comer20:35 How Elly got into sourdough26:00 How to tell if your sourdough starter is healthy31:00 The problems that stop people baking sourdough33:10 Feeding a sourdough starter35:40 Elly’s starter maintenance method44:20 Elly doesn’t ever make the same bread twice45:23 The breads Elly regularly makes at home 47:15 Elly’s milling process49:45 Gluten-free sourdough1:00:25 Soap-making1:06:40 How to get started with soap-making1:08:20 How to find Elly’s recipes, videos and online homes"There’s always an easier way to do it!"Links:Elly’s *new* website!Elly’s IG accountElly’s FB accountThe 100% whole wheat video of Elly's that Alison cooked up.www.thefreshloaf.comElly’s Everyday Whole Grain Sourdough You Tube channelElly’s Everyday Soap-Making You Tube ChannelElly’s Hot Cross Bun recipeThe Natural Tucker Bread Book - John DownesChris Stafferton (the gluten-free bread maker, author of Promise and FulfillmentMock Mill (Elly’s affiliate link)Elly's Split Pea Soup recipe (described 13:49)11/2-2 cups yellow split peas1 potato1 onion1 carrot1 large ripe tomatolittle bit of saltPot with water or stockIf you love what we're doing, we'd love you to be part of our Patreon community!For $9 a month (or equivalent in your currency) you'll be helping us with the costs of recording, editing and putting this work into the world. And you'll get to be part of our world on a deeper level - we've got a monthly intimate patron-exclusive podcast called Kitchen Table Chats and we're also going to share cooking classes, extra interviews and much more.Check out www.patreon.com/ancestralkitchenpodcast for all the details!Want to share your thoughts on this episode, or talk about your experience with sourdough or soap?Let's continue the conversation. Come find us on Instagram:Andrea is at Farm and HearthAlison is at Ancestral KitchenThe podcast is at Ancestral Kitchen PodcastOriginal Music, Episode Mixing and Post-Production by Robert Michael Kay

I spent a lot of my time researching and making connections with people to find my sources of food, and that takes time. - AlisonNot like I really knew what I was doing, I never know what I’m doing. - AndreaOnce it is ready, the bouza course we referred to will be loaded to the courses page on Alison's blog, Ancestral Kitchen"The chocolate book" we alluded to is The Secret Life of Chocolate by Marcos PatchettIn this podcast, Alison is asking us to help hold her accountable to leaving the super market! Feel free to leave comments on Instagram and ask us (both!) how it's going!I think I’m on a soapbox right now. - AndreaWhy We Get Fat by Gary Taubes for more fascinating information on the strategy and science behind supermarkets.Radical Homemakers by Shannon HayesHere's an idea that we didn't mention on this episode but you will hear more about later - share your farm and farmer's market and direct market hauls with the hashtag #bringbackhighstreet !Podcast with Ruth Layton Once we change the habit it becomes easy to maintain it, it’s the actual push of the switch that requires more impetus. - AlisonA Few Resources 46:37Eat WildReal Milk (WAPF Project)Weston A. Price Foundation "Find Food/Local Chapter" tabWAPF 50% PledgeShannon Hayes interview on a podcast where she talked about shoppers at the farmer's market(Shannon Hayes also has her own podcast, The Hearth of Sap Bush Hollow)For my journey, the basics aren’t more expensive if you change what you expect and your habits. Bulk grains are cheaper than bread, offal is cheaper than meat. - AlisonTo see how we changed some of our habits to accommodate eating better on a budget, check out this past episode: 5 Most Expensive (and yet, the cheapest!) Foods!By talking about this I’m not trying to browbeat somebody into making a decision or a choice, what I’m trying to do is reveal to them what perhaps they weren’t aware of. - AndreaDo you know how to leave us a review? Obviously as you heard at the end of this episode, neither of us have it figured out yet. If you know how to leave a review, we appreciate it!!!! (Also can you tell us how it's done?!)We'd love to continue the conversation. Come find us on Instagram:Andrea is at Farm and HearthAlison is at Ancestral KitchenThe podcast is at Ancestral Kitchen PodcastIf you love what we're doing, please do leave us a review or check out our new Patreon community here.Original Music, Episode Mixing and Post-Production by Robert Michael Kaywww.robertmichaelkay.com

"Admire and respect what you're doing." AndreaAs soon as a listener suggested this topic, we both knew we had to cover it. Burnout is something we've both experienced and our kitchen management rituals have often been painfully won."My biggest problem is that I get ridiculously enthusiastic and I take on too much at once" AlisonJoin us as we talk about subjects including clarity, delegation, enthusiasm overload, work groups, managing your 'team', routine, ritualizing, organization, the spectre of comparison and the importance of valuing your contribution."If it really means something to you, and it really needs to be done, you will get to it" AlisonA Slob Comes Clean podcast (mentioned by Andrea)How do you manage your kitchen? What helps maintain your energy? We'd love to know. Come find us on Instagram:Alison's at www.instagram.com/ancestral_kitchenAndrea's at www.instagram.com/farmandhearthIf you love what we're doing, please do leave us a review or check out our new Patreon community here.

"That led to bakers yeast, which was a household item by 1900... Then we just seem to have gone completely downhill from there, to this place where on the shelves are these loaves made in a process that, if you showed a baker from three or four hundred years ago, they just wouldn't recognize, with all these additives in it... And people just think that's bread." - Alison, in Episode 7, Sourdough"You basically need to be able to stir a spoon in a bowl. That's about the skill level that's needed." - AndreaMentioned in the podcast:Fare la scapettaThe Fresh Loaf forum"There's about 18 million ways to do this, it can't be that hard." - AndreaA Collection of Unmitigated Pedantry blog - Bread: Part IThe History of Food Podcast on AppleSourdough Recipes on Alison's blog, Ancestral Kitchen"Spelt has a tendency to go stale quite quickly, also the crumb can be a bit hard; and the scald helps with both those things." AlisonWild Fermentation by Sandor Ellix KatzThe Art of Fermentation by Sandor Ellix KatzPeter Reinhart's Artisan Breads Every Day by Peter Reinhart"Each thing along the line has grabbed me and pulled me in more. Each step I've taken away from that 9 to 5 life slowly slowly slowly to intentionally build something else had rewarded me in ways that tell I'm on the right path. This feels in accordance with my nature far more than what I used to do and how I used to live." - AlisonNourishing Traditions by Sally Fallon MorellBread flour sourced from Azure StandardEInkorn flour sourced from Young Living"If we could just awaken everybody to the idea that their food is playing a role -- I don't have to tell you to make sourdough or how to make sourdough once you have the idea that food is affecting everything about your life you will begin to seek out and the things will come to you." - AndreaTara Couture of Slow Down FarmsteadAndrea mentioned she was posting Charlotte Mason quotes online. You can see them here: instagram.com/charlottemasoncommonplaceAlison's beloved Emile Henry loaf pan "I took my own journey and proved them wrong. Once you get a little taste of that, once you see what's possible, then you just can't stop." - AlisonAlison can be found at instagram.com/ancestral_kitchenAndrea can be found at instagram.com/farmandhearthWe can both be found at instagram.com/ancestralkitchenpodcastThank you for listening, reviewing and commenting!!!

"The best books are ones that spin you off on a path; imbue you with passion"Words. Pictures. Beauty. Comfort. Connection. Guidance. Inspiration. Joy. Support.Books bring us so much.In this episode, Andrea and Alison talk about six books they love!You'll share in a radical chocolate book, two fermentation bibles, a recipe book using simple, locally-sourced food, an alternative bread book and a masterpiece that calls and inspires us to create the world we want to live in.Here are the publications we cover:Wild Fermentation - Sandor Ellix Katz (12:07)12 Months of Monastery Soups - Victor D’Avila-Latourrette (25:00)Naturally Fermented Bread - Paul Barker (31:34)The Art of Fermentation - Sandor Ellix Katz (45:00)The Secret Life of Chocolate - Marcos Patchett (49:35)Radical Homemakers - Shannon Hayes (1:05:16)Resources mentioned:Kobo Fermentary (the Instgram Pongal fermenter)Irina GeorgescuTiffany (who did the #veryfarmish challenge)An example of PosoleAnd author's social media:Sandor KatzPaul Barker's London BakeryMarcos PatchettShannon HayesWe'd love to continue the conversation. Come join us on Instagram. Alison's at @ancestral_kitchen and Andrea's at @farmandhearth

"Fermenting is an adventure!"In this episode, we give a snapshot of what's bubbling in our kitchens right now.You'll hear about:Vegetable ferments such as sauerkraut, ginger carrots, purple onions, jerusalem artichokes (sunchokes), mustard and the all-powerful garlic.Carbohydrate ferments including oatmeal, millet porridge, sowans, boza and sourdough starters.Drinks (including the sowans and boza above) like fire cider, hard cider and water kefir.Our conversation also works its way to wild v inoculated ferments and regular fermenting as a way to make meals in minutes. There are lots of breakfast options covered and you'll get a dose of Turkish and Scottish fermenting history as well as learning about a non-dairy, gluten-free, lectin-free fun alternative to dairy kefir.Keep an eye on www.instagram.com/ancestralkitchenpodcast over the next week or so - we hope to share some of the fermentation recipes mentioned in this episode!We'd love to continue the conversation. Come find us on Instagram:Andrea is at Farm and HearthAlison is at Ancestral KitchenThe podcast is at Ancestral Kitchen PodcastOriginal Music, Episode Mixing and Post-Production by Robert Michael Kaywww.robertmichaelkay.com