New Creation Conversations

Welcome to episode sixty-one of New Creation Conversations. I’m very excited in today’s conversation to be joined by my friend and colleague from both NNU and here at College Church, Dr. Diane Leclerc. Diane has served Northwest Nazarene University for 24 years as Professor of Historical Theology. She is an alum of Eastern Nazarene College. She has a Master of Divinity degree from Nazarene Theological Seminary and another Master’s Degree in Philosophy and PhD in Theological and Religious Studies from Drew University.Diane has co-edited a series of books with Dr. Mark Maddix – Essential Beliefs, Essential Church, Pastoral Practices, and Spiritual Formation (each articulating a Wesleyan theological perspective in those areas). She has written one of the best summaries and introductions to Wesleyan-Holiness theology out there in her book, Discovering Christian Holiness: The Heart of Wesleyan-Holiness Theology.We talk about all of those works, but our primary focus is on her soon-to-be-released book (co-authored with [friend-of-the-podcast] Dr. Brent Peterson), The Back Side of the Cross: An Atonement Theology for the Abused and Abandoned (published by Cascade Press). As you will hear, this has been a book that has been percolating in Diane’s life and thoughts for a decade or more, and it is wonderful that it is finally going to come out now. I had a chance to read a pre-publication edition of the book, and it has not only reshaped my imagination in so many ways related to the atonement and the significance of the cross, but it has helped me know how to extend transforming grace to those who have suffered at the hands of others. I’m biased, but I do think Diane and Brent’s book has the chance to be deeply transformative in the lives of many people and will change the way those of you who listening and are pastoring will preach in the future. I’m thankful for this new book and the chance to bring this conversation to you. 

Welcome to episode sixty of New Creation Conversations. It’s a privilege in today’s conversation to be joined by Dr. Amy Kenny. Amy has a PhD from the University of Sussex in Early Modern Literature and Culture. From 2009-2012, she was Research Coordinator at Shakespeare’s Globe in London, where she was the chief dramaturge for 15 productions, and taught courses on theatrical practice and Shakespearean drama. Currently she is a lecturer on Shakespeare at the University of California Riverside. Amy is also a disabled scholar who has written frequently about her experiences in publications like Teen Vogue, The Mighty, The Audacity, and Sojourners. Amy is a scribe for Freedom Road institute for Leadership and Justice; she serves on the mayor’s Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion Taskforce in California; coordinates support for people experiencing homelessness in her neighborhood; and is currently co-launching Jubilee Homes OC, a permanent supportive housing initiative in her local community. Amy has a new book, being released from Brazos Press in May, entitled My Body is Not a Prayer Request: Disability Justice in the Church. In it, Amy not only reflects on her own journey, but she also argues that much of the church has forgotten that we worship a disabled Lord whose wounds survived resurrection. Therefore, it is time for the church to start treating disabled people as full members of the body of Christ who have much more to offer than a miraculous cure narrative and to learn from their unique embodied experiences. She prophetically reflects on her experiences inside the church to expose unintentional ableism and cast a new vision for Christian communities to engage in disability justice.I had a chance to read a pre-publication edition of the book, and even though I have been involved for several years in churches working intentionally to make space for people with various disabilities, I still found much in Amy’s book challenging and unsettling, not in a bad way, but in a way that is helping me to imagine my own church as a more inclusive community. It is beautifully written – as one would expect from a Shakespeare scholar – and it is also richly theological and pragmatically helpful. I’m excited and grateful to get to bring this conversation to you. 

Welcome to episode fifty-nine of New Creation Conversations. In today’s conversation I’m thrilled to get a chance to reconnect with a friend and former colleague, Dr. Jen Rosner. During my years serving as a dean at Azusa Pacific University, Jen taught (and continues to teach) for the school as an affiliate faculty member. She was one of those professors who makes a dean’s life easy. Students love Jen’s classes, and I always looked forward to connecting with Jen and hearing about the latest work she was doing, and the great things God was teaching her.  Jen is an alum of Cal Poly University. She earned an MDiv from Yale Divinity School and a PhD in Theology from Fuller Seminary. After living for a couple of years in Israel, she now lives in Lake Tahoe, California and teaches at Fuller, Azusa Pacific, Messianic Jewish Theological Institute, and The King’s University. Her PhD dissertation, on the relationship between Judaism and Christian faith, was published in 2016 by Fortress Press with the title – Healing the Schism: Barth, Rosenzweig and the New Jewish-Christian Encounter.Our conversation centers primarily on two things. The first is her new book – Finding Messiah: A Journey into the Jewishness of the Gospel (published by IVP) – which can be pre-ordered now but will be released on May 24. I got to read a pre-publication edition of the book and it is such a beautiful combination of theology, biblical study, Christian history, and personal memoir. Secondly, we talk a lot – as does the book – about Jen’s own journey as a Jewish Christian, and specifically how she has come to embody those two traditions in her everyday life. And we reflect on the way her Judaism draws so much of the beauty and significance of Jesus’ and message that we Gentiles often overlook. I was so excited to get a chance to read Jen’s outstanding book, reconnect with a good friend, and I’m delighted to get to bring that conversation to you. 

Welcome to episode fifty-eight of New Creation Conversations. In today’s conversation I’m honestly a bit overwhelmed to be joined by Dr. Luke Timothy Johnson. Luke is Candler School of Theology’s Robert W. Woodruff Professor Emeritus of New Testament and Christian Origins, Emory University’s most distinguished endowed chair. He is a graduate of Notre Dame Seminary. He has an MA degree from Indiana University, an MDiv from Saint Meinrad School of Theology, and a PhD from Yale University. He’s a noted scholar and an award-winning teacher – spending decades teaching and researching at Yale Divinity School, Indiana University, and Candler School of Theology at Emory University. His research centers on the literary, moral, and religious dimensions of the New Testament, including the Jewish and Greco-Roman contexts of early Christianity, Luke-Acts, the Pastoral Letters, and the Letter of James.A prolific author, Luke has authored over 30 books, more than 70 scholarly articles, and nearly 200 book reviews. Several of his books are widely used as textbooks in seminaries and departments of religion throughout the world. His most recent book is a wonderful memoir that reflects not only on his truly miraculous journey in faith and scholarship but also serves as a kind of guide for those coming after him about the virtues and disciplines necessary to live into the life of the faithful scholar. The book is entitled: The Mind in Another Place: My Life as a Scholar – just recently released from Eerdmans Publishing Company. I recently had a chance to travel for a week. I took the book with me and was so deeply encouraged about the providence of God in our lives but also with my deep passion and calling to keep the local church and the theological academy connected. It was such a joy to read about Luke’s life, but it was a great honor to get to talk to him about it. I could have spent two or three hours talking to him about his life and the significance of the scholarly vocation. I know that I will revisit this conversation again and again, and I hope you will be blessed by it as well. 

Welcome to episode fifty-seven of New Creation Conversations. In today’s conversation I’m very excited to be joined by Dr. Michael Graves. Michael is Professor of Biblical Studies at Wheaton College. Michael is an alum of Wheaton, he has a master’s degree from Trinity Evangelical Divinity School, and earned another master’s degree and his PhD from Hebrew Union College. Michael has written several excellent books on biblical interpretation including The Inspiration and Interpretation of Scripture: What the Early Church Can Teach Us (Eerdmans, 2014); Biblical Interpretation in the Early Church (Fortress, 2017), and he contributed one of the volumes – the Commentary on Jeremiah – in the Ancient Christian Texts series (IVP Academic, 2012).His most recent book is, How Scripture Interprets Scripture: What Biblical Writers Can Teach Us about Reading the Bible – just recently released from Baker Academic. One of the great gifts of the last five hundred years is that every day Christians can have the Bible in their own hands, in their own language. Although this is an amazing blessing, the challenge it creates is that every Christian with their own Bible also becomes their own interpreter. That’s where the work of scholars like Dr. Graves can be so helpful. Michael’s interest and passion is not only to help people interpret the bible well in the present, but also to help all of us interpret God’s Word in connection to the great biblical interpreters of the past. I found our conversation helpful, thoughtful, and enriching; and I know you will too.

Welcome to episode fifty-six of New Creation Conversations. In today’s conversation I’m honored to be joined by Dr. Klyne Snodgrass. Dr. Snodgrass is now Professor Emeritus of New Testament Studies after serving for forty-one years as a professor, as a dean, and as the Paul W. Brandel Chair of New Testament Studies at North Park Seminary in Chicago. Klyne is an alum of Columbia Bible College, he received his MDiv degree from Trinity Evangelical Divinity School, and he earned his PhD from the University of St. Andrews in Scotland.Klyne has written several books including the commentary on Ephesians that is part of The NIV Application Commentary. He has written two books on the parables: The Parable of the Wicked Tenants: An Inquiry into Parable Interpretation and Stories with Intent: A Comprehensive Guide to the Parables of Jesus. (A book which received a Christianity Today award in 2008). His other books are: Between Two Truths: Living with Biblical Tension and Who God Says You Are: A Christian Understanding of Identity. In 2014 there was a Festschrift published in his honor entitled, Doing Theology for the Church: Essays in Honor of Klyne Snodgrass, that includes contributions from Darrell Bock, Richard Longenecker, Scot McKnight, and N.T. Wright. Klyne and I reflect a bit about his previous works in our conversation, however the majority of our discussion centers on his most recent book, You Need a Better Gospel: Reclaiming the Good News of Participation with Christ – just released in January of 2022 from Baker Academic. In it, Dr. Snodgrass reflects on how, too often, the church hasn’t done justice to its own gospel because it has neglected how much the New Testament message is about deep involvement in life with God. There is a great deal of resonance for me in Klyne’s emphasis in this book on participation with Christ and the themes that I’ve tried to focus on in these conversations about the new creation.  As you will quickly pick up in this conversation, I thoroughly enjoyed listening to Dr. Snodgrass’ reflections on a lifetime of scholarship and teaching. There is a deep wisdom that emerges from his experiences that we need to have around the table. I had a great time gleaning a kind of fatherly or grandfatherly wisdom in my conversation with Dr. Snodgrass, and I know you will be edified by our conversation as well. Thanks as always for joining me in this journey into the new creation. Here’s my conversation with Dr. Klyne Snodgrass.  

Welcome to episode fifty-five of New Creation Conversations. In today’s conversation I’m delighted to be joined by Dr. Philip Zimmermann. Philip is the co-founder and pastor of Church in Action in Germany. Born in Frankfurt, Philip is known for strategic thinking and creative problem solving. He is a social entrepreneur, a pastor, and a church planter who has started and led several churches, non-profits, and businesses.Philip is an ordained elder in the Church of the Nazarene. He received a Bachelor of Arts in Religion from European Nazarene College, a Master of Arts in Spiritual formation from Northwest Nazarene University, and a Doctorate of Strategic Leadership from Regent University. When he has the space, Philip teaches university courses in leadership and spiritual formation and speaks at leadership conferences around the world. He has written two books: Problem Solving and Creativity and Time Management. Recently, Philip was in town, and my wife (Debbie) and I had the privilege of attending a seminar he was leading on the mind shift (or change in imagination) necessary for the church to reach an increasingly post-Christian culture. The seminar was challenging and insightful, and so I was excited to get a chance to sit down and have a conversation with Philip about the Church in Action and what he is learning about the mission of the church in this historical moment. One very fun aspect of this conversation is that we were in the same room together. It took me fifty-five of these conversations to finally have one that wasn’t on Zoom but face-to-face. I loved not only the chance to spend an hour or so with Philip, but I also came away excited and filled with hope for the future of not only my own denomination but the global Body of Christ as it will be led by young leaders like Philip. I think you will not only learn a lot from our conversation, but you will also be encouraged as well. Thanks for joining me on these weekly journeys toward the new creation. Here’s my conversation with Dr. Philip Zimmermann.

Welcome to episode fifty-four of New Creation Conversations. In today’s conversation I’m excited to be joined by Rev. Sean Palmer. Sean is the Teaching Pastor at Ecclesia Houston – an innovative and thriving multi-site church in South Texas. Sean has served for over twenty years in ministry and was selected by Christian Standard Magazines one of the best “40 Leaders Under 40.” He’s a frequent speaker, teacher, and writer – his work appearing in places like Jesus Creed, Sojourners, The Lookout Magazine, and Missio Alliance. Sean has written or contributed to several books. We talk about his book Unarmed Empire: In Search of Beloved Community (published by Cascade Books). In that book Sean reflects on the kind of community the church is called to be – an alternative community devoid of fear, wherein God’s love and acceptance are mediated to all people through the grace of Jesus.Much of our conversation centers around his most recent works related to the Enneagram. Recently, IVP came out with a series of books called “Enneagram Daily Reflections” – a series of books devoted to each of the nine enneagram numbers. Sean wrote the volume, Forty Days on Being a Three. I am also a three on the enneagram – so having journeyed through his book -  I was very excited to talk about the enneagram and the life of a three with Sean.Sean also has a new book – Speaking by the Numbers: Enneagram Wisdom for Teachers, Pastors, and Communicators (which will be released in May from IVP) on how to speak to and communicate in transformative ways to people across the enneagram spectrum. It’s a fascinating insight and a rich part of our conversation.I found my conversation with Sean delightful and helpful. If you already know a bit about the enneagram, I know you will love this conversation – no matter what number you are. And if you are new to this whole enneagram thing, I think you will find what Sean has to say as an invitation to explore and understand your motivations, as well as what motivates those around you more deeply. 

Welcome to episode fifty-three of New Creation Conversations. In today’s conversation I’m very happy to be joined by Dr. Christopher Hays. Chris is the D. Wilson Moore Professor of Old Testament and Ancient Near Eastern Studies at Fuller Theological Seminary – where he has taught now for fourteen years. He’s an alum of Amherst College, has an MDiv degree from Princeton Seminary, and earned his PhD from Emory University.Chris is one of those people who loves to study the ancient world. He has immersed himself in ancient languages like Akkadian and Ugaritic. The last time I was with Chris in person he was off with (friend of the podcast) Brent Strawn to translate some ancient tablets. Chris’ work frequently centers on helping us read the Scriptures – the Old Testament in particular- in the light of their ancient contexts. Along those lines, we will discuss his beautiful book, Hidden Riches: A Textbook for the Comparative Study of the Old Testament and the Ancient Near East as well as his in-depth research on Isaiah entitled, Death in the Iron Age II and in First Isaiah.However, our primary reason for connecting is to talk about a book he recently co-edited with his former colleague Carly Crouch, God and Guns: The Bible Against American Gun Culture (from Westminster John Knox Press). It is a thoughtful and provocative set of essays from several significant biblical scholars and theologians – including Chris - addressing questions of faith and gun violence. (It also includes a Foreword from Stanley Hauerwas). Chris and I recorded this conversation a couple of weeks ago, just days before the Russian invasion of Ukraine. In just the handful of days since we recorded there have been three mass shooting in the U.S. So, although this topic can be both controversial and complicated, it is an important conversation for the church to have. I’m thankful for thoughtful friends, like Chris, Carly, and Brent, who are willing to bring their biblical expertise and wade into the troubling waters of this crucial conversation, and I’m glad I get to share this conversation with you. 

Professor J. Richard Middleton discusses worldviews and postmodernity, emphasizing the significance of his books in shaping Christian universities. They explore the gods of the age, the biblical narrative, difficult texts, and the urgency of prayer. The chapter also touches on transitioning to writing and expresses gratitude for the guest's work.