One God Report

A Trinitarian Baptist pastor says the Father veiled himself in flesh, bled and died. Really? Why such confusion? Does the New Testament really tell believers in Jesus to take a little wafer and cup of juiced or wine to remember Jesus’s birth? What did Jesus mean when he said, “Do THIS in remembrance of me”? Resources for this episode: Video: The Promised Land is not a Desert and is a Paradigm of the Age to Come https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJxghQtxBEQ Podcast Interview with Mark Cain, “A Good Land” https://podcast.unitarianchristianalliance.org/41-a-good-land-bill-schlegel Long Hollow Baptist Church Christmas Eve Sermon (pastor’s prayer starts around 17:35 minute) https://longhollow.com/christmas-eve-sermon Meaning of “Mass” https://aleteia.org/2017/08/24/why-do-catholics-call-their-main-church-services-mass/

This episode is part 3 of the three part series, “Finding the Deity of Christ in the Old Testament is not a New Testament Exercise”. In Part 1 we saw that on the day of his resurrection, as recorded in Luke 24, Jesus appealed to the Old Testament Scriptures not to proclaim his deity, but to proclaim that the Messiah would suffer and die before being resurrected and exalted. In Part 2 we saw that when Peter and Paul in the Book of Acts appealed to the Old Testament to declare who Messiah/Christ is, they never claim anything about the deity of Christ. Rather, like Jesus, they proclaim that the Christ had to suffer and die and then be raised by God to glory. In this episode we examine two famous Old Testament texts that traditional Christianity has claimed to be evidence of the deity of Christ. We see that the New Testament never makes this claim. Rather, appeals to the Old Testament to proclaim the deity of Christ only come from church fathers of later centuries after Christ. The claims are tradition, not biblical. For the full written text, see here. https://landandbible.blogspot.com/2021/12/finding-evidence-for-deity-of-christ-in.html

In the previous episode, "Finding the Deity of Christ in the Old Testament, Part 1", we saw that Jesus believed that the Old Testament spoke of the death and resurrection of the Messiah, not deity.   In this episode we examine the sermons of Peter and Paul as recorded in the Book of Acts to see if they ever appealed to Old Testament Scriptures to find evidence for the deity of Christ.  We discover that the apostles, like Jesus, never appealed to the Old Testament in an effort to find evidence for the deity of Jesus Christ. Rather, like Jesus, the apostles appealed to Old Testament Scriptures to declare the death and resurrection of Christ. Finding evidence for the deity of Jesus Christ in the Old Testament is an activity which began in the centuries after the New Testament was written. Such efforts are foreign to the New Testament. - One God believers can and should challenge those who appeal to the Old Testament for evidence of the deity of Christ: Jesus never appealed to the Old Testament in an effort to prove the deity of Christ. Why are you? Jesus never appealed to the Old Testament in an effort to prove that God is triune. Why are you? Do you know better than Jesus and the New Testament authors?  What is your source, since it is not the Bible?

Jesus believed that the prophets spoke of the death and resurrection of the Messiah, not deity. Neither Jesus nor any author of the New Testament appealed to the Old Testament in an effort to find evidence for the deity of Jesus Christ. Finding evidence for the deity of Jesus Christ in the Old Testament is an activity which began in the centuries after the New Testament was written. Such efforts are foreign to the New Testament. Based on Jesus’s own post-resurrection appeals to the Old Testament as described in Luke 24:25-27, and 24:44-47, in this episode we see if Jesus appealed to the Torah of Moses, the Prophets or the Writings (the Old Testament) to declare his "deity".  - One God believers can and should challenge those who appeal to the Old Testament for evidence of the deity of Christ: Jesus never appealed to the Old Testament in an effort to prove the deity of Christ. Why are you? Jesus never appealed to the Old Testament in an effort to prove that God is triune. Why are you? Do you know better than Jesus and the New Testament authors? What is your source, since it is not the Bible?

We continue our discussion with Troy Salinger concerning the "Pre-incarnate Appearances of the Son of God in the Old Testament". In this episode we examine Genesis 18-19, where Yahweh appeared to Abraham via three messengers.   No one in the Bible claims that these visitors were a literal pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus, but ever since the mid-second century AD, beginning with Justin Martyr, most of traditional Christianity has held that Abraham was literally visited by the pre-incarnate Christ.  Salinger leads the discussion examining the pre-incarnate claim and like other Old Testament passages, explains that likewise this appearance of Yahweh is most simply understood as agency. That is, Yahweh God is represented by his agent messengers. When the messengers speaks or act it is Yahweh speaking or acting. And those to whom Yahweh appears via messengers can speak to Yahweh through His messengers. Schlegel gives biblical evidence that the messengers in Genesis 18-19 were actually human beings, specifically, that one of the messengers was Melchizedek. Resources: Troy Salinger "Let the Truth Come Out" blog: https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/author/troysal/ Articles on supposed pre-incarnate appearances of the Son of God in the OT: https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/?s=pre-incarnate

We continue our discussion with Troy Salinger on the “Pre-incarnate Appearances of the Son of God in the OT: Truth or Myth”. In this episode Salinger leads us in a discussion about the “Commander of the LORD’s Armies” who appeared with a drawn sword in Joshua 5:13-15, just before the Israelites attacked and conquered Jericho. The Trinitarian world strongly suggests, sometimes insists, that this Commander of the LORD’s Army was a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus. But was it? Salinger gives good reasons why the answer is no, and suggests who this person really may have been. See more in this article by Troy Salinger https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/2019/03/03/pre-incarnate-appearances-of-the-son-of-god-in-the-ot-truth-or-myth-part-3/ Troy Salinger’s blog https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/

We continue our discussion with Troy Salinger on the supposed pre-incarnate appearances of the Son of God in the Old Testament. In this episode we look at three events which Trinitarians have claimed to be a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus in the Old Testament. 1. The burning bush incident in Exodus 3 (did Jesus claim in John 8:58 to be the God that appeared there?). 2. Melchizedek – was he a pre-incarnate Jesus? 3. Did Jesus appear “like one of the sons of God” in the fiery furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego? The podcast is based on Salinger’s article: Pre-incarnate Appearances of the Son of God in the OT: Truth or Myth, Part 3 https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/2019/03/03/pre-incarnate-appearances-of-the-son-of-god-in-the-ot-truth-or-myth-part-3/

In this episode we ask the dual-natured, “100% God 100% man” Jesus some questions and find him to be at best a double-minded person, at worst a schizophrenic liar. Traditional Christianity has maintained for centuries that Jesus is one person but has two natures, that Jesus is a God-man.  The claim that “Jesus is God” or that Jesus is a “God-man” is thought to honor and exalt Jesus Christ, but actually denigrates him. The unbiblical “God-man” claim tries to turn the Jewish Jesus Christ into a two-faced liar.

In this second episode we continue to discuss the claim that Jesus the Son of God made pre-incarnate appearances in the Old Testament period.  We focus in this episode on the angel of the LORD. No New Testament author claimed that Jesus made pre-incarnate appearances as the angel of the Lord. The claim begins in the AD 2nd century, with Justin Martyr being the first one on record to make such a claim. Why is it that the angel (or Messenger) of Yahweh in the Old Testament is sometimes clearly said to be an angel, but then at other times actually seems to be Yahweh God? Is Jesus the angel of the Lord who is distinct from the Father but is someone still God? Salinger first shows that the angel of the Lord is by no means always the same person or being in every case the angel/messenger appears. In fact, there are human beings in the Old Testament who are specifically called the angel(s) of the Lord. Salinger explains that the key to understanding the passages about the angel of the Lord being distinct from Yahweh but sometimes speaking in the 1st person as Yahweh, or whose works are attributed to Yahweh, is AGENCY. The angel/messenger carries the authority and resources of God who sent him. God is considered to be personally present in the presence of the messenger He sent. Some examples of agency, where the agent is considered to be the one who sent him, are given from both the Old and New Testaments. There is no need for mysterious speculation about an angel who both is and isn’t God. Resource links for this episode: Salinger article: Pre-incarnate appearances in the OT: Truth or Myth Part 1 https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/2019/01/23/pre-incarnate-appearances-of-the-son-of-god-in-the-ot-truth-or-myth-part-1/ Troy Salinger blog home: https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/ Bill Schlegel YouTube channel

Interview with painter and theologian Troy Salinger. Troy Salinger's blog is Let the Truth Come Out: https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/ In this first episode of a series, we discuss motivations for why some Christians feel the need to find pre-incarnate appearances of Jesus in the OT. Their motivation is based on the pre-supposition that Jesus was more than a human being. That he was a spirit emanation out of God, a created being like an angel, or God himself, or one member of a godhead. No one in the NT goes to the OT to find evidences of the pre-incarnate God the Son, so those who believe in a pre-incarnate son look for clues themselves to find him. Justin Martyr was the first Christian writer on record to propose the idea that certain appearances of God in the Old Testament were actually Jesus.  Justin Martyr lived in the middle of the 2ndcentury, some 100 years after Jesus was on earth. At least three places in the New Testament say that God can’t be seen. The Trinitarian assumes this refers to the Father (or the Trinity?), but for some reason maintains that the second person of the godhead can be seen. But how is it that the Father can not be seen, but the son who is fully God exactly the same as the Father in every way, can be seen? We discuss three New Testament verses (1 Cor. 10:3-4, 9 and Jude 5) that Trinitarians claim show that Jesus was literally alive in the Old Testament period and involved in the Israelite Exodus from Egypt. In the next episode, God willing, we discuss if the Angel of the Lord who appeared in the New Testament was a pre-incarnate appearance of the Son of God. Links for this episode: Troy Salinger blog home: https: //letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/ Pre-incarnate appearances of the Son of God in the OT: Truth or Myth, Part 1 https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/2019/01/23/pre-incarnate-appearances-of-the-son-of-god-in-the-ot-truth-or-myth-part-1/ Refutation of the Master’s University Document on the Deity of Christ and the Trinity(8 articles) https://letthetruthcomeoutblog.wordpress.com/?s=Refutation+master%27s+university (Biblical) Unitarian Christian Alliance Conference, Oct. 15-17, 2012 https://www.unitarianchristianalliance.org/conference/