Leading Saints Podcast

Skyler Droubay has a bachelors degree in Civil Engineering and a Masters in Business Administration from Utah State University, and works at a trucking company, Double D Distribution. He is currently a counselor in his bishopric and has previously served as elders quorum secretary and counselor, Cub Scout leader, and teacher in Sunday School, elders quorum, and Primary (including nursery). Skyler and his wife live in Lehi, Utah, with their two daughters, ages 10 and 8. Highlights 02:30 Introduction to Skyler, former elders quorum secretary 06:30 Skyler shares an experience he had as a youth with an executive secretary that has influenced his time as a secretary. 12:30. The secretary takes care of the clerical and administrative aspects of the quorum to help enable the other members of the presidency to focus on ministering and the more spiritual aspects of the quorum. 14:50 The admin and clerical work is a very important part of the church too. There are many working pieces that go into making a meeting happen. 16:50 Never underestimate the spiritual power of doing temporal things well. You bring spiritual power to your presidency by taking care of the administration. 18:50 Taking notes is the most important part of being a secretary. You are a revelation recorder. Be proud of being the note taker. 23:30 Take the lead on organizing notes with google docs and google sheets. 26:40 Find a template that works for you and go with it. 28:30 Setting up interviews and appointments. Skylar found it easier to call people rather than text. Try to catch as many people as you can at church. 33:00 Don’t underestimate your impact as a secretary. 34:10 Skyler shares his testimony on leadership and coming closer to Christ through his service. Links Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Watch on YouTube Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, DeAnna Murphy, Michael Goodman, Richard Ostler, Ganel-Lyn Condie, and many more in over 500 episodes. Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

This is a rebroadcast. The episode originally ran in July 2019. Matthew Dicks is an author, columnist, teacher, storyteller, podcaster, blogger, playwright, and more. He is the co-founder and artistic director of Speak Up, a storytelling organization that produces shows throughout New England as well as a weekly podcast, and the author of Storyworthy. He's also the CEO of StoryworthyMD, where he teaches storytelling online. He consults with Fortune 500 companies, universities, attorneys, entrepreneurs, the clergy, and many more on storytelling and communication. Matthew is a 58-time Moth StorySLAM champion and 9-time GrandSLAM champion and has told stories for a wide range of events, radio shows, and performance venues. He lives in Connecticut with his wife, Elysha, and their two children. Highlights 07:26 With his wife runs an organization called “Speak Up” which puts on storytelling events 08:13 The science of telling a good story, i.e., public speaking in an engaging way 10:15 Basic storytelling principles: Know what a story is: a moment in your life that is transformational and reflects change over time, as opposed to a simple retelling of chronological events. Ask yourself: Am I speaking about a moment in my life that changed me in some way? You can’t really change your audience with a story unless that story changed you. Share something of yourself, that makes you authentic and vulnerable. Being vulnerable to others also makes you safe to others, and they will be more willing to be vulnerable with you. Set out to have your listeners feel like they connected with you in the end. Showing emotion is acceptable so long as you can speak your truth in a clear way. 21:10 Teaching from scripture versus sharing of yourself It is hard for people to care about the scriptural content or lesson unless they can see a relatable example of application from a person they trust. 24:26 Using our own stories versus using “borrowed” stories, e.g., using a story given in General Conference in a sacrament meeting talk Telling your own story is the best way to be authentic. 26:50 Improving our storytelling: “Homework for life”: Before going to bed, ask yourself “what’s the most story-worthy moment of today?” Write it down. Explore why and how the experience changed you. Matt has noticed that he has changed every day of his life, as documented in his “Homework for life” spreadsheet. Frame of the story is most important: what is the end, and what is the beginning? Must have some entertainment value. Jump right into the story. Stay within the story. Remember the story without memorizing–rehearse! Tell the story in “scenes”. How to tell a story “on the spot”: what does something mean to me? Listeners should know how you are different at the end of the story from the beginning. Asking “why?” five times about your storyworthy moments. I.e.: Today I was changed by X experience. Why did X experience change me? Why A? Because B. But, why B? Because C. Why C? Because D. Etc. 55:21 Storytime! 65:49 Reviewing and deconstructing the story 72:25 How storytelling has helped him become a better person Links MatthewDicks.com Storyworthy: Engage, Teach, Persuade, and Change Your Life through the Power of Storytelling TED Talk: Homework for Life Speak Up Storytelling StoryworthyMD.com YouTube stories Art of Manliness podcast episode Watch this podcast on YouTube Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg,

Shannon Foster taught seminary full time for thirteen years in the Salt Lake area. Shannon has a passion for the scriptures and for discovering the best ways for children and youth to learn the gospel. She has written over twenty books to help people study the scriptures and creates helps for people to study and teach the Come, Follow Me chapters in their homes. Shannon and her husband Tyson have two amazing children and she is currently a Relief Society teacher. Highlights 02:00 Introduction to Shannon Foster. Shannon provides resources for Come Follow Me and teaching our families. 03:40 Shannon is also known as The Red Headed Hostess. 05:00 Best advice for gathering people What will make this feel special? What will help people feel comfortable? 07:00 If the youth feel like you strengthen them and that you care about them they will return again and again. 08:00 Shannon shares her story and how she started teaching. 13:30 The classroom is not the ideal learning circumstance. While it's a good place, it’s not the best. Parents know their children so much better and can teach them so much better. 16:00 Shannon is the creator of The Red Headed Hostess. It started as a blog and she now has 15 people on her staff. She offers scripture study help for families and for all ages. 18:00 Common obstacles that come with teaching in the home and with Come Follow Me. One of those obstacles is not having enough time and not everyone is home at the same time. 23:50 We all want the picturesque family scripture study and we think we are failing if that's not what it looks like for us. 29:30 How to adjust family scripture study and what to do to stay on track. 31:40 Another big obstacle in family scripture study is that they don’t understand the scriptures. It has to start with the parents. The parents have to learn to love the scriptures. You then become like a fire and want to share that with your family. 34:20 How would you coach someone that is in the beginning stages of trying to get into scripture study and is relying on podcasts and blogs to help them understand? Get a scripture journal Learn to slow down while reading. Remember it’s line upon line. 37:30 We underestimate the youth. Teach your youth to slow down and do their own journaling. 39:30 Advice for keeping a scripture journal. Topical journal Chronological journal 44:45 Making Sunday school or studying with family a more profound experience. Don’t only teach but invite them to act to help them get the evidence they need to know something is true. 58:00 Shannon shares her final thoughts on the importance of the scriptures and what a gift they are to have. 1:03:00 Shannon’s testimony and reflections on her time as a teacher Links TheRedHeadedHostess.com Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Listen on YouTube Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, DeAnna Murphy, Michael Goodman, Richard Ostler, Ganel-Lyn Condie, and many more in over 500 episodes. Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Eli Nelson is originally from Seattle, Washington and is studying business at Brigham Young University. He has served as a counselor in an elders quorum presidency, ward temple and family history leader, and as a full time missionary in the Trinidad, Port of Spain Mission. He currently serves as elders quorum president in his young single adult ward in Provo, Utah, and is the soon-to-be husband to Claire Darby. Highlights 02:20 Eli’s background and mission experience 06:10 Getting called as elders quorum president in a YSA BYU ward 10:10 Principle one: Loving the handbook 12:15 Principle two: Finding the balance between magnifying your calling while also being a good peer 16:00 Principle three: Fostering active leadership in the quorum and ward 17:20 Principle four: The oxygen mask analogy. In order to serve others you have to have something to give. You have to take care of yourself first. 22:00 Time management is very important to taking care of yourself. Eli explains what time boxing is and how he uses it to manage everything in his life. 22:55 Principle five: There’s no substitute for a good secretary 25:05 Principle six: Delegation is critical 28:50 Principle seven: Sometimes you need to be a catalyst for change and push programs and initiatives from the ground up 32:30 Principle eight: The proper motives in church leadership are the two great commandments 36:15 Principle nine: Church leadership is 45% administration and 55% ministering 40:45 Eli shares his final thoughts on leadership and testimony. Links Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Watch on YouTube Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, DeAnna Murphy, Michael Goodman, Richard Ostler, Ganel-Lyn Condie, and many more in over 500 episodes. Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Richard Nash spent his career as a writer and a speaker (not always by choice). He worked in management and marketing for Intermountain Healthcare for 35 years and previously served as a speechwriter and jokewriter for political and corporate leaders. He’s a former bishop and has also served as stake Young Men president, Gospel Doctrine teacher, and nursery leader. Most recently he is the author of 3 Keys to Help You Give a Better Talk. His previous book, Lengthen Your Smile, is a best-selling collection of brief stories (most of them funny) that illustrate faith-based ideals. Richard and his wife, Laurie, have three children and four grandchildren. Highlights 02:10 Introduction to Richard and his book, 3 Keys to Help You Give a Better Talk 07:50 Richard’s book was inspired by David O. McKay. 10:40 Principle 1: Have an objective The objective is the message you want listeners to take away from your talk. Keep your objective to one sentence. You are normally assigned the topic but take the time to pray and read and figure out the objective that you need to teach. 14:30 Is your lesson objective clear? How can you make it clear? 16:20 Richard shares his own personal experience of giving a talk and creating a clear objective and an attention grabbing opener. 17:45 Principle 2: Share examples People love stories. They connect with stories. We remember stories more than anything else we talk about. Stories are a way to show our personality. 22:30 Richard shares how he uses his own personal stories to connect with people. 28:00 Tips for sharing stories Keep a journal of your stories. They should be simple and day-to-day things. It doesn’t have to be a huge experience. Reference scripture stories or other people’s stories but bring your own personal experience into it. 32:45 Principle 3: Emphasize application What can people do because of the things that I’ve spoken today? Emphasize how people can apply principles to help them live the gospel every day. 36:00 The typical sacrament meeting talk is on a conference talk. We are putting their talk in our words. What can we do differently? 37:00 Nervousness is part of giving a talk. It makes us humble and gives us the experience of leaning on the Holy Spirit. 45:00 Is humor appropriate in a sacrament talk? 51:00 Tips for preparing a talk when you are assigned a topic or given a conference talk to speak to 53:50 Oftentimes our objective in Sunday School is to cover the material or certain chapters of scripture. We need to take the time to search those scriptures to find an objective that will help people live their lives. 57:15 Write down notes, quotes, and make an outline but don’t write out your talk verbatim. This allows the Spirit to interrupt us and give us guidance. Links 3 Keys to Help You Give a Better Talk BetterTalksLDS.com/ Teaching Through Better Stories in Sacrament Meeting Talks & Lessons | An Interview with Matthew Dicks Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Watch on YouTube Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, DeAnna Murphy, Michael Goodman, Richard Ostler, Ganel-Lyn Condie, and many more in over 500 episodes. Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum,

Sharla Dance was finishing her degree in Music Education at Brigham Young University when she took a children’s music class from Susan Kenney. The principles and methods used in that class changed the way she wanted to teach music. When her daughter was diagnosed with a brain tumor at age seven, Sharla delved into research about how the brain learns, Howard Gardner's theory of multiple intelligences, and the body's role in learning as taught by neurologist Carla Hannaford. Since then, some of her research and experience has centered around music in a group setting for special needs children. She also started applying her research to Primary music and has continued to learn and teach workshops, helping church music leaders learn principles and brain research that can make them more effective in teaching children. Sharla has taught piano and voice lessons, group preschool, and school age music classes in her studio, Dance Sing and Play, for twenty five years. She has served as ward or stake Primary music leader in over ten different wards and stakes, and as a youth choir specialist in her stake for twenty years. She has served several times as ward choir director and stake music chair, and is currently first counselor in her ward Relief Society. Sharla is the mother of five children and she and her husband live in Washington state where she is also a full-time caregiver for their daughter who had that brain tumor so many years ago. Highlights 04:00 Sharla is the Primary music leader. A Gospel Doctrine teacher for children through music. She shares her resources with other leaders. 06:10 Sharla shares her background and how she got into music. 10:00 Resources Sharla shares for Primary and why she got her website started 12:50 The overall breakdown of what you should do during music time is to teach three different songs with three different activities and bear your testimony in one or two sentences. 15:50 Each child should be actively involved with a specific song. Help the children use their senses to learn and practice the songs. 22:00 One thing that researchers have found that helps the frontal lobe develop is purposeful movement with a steady beat. 23:30 When children learn music with props, beats, and movements it creates an experience for them and brain hooks that help them remember that song. 24:20 Sharla believes that when we teach a child music with these different hooks that the song will come back to teach the child and to teach them doctrine when they really need it. 26:00 Drilling the words of a song and practicing them over and over is what we commonly see in Primary. However, Sharla teaches that we need to focus on the beat, rhythm, and the melody while singing the words. This is way easier for the brain to connect everything. 30:20 The process of audiation is singing a song in your head. It’s the strongest way to remember a song. Leave out words and have the kids fill them in and sing it out loud. 31:00 Sharla explains why movement while singing and to a steady beat is so important and useful for children. It activates the whole body and turns it into a thinking machine. 34:00 Line upon line is a great way for the brain to learn, especially when we sing the whole song. 37:20 Parents have found that even the children that don’t really participate in Primary are singing at home all the time. 40:00 Sharla does activities that can involve all the children and the songs that they are learning, especially because there is only twenty minutes to do it in. 41:30 Research shows that to keep the attention span of an adult active and attentive we need to change the pace every ten minutes. Children need a change of pace every six to seven minutes. 45:30 The teachers need to be involved in music time too. 46:40 Each child takes in information in a slightly different way and the brain craves variety. We need to teach in different ways to reach different children. 53:40 Bear a short, sincere testimony every week.

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Glenn R. Schiraldi, Ph.D., Lt. Colonel (US Army Reserve, Retired), is a graduate of the U.S. Military Academy, West Point, and a Vietnam-era veteran. He holds graduate degrees from Brigham Young University and the University of Maryland, and has served on the stress management faculties at the Pentagon, the International Critical Incident Stress Foundation, and the University of Maryland School of Public Health. He has trained mental health professionals and laypersons—including high-risk groups such as the military, police, and firefighters—on stress, trauma, and resilience. Glenn is the founder of Resilience Training International, which teaches how to prevent and recover from stress-related conditions such as PTSD, depression, and anxiety, while optimizing mental health and performance under pressure. An eternally-grateful convert of 47 years, Glenn serves in a young single adult branch presidency and, with his wife, leads the Addiction Recovery Program in his stake in Florida. Highlights 02:40 Kurt introduces Glenn and the topic of childhood trauma. 05:15 Glenn shares his background and conversion story. 08:25 Glenn explains what he does and what led him to write many books and create courses to help people with their mental health. 11:30 Childhood wounds and how they affect people who are religious versus non religious 13:50 The original ten adverse childhood experiences that cause wounds that people carry into adulthood 16:00 Unresolved pain leads people to drugs and pornography. Unresolved childhood wounds can manifest physically or spiritually. 18:50 How can a leader be a resource to those struggling with childhood wounds and lead them in the right direction to find healing? 20:30 How memories are imprinted on us 23:30 We need a deeper, more dynamic approach to healing childhood trauma. It’s important to find a therapist that is a trauma specialist. 27:00 Glenn explains Accelerated Resolution Therapy, known as ART. This is a fairly new form of therapy that is very effective for helping people with trauma. 34:30 Leaders can encourage people to write out their feelings. Expressive writing and journaling can benefit people trying to deal with old trauma that don’t want to talk about it. 40:00 God is the ultimate attachment figure and his love is the ultimate answer to shame. 45:00 According to research it’s a myth that religion adds to more shame. Religion can cause guilt. Religion is the answer to guilt. 48:50 Big T trauma and small t trauma 51:50 Do most issues come from childhood trauma? 54:45 Coping with trauma by perfectionism and overachieving. They try to overcompensate. 58:00 Latter-day Saint people tend to be overachievers. Most overachievers were adaptive and they like it. Others have fear-driven overachievement. 1:01:00 We don’t have to suffer for decades. A lot of times we just need to learn certain skills to overcome. Take the time to find the right therapist. 1:03:20 A good leader loves the people as Christ did. Links The Adverse Childhood Experiences Recovery Workbook Glenn R. Schiraldi books Accelerated Resolution Therapy Resilience Training International Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Watch on YouTube Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, DeAnna Murphy, Michael Goodman, Richard Ostler, Ganel-Lyn Condie,

Sara Payne is currently serving as the stake Relief Society president in Billings, Montana, and previously served as a branch Relief Society president in rural Maine. She loves Relief Society and considers it one of her purposes to help women in the Church understand that they belong and are wanted and needed in this great organization. Sara is a relationship coach and spends her days helping women who are married to physicians to create thriving marriages. Dale Williams has served in elders quorum, as a bishop and bishop's counselor, and in a stake presidency. He is currently a stake president in Billings, Montana. Dale is a business owner and practices as a chiropractor. Highlights 02:30 Introduction to Stake President Dale Williams and Stake Relief Society President Sara Payne in Billings, Montana. 04:45 Sara’s past experience and getting called as stake Relief Society president. 06:20 Dale shares his experience extending callings. He called Sara because she is a person who thinks outside the box. 09:45 Sara talks about beginning her calling and the intimidation she felt. 11:20 Dale talks about coming together and gathering ideas and thoughts. This creates an atmosphere of openness. 14:50 Dale describes the culture of the meetings they have as stake leaders. Things that he has found that work and don’t work. 16:15 The stake president states his opinion last. He lets everyone else speak and share first. This is a way he can also gain revelation. 18:50 There is a difference between respecting our leaders and putting them on a pedestal, like they are all knowing. 20:00 Reaching for unity. Go into any interaction knowing that you are on the same team even though opinions might differ. 23:00 Dale shares an experience of not agreeing and changing things up in the stake. 27:15 Sometimes we have to let go of who can do it the most effectively. Let everyone serve in their own way. 29:00 Dale has one-on-one meetings every month with Sara. She leads the discussion normally and takes time to prepare for it. 31:30 At the beginning of any meeting or one-on-one they begin by talking about a concern they have or gospel principle and counsel together before getting to the agenda items. They unify their thinking and come together. 33:10 Sara was very intimidated in stake councils to share her opinions and speak up. She talks about the things that helped her feel safe and open up. 35:40 Dale and his counselors share what they are going through. They are vulnerable. He has found that it’s not normally in our strengths that we come together but in our weaknesses. 38:10 What it means to be heard. Being heard doesn’t mean getting your way. 40:30 It’s not about what the leader can do but what they can help others do. Links Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Watch on YouTube Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, DeAnna Murphy, Michael Goodman, Richard Ostler, Ganel-Lyn Condie, and many more in over 500 episodes. Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Emily Robison Adams is married with three children and is a practicing appellate attorney. She received her undergraduate degree in linguistics from Brigham Young University and her JD from the University of Minnesota Law School. She worked for judges on the Minnesota Court of Appeals and the Federal District Court for the District of Minnesota before returning to Utah. She is a partner at The Appellate Group, a boutique law firm focusing on appeals. Emily has served in Relief Society and Young Women presidencies, taught Relief Society, and currently serves as the Primary chorister. Highlights 02:00 Kurt introduces Emily and her story. 04:00 Emily shares her background. 06:00 Emily’s faith crisis. She felt like she couldn’t get answers from God. 09:10 A crisis dismantles your framework and the story you’ve built your life on. 11:20 The shame that comes from feeling like you can’t connect with the divine. 15:25 How leaders can help with a faith crisis. 17:50 Emily shares that she dealt with bitterness and doubts and didn't know what to do with her doubts. 20:40 How leaders can use the tool of rethinking to help an individual struggling with their faith. 23:30 Emily shares how she was able to rethink. She did this by finding people that were feeling the same way. She found books from other religions and perspectives that really helped her. 28:45 There are moments where scripture study feels empty. Find new ways to connect with God. It could be a hike, a walk, ten minutes of quiet. 31:50 Leaders are there to mourn with those that mourn. Be careful about preaching to someone that is in the tender stage of their faith crisis. Try to gauge where the person is at and what they need at the moment. 35:00 Leaders should resist the urge to fix everyone’s problems. Listen to their story. Show empathy for their difficulty. 37:15 Spencer Fluhman talks about how you answer gospel questions by not answering gospel questions but by connecting to the person who is asking you the question. 38:15 How to spot if someone is having a faith crisis or mental health issue. 43:00 Emily talks about sending smoke signals to people when she started struggling with her faith. 45:15 Leaders need to create safety in their wards. Safety to share. “There is no such thing as resistance, only lack of safety.” 48:00 Where Emily is at now in her faith journey. 53:00 Emily talks about how she is grateful for the quietness. How her faith has grown. Links Divine Quietness: Finding Meaning When Heaven is Silent Faith After Doubt Stages of Faith The Dark Night of the Soul What Every Leader Needs to Know About Faith Crisis | An Interview with Scott Braithwaite “Answering Sincere Gospel Questions,” with Spencer Fluhman Read the TRANSCRIPT of this podcast Watch on YouTube Get 14-day access to the Core Leader Library The Leading Saints Podcast has ranked in the top 20 Christianity podcasts in iTunes, gets over 500,000 listens each month, and has over 10 million total downloads as part of nonprofit Leading Saints' mission to help latter-day saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org. Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, J. Devn Cornish, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, DeAnna Murphy, Michael Goodman, Richard Ostler, Ganel-Lyn Condie, and many more in over 500 episodes. Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.