Therapy on the Cutting Edge

In this episode, I speak with Sam about his career and what lead him to become an Emotionally Focused Couple Therapy trainer, teaching EFT in The United States and throughout Latin America, S​pain and the Caribbean. Sam discussed how his clients lead him to EFT when, although he had trained in multiple models of couples therapy, his clients were saying they felt like the therapy wasn’t going deep enough for them. He shared that he had been reading about attachment theory and John Bowlby’s work, and then took a workshop in EFT from Sue Johnson, Ph.D. He said he fell in love with the model and explained how it helped him see the struggles of couples he was working within a different light, and through the lens of attachment, he could see beyond their conflicts and struggles and see their protests at disconnection as longing for connection. We discussed how Sue asked him to become a trainer in EFT, and asked him to bring EFT to Spanish-speaking countries, as he was originally from Mexico City and spoke Spanish fluently. Sam shares about the countries he has provided trainings in and we discussed cultural nuances that he has found in Latin American cultures and with other cultures. He discussed how the expression of love and the expectations of closeness are influenced by culture, and also how all human beings, regardless of culture, have the fundamental need for connection and safety. We discussed dynamics in Latin American culture that relate to gender, socioeconomic status, relation to family, collectivism and individualism, and how these may appear in couples therapy. In addition to Sam’s cross cultural work, we also discussed his work on Forgiveness, and a training he had first done with Dr. Michelle Gannon on apologies and how important they are to healing Attachment Injuries. Sam now teaches Master Classes on Attachment Injuries and Forgiveness with fellow Argentinean Trainer Natalia Gilabert. We left off commenting on the book Sam coauthored for the APA called Deliberate Practice in Emotionally Focused Couple Therapy, and trainings he is offering in-person this September in San Diego with Dr. Lisa Palmer Olsen, and online in 2026. Sam Jinich, Ph.D. is a Clinical Psychologist in private practice, licensed in California since 1995, and currently based in Buenos Aires, Argentina. He is an internationally recognized Emotionally Focused Therapy (EFT) Trainer, Supervisor, and Certified Couple Therapist, endorsed by the International Centre for Excellence in Emotionally Focused Therapy (ICEEFT). Sam teaches EFT to therapists across the globe in English and Spanish. In North America, his trainings feature English-language didactic presentations with the option of bilingual experiential role plays—reflecting his belief that Latinx bilingual therapists should learn in the language they are most comfortable with, while deliberately practicing in the language they use clinically. A respected leader in the EFT community, Sam co-founded the Northern California Community for EFT (NCCEFT) and served as its EFT Trainer until 2025. He is also a past president of the San Francisco Psychological Association. Over nearly three decades, he has trained thousands of therapists, taught at multiple universities, published scientific research on trauma and family dynamics, and coauthored the APA book Deliberate Practice in Emotionally Focused Couple Therapy. Sam is the Clinical Director of the San Francisco Consultancy in Emotionally Focused Therapy (SFCEFT). Sam will be co-leading an EFT Externship in San Diego in September 2025, and an online EFT Externship in May 2026. Learn more at www.drsamjinich.com or on the ICEEFT website.

In this episode, I sit down with Zenobia Morrill, Ph.D., who shares her journey into psychotherapy—from a personal confrontation with existential truth to navigating her family’s intergenerational pain. Dr. Morrill reflects on her early experiences as a therapy client, where she encountered traditional frameworks that often fell short, approaches that pathologized pain while ignoring the broader systemic and historical forces at play. Grounded in liberation psychology and critical theory, Dr. Morrill offers a compelling critique of mainstream psychological models that individualize suffering and overlook the impact of power, politics, and culture. We explore how psychotherapy can become a tool for liberation, not by reinforcing institutional norms, but by creating space to challenge and reimagine them in service of opening up possibilities for personhood. Dr. Morrill shares how critical-liberation psychotherapy offers practitioners a framework to question how therapeutic practices may either reinforce alienation or open new paths toward freedom, healing, and fuller participation in society. She reflects on the importance of broadening our range of being, reclaiming repressed parts of the self, and bridging individual pain to collective emancipation. Therapy, she argues, must move beyond static formulations and recognize that social, political, and cultural forces are already present in the room—they are not “add-ons” but essential to the client’s lived experience. This approach does not suggest liberation occurs solely within the therapy room, but asks how the institution of therapy itself—its theories, method, and practices—can be used to support liberatory outcomes. Ultimately, Dr. Morrill calls on therapists to resist objectification of clients and of therapy itself—and to reimagine psychotherapy as a dynamic, relational, and contextually grounded space for transformation. Zenobia Morrill, Ph.D., is a critical-liberation psychologist and psychology professor at William James College. She received her doctorate from the University of Massachusetts Boston and completed her pre- and post-doctoral fellowship at the Yale School of Medicine and at Yale Health, Mental Health & Counseling, respectively. Inspired by her personal and professional experiences with the mental health system, Dr. Morrill emphasizes the power in psychological frameworks as the stories we use to understand ourselves, and the risks presented when these frameworks cannot capture the complex existential, sociocultural, familial, physiological, and tacit dimensions of humanity. Her work centers on the belief that psychological healing must account for these broader meaning systems and political structures that shape individual experience. Her research and clinical interests include psychotherapy process, global mental health, qualitative methodology, theory and philosophy, and critical and liberation psychologies. A recipient of the American Psychological Association’s Sigmund Koch Award for Early Career Contribution to Psychology, Dr. Morrill’s work and Critical-Liberation Psychotherapy model have been recognized and presented internationally.

​In this episode, Laney discusses her experience learning about eye movements from taking a training in Eye Movement Desensitization Reprocessing (EMDR). After trying it one time she then found a way to be as direct and quick as possible, which she called Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART). She discusses her approach to utilizing ART to help clients rescript past negative images and narratives. With a background in Gestalt therapy, Laney incorporates rapid eye movements and guided associations to support clients in transforming adverse cognitions into more positive, empowering perspectives. She discovered a way to have the clients brain erase negative images, which cause triggers. Laney has developed this accelerated, directive therapeutic method to address conditions such as ADHD, OCD, eating disorders, generalized anxiety, and depression. She emphasizes the efficiency of ART, noting that clients often experience significant breakthroughs in just a few sessions—sometimes even in a single session. Laney likens the process to a dental procedure: identifying and removing emotional “decay” and replacing it with a metaphorical filling. When clients become emotionally stuck, therapists may employ a technique called Scene Matching, which connects current emotions to past experiences with similar emotional tones, facilitating healing and insight. Much like Fritz Perls’ empty chair technique in Gestalt therapy, ART utilizes metaphorical visualization to allow clients to process unresolved experiences internally. Laney distinguishes ART from EMDR by highlighting its structured, therapist-directed approach, as opposed to EMDR’s emphasis on building a longer-term client-therapist relationship and a free association approach. ART’s clinical precision and efficiency are key to its growing popularity. She explained how today, over 16,000 clinicians have been trained in ART. She discussed research in ART and how in July 2025, Laney and a team of professionals from Yale will begin training clinicians in Kenya. Laney Rosenzweig, MS, LMFT is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist who has been in the mental health field since 1989. Laney is the Founder/Developer of Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART) developed in 2008. She is the CEO of Rosenzweig Center for Rapid Recovery, which trains clinicians in ART. ART has a treatment protocol that is directive, standardized and easy to apply using. It is an eye movement therapy. Her introduction of the Voluntary Image Replacement (VIR), which guides clients to erase negative images from view in their mind, is a unique and powerful way to quickly eliminate triggers and eradicate symptoms. Laney has traveled the globe training licensed mental health professionals in ART and has over 65 ART trainers. Yale University has trained clinicians and in the process of doing a study as well as Mayo Clinic and the Canadian Military. She is available for presentations to civilian and military groups who are seeking an alternative to longer, less effective treatments for trauma and other mental health problems. The website is www.ARTworksNOW.com. There is an intro to ART every 4th Wednesday of the month at 6 pm Eastern and the link can be found on the top of the website.

In this episode, I speak with Alex about his career working with addiction. While there are countless resources for substance-related issues—such as drug, alcohol, and sex addiction—he noticed a striking lack of support when it came to process addictions related to technology use. He shared how he connected with and learned from Dr. Hilarie Cash, founder of reSTART, a pioneering treatment program for technology addiction. Alex discusses his work with parents, helping them implement comprehensive behavioral strategies to support children and adolescents in developing a healthy relationship with technology. In an age where digital exposure is unavoidable and children grow up as digital natives, he explains how we can encourage balance and moderation from an early age to prevent problematic or addictive behaviors from forming. He delves into the unique challenges of treating process or behavioral addictions, which can involve greater complexity than substance-related ones. Alex emphasizes the difficulty of establishing structures that foster intrinsic motivation for self-regulation in children and young adults. He highlights the importance of helping young people connect with their values, become more intentional with their screen time, and take a holistic approach to balance—not just with technology, but across all areas of life. The conversation also explores how parents can coordinate across households to create consistent expectations around technology use and how they can impose meaningful limits even when school-issued laptops have minimal built-in safeguards. Alex concludes by discussing how screen use can become a mechanism for emotional avoidance, which can significantly block personal growth. He underscores the need to prioritize self-care and emotional awareness to prevent this from becoming a long-term negative coping strategy. Alex Basche, LMFT is a psychotherapist based in the SF Bay Area. He works mainly with adolescents and young adults, specializing in the treatment of tech-related behavioral addictions such as gaming, social media, pornography, online gambling & shopping in addition to substance use disorders, as well as frequently co-occurring conditions such as anxiety disorders, ADHD, depressive disorders, OCD, Autism Spectrum, and identity formation issues. In 2017, Alex helped create and found the first in-network Intensive Outpatient Program in the state of California treating technology addiction in adolescents. He has written many therapy groups’ curricula and leads trainings and workshops on topics related to Assessment & Treatment for Process Addictions, Parenting in the Digital Age, Adolescent Anxiety & Depression Treatment and more. Alex serves as a Subject Matter Expert (SME) on the Mental Health Workgroup Advisory Board for Fairplay’s Children’s Screentime Action Network and on the Board of Directors for local nonprofit Adolescent Counseling Services. He continues to co-author and present research on digital addictions and related topics.

In this episode, I speak with Matt about his evolution as a therapist, researcher, and founder of New Harbinger Publications. Originally trained in Gestalt therapy, Matt transitioned to Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) after discovering its effectiveness in addressing his own anxiety—and its ability to offer more structured tools for change. From there, his work expanded into third-wave CBTs like Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT) and Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT), especially as he sought to support clients experiencing complex emotional challenges, trauma, and persistent distress that weren’t always responsive to traditional CBT protocols. We discuss the development of a transdiagnostic and precision-based approach to therapy, centered on identifying specific mechanisms such as emotional and cognitive avoidance. Matt explains how treatment can be tailored using interventions like emotion exposure, mindfulness, and cognitive diffusion to address each client’s unique coping profile—an approach supported by his work on the Comprehensive Coping Inventory. Matt also talks about the founding and mission of New Harbinger Publications, which pioneered the self-help workbook format grounded in evidence-based therapies. He shares insight into their newest tool, Therapy Assist, a digital resource for therapists to assign skills-based, diagnostic-specific homework. We delve into his clinic’s current research on trauma treatment, including the effectiveness of combining ACT with EMDR and written exposure therapy. We also explore how trauma manifests physiologically and emotionally, and why traditional approaches often fall short when addressing complex PTSD, dissociation, or early attachment trauma. Matt reflects on integrating coping skills into ACT—an often debated topic—and describes his efforts to bridge therapeutic models like Schema Therapy and ACT. We explore how these integrations can support trauma clients in choosing value-based responses over automatic, schema-driven reactions. Throughout the conversation, we reflect on the growing movement toward precision therapy—individualized, mechanism-targeted, and empirically grounded. Dr. McKay’s work continues to shape how therapists understand suffering and resilience, and how they can empower clients with the tools to navigate both. Dr. Matthew McKay is a clinical psychologist, professor at the Wright Institute, founder of New Harbinger Publications, and author of research and over 40 books on CBT, ACT, trauma, and emotional healing, including Mind and Emotions, The Relaxation and Stress Reduction Workbook, and Emotion Efficacy Therapy. He cofounded the Haight Ashbury Psychological Services agency in 1979 and served as its Clinical Director for 25 years and is currently the co-director of the Bay Area Trauma Recovery Clinical Services (BATRCS). Matt's interests extend to writing poetry, fiction, and music, and he has a published novel and two books of poetry.

In this episode, I speak with Bill Miller about his road to developing Motivational Interviewing. Bill explained that he started off heading into pastoral ministry but instead chose to be trained as a clinical psychologist. His behavioral PhD program required a two-semester course on how to work with clients before engaging in behavior therapy, and that's where he was introduced to Carl Rogers and a person-centered approach, which significantly influenced his career. He mentioned watching Gerald Patterson doing behavior therapy with families and seeing how he was with clients: warm, engaging, empathic, and funny, which was not covered in published descriptions of the method. On a sabbatical leave in Norway, Bill was asked to demonstrate his own therapeutic approach through role plays in which the clinicians would stop him and ask good questions: "What are you thinking just now? "Why did you ask that particular question?" "How did you decide what tor reflect from all that the client said?" These interactions helped him reflect on what he was doing and why he was doing it, and he wrote down a description that became the first description of motivational interviewing. Seven years later, on sabbatical leave in Australia, he found himself officed next to Stephan Rollnick who would become his career-long co-author. Rollnick had already been teaching motivational interviewing based on Bill's first article and they decided to write together the first book about motivational interviewing that was published in 1991. When they began teaching the method they noticed that some trainees seemed to be using MI techniques “on” rather than “with” clients. What had they left out? They began writing and teaching about the underlying spirit or attitude with which MI is to be practiced. Therapists also shared with them that this way of practicing seems to prevent burnout. In a later book with Theresa Moyers, Bill discussed eight clinical skills that characterize more effective therapists, which are: accurate empathy, genuineness, positive regard, acceptance, hope, evocation, giving advice, and having shared goals or direction. Bill and I explored the term “resistance” and how it is something that happens between people yet is often attributed to client pathology. In yet another book he argued that ambivalence is natural human nature and even a virtue, as it means the person is weighing the options. He and Rollnick reformulated "resistance" as sustain talk (a natural part of ambivalence) and/or discord in the therapeutic relationship. We discussed how in motivational interviewing the therapist is a guide rather than an expert-director. Lastly, he touched on his work on quantum change, which is transformational change that that can occur within a matter of moments or hours and tends to be both permanent and benevolent. Dr. William R. (Bill) Miller, Emeritus Distinguished Professor of Psychology and Psychiatry at the University of New Mexico. He is the author of 67 books including four editions of Motivational Interviewing, Effective Psychotherapists: Clinical Skills That Improve Client Outcomes, Listening Well: The Art of Empathic Understanding , and On Second Thought: How Ambivalence Shapes Your Life. He has been teaching the skill of accurate empathy for over 50 years.

In this episode, Judye discusses growing up in a family where her father was a psychoanalyst and became interested in the field. In graduate school, she became interested in family therapy, and worked at a youth guidance center in Massachusetts, but didn’t find working with children and play to be a way she really wanted to work. Her supervisor had trained at the Ackerman Institute in New York City and had her start working with families, which really fit well for her and her work. She explained she moved to California and worked at Xanthos, now Alameda Family Services, and studied with Alan Leviton, one of the founders of the Association of Family Therapists of Northern California. Additionally, she started teaching at California Institute for Integral Studies in San Francisco, where she taught family therapy by having the students bring in their families to have a family therapy session, or role play if the family was unable to come in. She discussed her work and how she ended up writing a book about her approach called Core Focused Family Therapy. She discussed one of her strategies in the beginning of a family session was to do some dyadic work with two members of the system who were not the central focus, which seemed to help open up conversation and soften stuck systems, and then moving on to the focus on the areas the system might be struggling. Judye explained that one of the reviewers of her book wrote that her approach is love and truth, using a warm, but direct approach. She explained another strategy is to move the focus off of the identified patient, and look at how the whole system is involved with the difficulties that are happening, so they can make a systemic change, which she calls increasing the surface area of the problem. She discussed connecting with he vulnerabilities behind the defenses, and in helping the dyad that seems most open, the rest of the system then usually also become more open to vulnerabilities. She talked about using this model to make significant changes in the family system in a short period of time. She discussed how she focuses on working with families with adult children, and the variety of clients who reach out to her, with family cut offs being a common issue clients are seeking help in repairing their family. Judye Hess, PhD, has worked with families since 1974 when she began her family therapy career at Worcester Child Guidance Center in Worcester, Mass. In 1977, Judye moved to the west coast and found a home at Xanthos, a family counseling center in Alameda, CA, where she worked for the next three years. In 1984, she began teaching at the California Institute of Integral Studies, where she was on the core faculty and taught family dynamics, couples counseling and group process until 2015. She is the author of Core Focused Family Therapy: Moving From Chaos to Clarity and she is now Professor Emerita from CIIS, and since then has maintained a private practice, seeing couples and families of adult children exclusively.

In this episode, Haim discusses his extensive experience providing group and being an early adopter of group therapy in 2006, which lead to his work on the effectiveness of telehealth. He discussed how in 1995 he started an internet forum called GP Listserv which now consists of 400 group therapists from all over the world who join together to discuss group therapy. Haim talked about his group analytic relational approach to therapy and discusses the difference between psychodynamic and relational approaches. He talked about how the research has found clinicians experience four obstacles to online therapy, and discusses the various ways one can address them. He explained that these obstacles include (1) Setting (2) Disembodied Environment (3) Presence and (4) Ignoring the Background in Online Settings. He discusses the body of research surrounding online therapy which is very promising and explains how a meta-analysis concluded that for individual therapy, there is no difference in the results for online vs in person therapy. According to research, the best predictor of success in individual therapy is the therapeutic alliance and goes on to list the three components of the therapeutic alliance which are agreeing on goals, agreeing on tasks, and bonding. While online group therapy is less researched, Haim’s experience suggests that it is very effective. He explained how in group therapy, the factor that is most predictive of success is the cohesion of the group, rather than the therapeutic alliance. He goes on to discuss how the preference of modality –such as having an auditory or visual preference– influences one’s ability to effectively do online therapy. He talked about how in groups, time, space, and attention are always shared, which can create turmoil for group members. He also discussed how keeping attention can be difficult online because there are more distractions and people may feel more unnoticed, which can promote disengagement in an online group setting. He recommends that small group therapy should consist of group sizes between six and ten people and for people who are not as skilled or experienced, groups should not exceed eight people. In 2018, Haim created an online training process group for therapists, and these groups consist of therapists from all over the world where they discuss their experiences with group therapy and learn how to improve their practice, but also use them to work on their personal issues, thus providing professional and personal growth. Dr. Haim Weinberg is a licensed psychologist in California (PSY 23243) & Israel and has a private practice in Sacramento, California, with more than 40 years of experience. He is also a group analyst and Certified Group Psychotherapist. He is past President of the Israeli Association of Group Psychotherapy and of the Northern California Group Psychotherapy Society, and list-owner of the group psychotherapy professional online discussion forum. Haim was the Academic Vice-President of the Professional School of Psychology in which he created and coordinates an online doctoral program in group psychotherapy and marital therapy. He published books on Internet groups and about Fairy Tales and the Social Unconscious, and co-edited a book about the large group and a series of books about the social unconscious. He is on the clinical faculty of Psychiatry at UC Davis Medical Center and Fellow of the American Group Psychotherapy Association and of the International Group Psychotherapy Association, as well as a Distinguished Fellow of the Israeli Group Psychotherapy Association. He has received several awards including the Harold Bernard Group Psychotherapy Training Award and the Ann Alonso Award for Excellence in Psychodynamic Group Therapy. He also co-edited the books: 1. Theory and Practice of Online Therapy: Internet-delievered Interventions for Individuals, Groups, Families, and Organizations. 2. Advances in Online Therapy: Emergence of a New Paradigm. 3. The Virtual Group Therapy Circle: Advances in Online Group Theory and Practice with Arnon Rolnick and Adam Leighton.

In this episode, Michael discusses his work in therapy, resilience research, and helping people find diverse systems to support their well-being. Michael explains how he became interested in predictions of psychopathology and pathways to adolescent well-being through resilience and advocacy. Throughout his early career, he noticed how there had been greater efforts to suppress disorders, but these efforts did not create a sustainable, clinical outcome for people. He explores how intrapsychic systems and larger, systemic environments are important for supporting and maintaining resilience. Michael defines resilience as 1) a navigation to the resources you need and 2) a negotiation for these resources in culturally relevant ways. He states that stimulating optimism for teenagers doesn't just come from internal self-affirmation, but also from living in predictable environments. He also emphasizes the importance of caregivers and social networks in an adolescent's life. These relationships support a positive identity in adolescents, allowing them to have control and self-efficacy. We discuss how both stimulating a social network and giving young people a sense of identity are vital to promoting resilience. Michael then moves on to explain how there are differences between positive psychology and the study of resilience. The study of resilience is about matching the right protective factor to a particular risk profile. He explains that through his research, he has identified a core list of 52 potential resilience predictors. He developed a program, R2, where he takes the list of 52 predictors and identifies which factors are most relevant to the population in a specific region. Through this process, Michael and his team have been able to provide a more tailored approach to promoting resilience. For example, he mentions how in certain cities, transportation systems and housing are the key factors for promoting resilience in people. We then go on to discuss how changes in even just one of these systems can result in virtuous or negative cycles in someone’s well-being. Changes in transportation and housing may have a cascading effect on co-occurring systems of a person’s life, which may then affect their overall well-being. We emphasize how in therapy with an individual, it is important to work in the context of their external systems, such as their school or their workplace, instead of simply focusing on the individual’s depression. Though it may seem like social work, he believes it is vital to not delineate between what psychologists do and what social workers do. Michael finds that expanding various aspects of one’s identity and engaging their social networks in therapy can cultivate better mental health and resilience for a person. Finally, he touches upon the idea of wear and tear on adolescents. There is a toll that resilience and stress take on adolescents: They may seem successful in some ways, but then may crash later in life. Michael states that resilience is a constant dance between helping people navigate and negotiate for their needs, but never assuming that the journey for healing is complete. Michael Ungar, Ph.D. is the founder and Director of the Resilience Research Centre at Dalhousie University where he holds the Canada Research Chair in Child, Family and Community Resilience. In 2022, Michael was ranked the number one Social Work scholar in the world in recognition of his ground-breaking work as a family therapist and resilience researcher. That work has influenced the way human development and organizational processes are understood and studied globally, with much of Dr. Ungar’s clinical work and scholarship focused on the resilience of marginalized children and families, and adult populations experiencing mental health challenges at home and in the workplace. In addition to providing consultation to international NGOs like the Red Cross and Save the Children, government agencies in more than a dozen low, middle, and high income countries, and educational institutions at all levels of study, Dr. Ungar’s research has also influenced the HR and corporate social responsibility initiatives of Fortune 500 companies like Unilever, DHL and Cigna. Michael’s work emphasizes how to use the theory of resilience to increase both individual and institutional agility during crises, with numerous organizations having adopted his concept of resilience as a negotiated process that enhances wellbeing and social responsibility. He is the author of over 250 peer reviewed articles and book chapters and 17 books. His blog, Nurturing Resilience, can be read on Psychology Today’s website.

In this episode, Carmen discusses her work in family therapy and her Socioculturally Attuned Family Therapy. Carmen shared that she entered the field when there were feminist critiques of family therapy and a focus on power in the therapeutic relationship. She explained that she went to Loma Linda University to direct the family therapy doctoral program, and worked with Douglas Huenerardt, Ph.D. doing cotherapy. They invited students to observe, and their goal was to be able to articulate the work they were doing, and later finalized it into a research study. She explained that the model that evolved out of that work was named Socioemotional Relationship Therapy. Later, she moved to Oregon to teach at Lewis and Clark College, and worked with Teresa McDowell, EdD, LMFT, and wrote the textbook, Socioculturally Attuned Family Therapy, with Teresa and Maria Bermudez, Ph.D., LMFT. We discussed how Carmen’s background in sociology led her to always be thinking about sociocultural aspects and how they play out in relationships. She explained that Teresa introduced the idea of Third Order Thinking or Third Order Change to her, which goes beyond the Systemic concept of Second Order change, to bring awareness to the therapist and client of how the sociocultural system the relationships are embedded in and influence their experiences. She also discussed how this helps therapists be aware of how they are accountable for possibly unknowingly reinforcing and repeating larger societal patterns. Carmen discussed the Socio-Emotional Relationship Therapy Model and how it is influenced by experiential, structural therapy, and social constructionist theory and technique, while centering sociocultural awareness. She discussed how emotions are the window into the larger context by helping us see the thinking that is happening and how that thinking may be a product of social-cultural influences. She also discusses the role of power in the model, and being aware of how that determines what is important, what is valued and the meaning of things, and seeing how power plays out in the couple or family dynamics. She explained that they operationalize relational equity as the Circle of Care, which consists of four parts: 1) Mutual Vulnerability - openness and willingness to admit mistakes, safe to express one’s sensitivities, 2) Mutual Attunement - that each person is aware of the other person and their needs, as often the person with more power is less attuned, 3) Mutual Influence - whose interests are organizing the relationship and whether there is a willingness to be influenced, and 4) Shared Relational Responsibility - where both are taking responsibility for the wellbeing of the relationship. Carmen discusses how when these are balanced, there is a more equitable relationship, and by the therapist’s awareness of power, they can support the changes in the relationship to be more equitable and mutually supportive. Carmen Knudson-Martin, Ph.D., LMFT is a professor emerita in the Marriage, Couple, and Family Therapy program at Lewis and Clark College. Her scholarship focuses on how the larger social context influences health and well-being and how therapists can address the inequities that result. Carmen especially loves working with couples and is widely recognized for her work regarding gender, marital equality, and relational health. She is a founder of Socio-Emotional Relationship Therapy, an approach that attends to the ways couple interaction, emotion, and socio-cultural context come together in clinical process. Carmen’s teaching and practice are based on her conviction that how therapists conceptualize client concerns is an ethical issue and that clinical practices have consequences that are never neutral. Carmen is an AAMFT approved supervisor and licensed MFT. She served as an associate editor of the Journal of Marital and Family Therapy, vice-president of the Family Process Institute, board member of the American Family Therapy Academy (AFTA), and president of the California Division of the American Association for Marital and Family Therapy (AAMFT-CA). She is currently editor of the AFTA Springer Series in Family Therapy. Prior to coming to Lewis and Clark, she directed family therapy programs at Loma Linda University in Southern California, Montana State University, and Valdosta State University in Georgia.