Matt chats with journalist Sarah Eekhoff Zylstra about the state of the news media today and how Christians can be informed, discerning, and full of hope in an anxious age. In Gospelbound, her book with co-author Collin Hansen, Sarah reveals what authentic gospel living looks like in a culture of anxiety and fear through powerful, hope-stirring stories of believers transforming the world for Jesus. Plus, for all my Dutch listeners this episode of Deep Thoughts is 50% more Dutch than usual. You're welcome. ABOUT Sarah Eekhoff Zylstra is a senior writer for The Gospel Coalition where she oversees coverage of faith and work. She earned a BA in English and Communication from Dordt University and an Master of Science in Journalism from Medill School of Journalism at Northwestern University. Before working at TGC, she reported news for Christianity Today for more than a decade. Unfortunately, she doesn’t appear to be directly related to any Zylstras living in the Fraser Valley but we like her anyway.

A Deep Thought is a concise episode on a particular aspect of the Christian faith that we sprinkle in between full-length episodes. This deep thought is on faith and work.

Rachel Gilson is a writer, speaker, and campus minister. Her book, Born Again This Way, is described as offering no glib before-and-after narrative, but is a practical guide for sinners—same-sex attracted and otherwise—who dare to believe that Jesus is the best lover. Rachel’s book (and this interview) get into her story of coming out, coming to faith, and what comes next. ABOUT Rachel Gilson currently live in the Boston metro area and works for Cru on the leadership team for theological development and culture. She holds a Master of Divinity from Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary and is the author of Born Again This Way: Coming Out, Coming to Faith, and What Comes Next. Her writing has featured in Christianity Today, The Gospel Coalition, and Desiring God, among other places. Rachel loves Greek, Hebrew, theology, literature, and the transforming work of the Spirit in her messy life. She started following Jesus during her freshman year at Yale College after splitting up with her high school girlfriend. She has been married to Andrew for twelve years and they have a daughter.

In this episode Matt chats with Tim Muehlhoff & Richard Langer about their latest book together, Winsome Conviction, which is all about developing the art of loving people in the church with whom we disagree. They also wrote a book called Winsome Persuasion about how Christians should engage the broader culture in a way that is persuasive, civil, and challenges the cultural assumptions of our day but with love and respect. Where my conversation with Gavin Ortlund (episode 42) is about ranking doctrines in order to recognize what should and shouldn’t divide us, my conversation with Tim & Rick is about how we should respond when our convictions on just about anything differ with fellow believers. We desperately need both frameworks in the church today. ABOUT Tim Muehlhoff (PhD, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill) is a professor of communication at Biola University and is the author of I Beg to Differ and coauthor of Authentic Communication: Christian Speech Engaging Culture. Richard Langer (PhD, University of California, Riverside) is professor of biblical and theological studies at Talbot School of Theology and director of the Office for the Integration of Faith and Learning at Biola University. Together they run The Winsome Conviction Project launched from a heartfelt concern for the toxic, polarized and simply unloving communication climate that is permeating our nation and penetrating the body of Christ. They believe that followers of Christ are obliged to communicate with others in loving ways that preserve human dignity, even as we engage in honest and passionate disagreement. They hope to foster conversations within the church and the broader culture that deepen relationships and enrich lives rather than tear us apart.

Is there a way to walk faithfully through doubt and come out the other side with a deeper love for Jesus, the church, and its tradition? Can we question our faith without losing it? Matt chats with AJ about his new book, After Doubt: How To Question Your Faith Without Losing It. ABOUT A. J. Swoboda (PhD, University of Birmingham) is assistant professor of Bible, theology, and world Christianity at Bushnell University in Eugene, Oregon, and leads a Doctor of Ministry cohort on the Holy Spirit and leadership at Fuller Theological Seminary. He is the author or editor of numerous books, including Subversive Sabbath, winner of a Christianity Today Book Award (Spiritual Formation) and an Award of Merit for CT's Beautiful Orthodoxy Book of the Year. Swoboda served for ten years as the lead pastor at Theophilus Church in urban Portland. It’s in the contexts of being a college pastor, a church planter in Portland, and a professor that he has had a front row seat to watch doubt and deconstruction play themselves out over and over again, giving him the opportunity to learn a lot about it. He considers After Doubt a manifesto of 22 years of his life. His career really took off when he grew a beard and got the right glasses.

This special bonus episode of the podcast is a talk Matt was asked to give for a Youth YouTube night on the topic of Racism & The Great Commission. While the talk is specifically geared toward Grades 6-12’s, we think it is worthwhile hearing Matt address racism from a theological perspective — how Christians should view human beings, nations, and ethnicities in light of what the Bible has to say about it.

Matt chats with Gavin Ortlund about his book, Finding The Right Hills to Die On. “In theology, just as in battle, some hills are worth dying on and others are not. But how do we know which ones? When should doctrine divide, and when should unity prevail?” Matt also asks Gavin if there’s any friendly competition in the family of authors. Plus, he tries to get to the bottom of what was in the water at the Ortlund household to raise not just a family full of wonderful theologians, but great, godly people. So they talk about parenting to start things off in the interview, before settling into figuring out which hills to die on. ABOUT: Gavin Ortlund Gavin Ortlund is Senior Pastor of First Baptist Church of Ojai in Ojai, California and the author of books including Theological Retrieval For Evangelicals  Why We Need Our Past to Have a Future; Finding The Right Hills To Die On: The Case for Theological Triage — the primary subject of our episode; and his latest book: Why God Makes Sense In A World That Doesn’t: The Beauty of Christian Theism. He blogs at Soliloquium.

A Deep Thought is a concise episode on a particular aspect of the Christian faith that we sprinkle in between full-length episodes. This deep thought is on how to study the Bible.

Matt and Matt talk about heart postures for Bible-reading before delving into a discussion about Deacons. They also talk about Mark Dever’s internship program and his office (which are both the stuff of legends) and a bonus conversation at the end on what it’s been like being a part of The Gospel Coalition in such polarizing times. *Warning: Deep thoughts not guaranteed. ABOUT: Matt Smethurst Matt is the author of books including Before You Open Your Bible and Deacons (which is in the fantastic 9Marks Building Healthy Churches series), is the managing editor of The Gospel Coalition, and served as an elder at Third Avenue Baptist Church in Louisville, Kentucky. But he just recently announced a big life change: He will be planting a church in Richmond, Virginia in the coming months.

Matt chats with Martin Smith about his songwriting career, worship leading, the early days of Delirious?, and what he thinks is lost when the church doesn’t gather for corporate worship for a year, before finishing things off with some fun rapid-fire questions. *Warning: Deep thoughts not guaranteed. *Special thanks to Integrity Music and Capitol CMG Publishing for permission to use the songs in the episode. ABOUT: Martin Smith Martin Smith was the frontman of a band called Delirious? from 1997 until their final show together in 2009. A number of their songs reached the Top 20 on the UK Singles Chart. Many of their songs are quintessential worship songs in the church. Check out their music on Apple Music or Spotify and check out Martin’s solo music on Apple Music or Spotify. During the pandemic, Martin found himself remotely leading worship for some churches and that turned into GloWorksTV where he and some of his worship leader friends lead worship from home that churches can use for their online services all over the world.