

In the National Interest
Center for the National Interest
"In the National Interest" is a podcast that explores the intersection of foreign and defense policy, national security, and U.S. politics. It is not about world affairs, but about American interests and the realist approach needed to promote them. What actually constitutes true realism is, of course, a source of controversy. And so, the series promotes fresh debate by featuring a variety of leading experts from government, industry, journalism, and academia, many of whom may at times disagree with each other. Each episode is hosted by Jacob Heilbrunn, editor of The National Interest magazine, and published by the Center for the National Interest.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Mar 6, 2024 • 6min
Nikki Haley’s Not-So-Super Tuesday (w/ Harry Kazianis)
With Nikki Haley now out of the race for the GOP nomination, will Donald Trump try to bring her back into the fold as his vice presidential pick, or has Haley already sabotaged her chances? In this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Harry J. Kazianis, executive editor of The National Interest. Kazianis previously served as part of the foreign policy team for Senator Ted Cruz's 2016 presidential campaign and worked for the conservative Heritage Foundation.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Mar 4, 2024 • 25min
Russian Energy After Two Years of War in Ukraine (w/ Tatiana Mitrova)
Two years after Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, Russia is still exporting oil and gas—but earning less revenue. What are the consequences? In this special episode, Paul Saunders interviews Tatiana Mitrova, a Research Fellow at Columbia University’s Center on Global Energy Policy and Director of the New Energy Advancement Hub. Mitrova is a leading expert on Russia’s energy system.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Feb 29, 2024 • 12min
The Road Ahead for Donald Trump (w/ Curt Mills)
With Donald Trump's path to the Republican nomination in July wide open, what obstacles still stand between him and the White House, and what would his election in November herald both for the GOP and for American democracy? In this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Curt Mills, executive director of The American Conservative. Mills previously worked at The National Interest, U.S. News & World Report, Washington Examiner, and the Spectator. He was a 2018-2019 Robert Novak Journalism fellow.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Feb 28, 2024 • 8min
Mitch McConnell: Last of the Republican Old Guard? (w/ Harry Kazianis)
As Republican Senator Mitch McConnell steps down from his leadership post, who in the party will step forward to fill the void left by his historic tenure? In this special episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Harry J. Kazianis, executive editor of The National Interest. Kazianis previously served as part of the foreign policy team for Senator Ted Cruz's 2016 presidential campaign and worked for the conservative Heritage Foundation.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Feb 26, 2024 • 12min
Has MAGA Seized the Republican Party? (w/ Harry Kazianis)
As Donald Trump barrels toward the Republican nomination for president, what does his continued hold on the GOP mean for its prospects in the 2024 election and the future of the party? In this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Harry J. Kazianis, executive editor of The National Interest. Kazianis previously served as part of the foreign policy team for the 2016 presidential campaign of Senator Ted Cruz as well as the Heritage Foundation.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Feb 20, 2024 • 26min
Global Energy and Climate Challenges (w/ Nobuo Tanaka)
Russia’s 2022 invasion of Ukraine has stressed the global energy system. Who are the energy winners and losers? How will the war and U.S.-China competition affect efforts to transition away from fossil fuels? And what are the prospects for nuclear power, after the United States and two dozen other nations agreed to triple capacity by 2050 at the 2023 UN climate summit in the United Arab Emirates? All are critical questions for global energy.In this episode, Center for the National Interest President Paul Saunders talks with Nobuo Tanaka, Chair of the Steering Committee at Innovation for Cool Earth Forum who served previously as Executive Director of the International Energy Agency and as Chairman of Japan’s Sasakawa Peace Foundation.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Feb 5, 2024 • 17min
Overcoming America’s Nuclear Energy Challenges (w/ John Deutch)
Despite initial optimism about nuclear energy in the fight against climate change, recent setbacks have dampened expectations for rapid nuclear energy growth in the United States. America today faces significant hurdles in extending the operational lifespan of its existing nuclear reactors, reducing construction costs, and fostering investment in new nuclear technologies. On this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with John Deutch, an emeritus Institute Professor at MIT who served as director of energy research, deputy secretary of energy, deputy secretary of defense and director of central intelligence in the Clinton administration. Deutch recently wrote a piece for The National Interest titled "COP28’s Nuclear Energy Promise Is Still a Long Way Off."Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Dec 4, 2023 • 1h 1min
Why Whittaker Chambers and Richard Nixon Matter for Today’s GOP (w/ Sam Tanenhaus)
On the 75th anniversary of their discovery, what is the history of Whittaker Chambers’ infamous Pumpkin Papers, their implications for Richard Nixon’s career, and their significance for conservatism, patriotism, and loyalty in America today? On this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Sam Tanenhaus, a contributing writer at the Washington Post’s Book World. He is a former editor of The New York Times Book Review and the author of “Whittaker Chambers: A Biography” (Random House, 1997). His work has appeared in the New York Review of Books, The New Yorker, Vanity Fair, The Atlantic, and the National Interest. His forthcoming book, “William F. Buckley, Jr.: His Life and Times,” will be published in Fall 2024.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Dec 1, 2023 • 31min
Henry Kissinger and His World (w/ Barry Gewen)
Henry Kissinger became the bête noire of the American right and left during and after the Vietnam War era for pursuing what critics decried as amoral realpolitik. On the event of his passing at age 100, what is Kissinger’s legacy for U.S. foreign policy? On this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Barry Gewen, a former editor at the New York Times Book Review and the author of “The Inevitability of Tragedy: Henry Kissinger and His World” (W. W. Norton, 2020). Gewen has written on politics, international affairs, and culture for several publications, including The New York Times, The New Republic, Dissent, and The National Interest.Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

Nov 21, 2023 • 22min
Why America Needs a National Security Software Revolution (w/ David Pearah)
What kind of software revolution does Washington need to promote, and how well is the Pentagon adapting to this new challenge? What are the implications of the conflicts in Ukraine and Israel for software and national security? On this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with David Pearah, an MIT-trained computer engineer and CEO of SpiderOak, a space cybersecurity company. David recently wrote a piece for The National Interest titled "Defense Gaps with China Can Be Closed with Commercial Software."Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay