
The Two Testaments
A guided journey through Scripture with Rony Kozman and Will Kynes.
We interview scholars to discuss the meanings of verses, passages, and books of the Bible. Think of us as an audio Bible commentary—but more exciting! thetwotestaments.substack.com
Latest episodes

Mar 2, 2023 • 1h 8min
Matthew 20:29–23:39
Matthew 20:29–23:39 with Dr. Amy-Jill LevineDr. Amy-Jill Levine (Hartford International University for Religion and Peace) talks to us about Matthew 20:29–39. We discuss:* Jesus' entry into Jerusalem* the trilogy of parables* the Pharisees* suggestions for teaching Matthew 23 with sensitivityBooks by Dr. Amy-Jill LevineThis post contains affiliate links* The Pharisees, ed. with Joseph Sievers. Eerdmans, 2021. * The Sermon on the Mount: A Beginner’s Guide to the Kingdom of Heaven. Abingdon, 2020.* The Bible With and Without Jesus: How Jews and Christians Read the Same Stories Differently, with Marc Zvi Brettler. HarperCollins, 2020. * Short Stories by Jesus: The Enigmatic Parables of a Controversial Rabbi. Abingdon, 2018.* Jewish Annotated New Testament, ed. with Marc Zvi Brettler. 2nd ed. Oxford University Press, 2017. * The Misunderstood Jew: The Church and the Scandal of the Jewish Jesus. HarperCollins, 2006. * A Feminist Companion to Matthew, ed. with Marianne Blickenstaff. Sheffield Academic, 2001.This Week’s BlurbIn this episode, Amy-Jill Levine Recommends:* spending time with family, knitting, and ballroom dancing.Next Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Melissa Ramos (Portland Seminary) about Deuteronomy 27–30 (Covenant Renewal).Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Feb 22, 2023 • 56min
Deuteronomy 16:18–18:22 (Leadership)
Dr. Jeff Leonard (Samford University) talks to us about Deuteronomy 16:18–18:22. We discuss:* The roles of judges and their enforcement of covenant justice* The law for kings and its connection to Israel's later history* The priests, their relationship to judges* The description of prophecy, the tests for true prophets, and the end of prophecyRelevant Work by Jeff LeonardThis post contains affiliate links* Seekers in the Hands of an Elusive God. Hendrickson, forthcoming.Other Works Mentioned in this Episode* Jeff Leonard, Creation Rediscovered: Finding New Meaning in an Ancient Story. Hendrickson, 2020.* Jeffery Stackert, A Prophet Like Moses: Prophecy, Law, and Israelite Religion. Oxford University Press, 2014.* Nili Wazana, “The Law of the King (Deut 17:14-20) in the Light of Empire and Destruction", pages 169-194 in P. Dubovský, D. Markl, J.-P. Sonnet (eds.), The Fall of Jerusalem and the Rise of the Torah. Mohr Siebeck 2016.This Week’s BlurbIn this episode, Jeff Leonard recommends:* East of Eden by John SteinbeckNext Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Amy-Jill Levine (Vanderbilt University; Hartford International University for Religion and Peace) about Matthew 20:29–23:39 (Jesus' entry into Jerusalem; Parables; the Pharisees).Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Feb 16, 2023 • 1h 14min
Matthew 18:1–20:28
Dr. Nathan Eubank (University of Notre Dame) talks to us about Matthew 18:1–20:28. (We apologize for the technical issues we encountered in this episode which affected the sound.) In this episode, we discuss:* what children teach us about the kingdom of heaven* guardian angels* the parable of the lost sheep* marriage and divorce* the rich young man* the significance of the economic and ransom languageRelevant Work by Nathan Eubank* Wages of Cross-Bearing and Debt of Sin: The Economy of Heaven in Matthew’s Gospel. De Grtuyter, 2013.* “Prison, Penance, or Purgatory: The Interpretation of Matthew 5.25-26 and Parallels,” New Testament Studies 64 (2018): 162-77.This Week’s BlurbIn this episode, Nathan Eubank Recommends:* The New Year's Day 10 mile hangover run which is best done without a hangover.Next Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Jeff Leonard (Samford University) about Deuteronomy 16:18–18:22 (Leadership)Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Feb 9, 2023 • 60min
Deuteronomy 14:1–16:17 (Food and Festivals)
Dr. Michael Rhodes (Carey Baptist College) talks to us about Deuteronomy 14:1–16:17. We discuss:* The logic of the food laws* The tithe laws and justice* The practicality and meaning of the remission of debts every seven years* The significance of the three yearly festivalsRelevant Work by Michael RhodesThis post contains affiliate links* Formative Feasting: Practices and Virtue Ethics in Deuteronomy's Tithe Meal and the Corinthian Lord's Supper. Peter Lang, 2022.Other Works Mentioned in this Episode* “Why Don’t We Sing Justice Songs in Worship?” Christianity Today. 30 Sep 2021.* Mark Glanville, Adopting the Stranger as Kindred in Deuteronomy. SBL Press, 2018.This Week’s BlurbIn this episode, Michael Rhodes Recommends:* Reading the works of Susanna Clarke* Reading Scripture with people of different cultural, ethnic, and geographical backgroundsNext Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Nathan Eubank (University of Notre Dame) about Matthew 18:1–20:28.Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Feb 2, 2023 • 1h 2min
Matthew 14:13–17:27
Dr. Patrick Schreiner (Midwestern Seminary) talks to us about Matthew 14:13–17:27. We discuss:* Jesus feeding the crowds* Jesus walks on water* The Canaanite woman's faith* Peter's confession* Jesus' transfigurationRelevant Works by Patrick Schreiner* Matthew, Disciple, and Scribe: The First Gospel and its Portrait of Jesus. Baker Academic, 2019.* The Body of Jesus: A Spatial Analysis of the Kingdom in Matthew. T&T Clark, 2016.* The Visual Word: An Illustrated Guide to the New Testament Books. Moody, 2021.This Week’s BlurbIn this episode, Patrick Schreiner Recommends:* Reading or listening to The Wingfeather Saga by Andrew PetersonNext Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Michael Rhodes (Carey Baptist College) about Deuteronomy 14:1–16:17 (Food and Festivals)Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Jan 25, 2023 • 1h 5min
Deuteronomy 11, 22, 24, 26 (Land, Economy, Sexual Violence)
Join us as Dr. Sandra Richter (Westmont College) talks to us about Deuteronomy 11, 22, 24, 26. We discuss:* The prominence of land in Deuteronomy* Environmental laws* Laws on adultery and rape* The economy of DeuteronomyWorks by Sandra RichterThis post contains affiliate links* Stewards of Eden: What Scripture Says about the Environment and Why it Matters, IVP Academic, 2020.* The Epic of Eden: A Christian Entry into the Old Testament, IVP Academic, 2008.* "Rape in Israel’s World … and Ours: A Study Of Deuteronomy 22:23–29." Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society 64 (2021): 59–76.* "Environmental Law: Wisdom from the Ancients." Bulletin of Biblical Research 24 (2014): 307–29* "Environmental Law in Deuteronomy: One Lens on a Biblical Theology of Creation Care." Bulletin of Biblical Research 20 (2010): 355–76.This Week’s BlurbIn this episode, Sandra Richter Recommends:* Watching anything by Sir David AttenboroughNext Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Patrick Schreiner (Midwestern Seminary) about Matthew 14:13–17:27. Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Jan 18, 2023 • 1h 1min
Matthew 12:1–14:12
Episode on Matthew 12:1–14:12 with Dr. Jordan Ryan is Live Join us as Dr. Jordan Ryan (Wheaton College) talks to us about Matthew 12:1–14:12. We discuss a number of things including: Jesus's disputes with the Pharisees over the Sabbath; synagogues in the first century; evil spirits and healing; parables of the kingdom; and John the Baptist.Relevant Works by Dr. Jordan RyanThis post contains affiliate links* The Role of the Synagogue in the Aims of Jesus. Fortress, 2017.* “The Sermon on the Mount as Synagogue Teaching,” in Matthew within Judaism. Ed. Anders Runesson and Daniel Gurtner. Society of Biblical Literature, 2020.This Week’s BlurbsIn this episode, Jordan Ryan recommends reading:* Reynaldo Ileto. Pasyon and Revolution: Popular Movements in the Philippines, 1840-1910. Ateneo de Manila University Press, 1979.Next Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Sandra Richter (Westmont College) about Deuteronomy 11, 22, 24, 26 (Land, Economy, and Sexual Violence).Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Jan 11, 2023 • 1h 8min
Deuteronomy 7, 19, 21-22 (Violence)
Episode on Deuteronomy 7, 19, 21–22 (Violence) with Dr. Matthew Lynch is Live Join us as Dr. Matthew Lynch (Regent College) talks to us about Deuteronomy 7, 9, 21–22 (violence). We discuss a number of things including: what is understood as "violence," the command to destroy the Canaanites, its potential reinterpretation in the Bible, cities of refuge, false witnesses, rules for war, unsolved mysteries in Israel, and how we understand these passages today, including how to respond to those who would apply them to the Ukraine War.Relevant Books by Matthew LynchThis post contains affiliate links* Portraying Violence in the Hebrew Bible: A Literary and Cultural Study. Cambridge University Press, 2020.* Flood and Fury: Engaging Old Testament Violence. IVP Academic, 2023.This Week’s BlurbsIn this episode, Matthew Lynch recommends the following TV series:* The Green Planet, BBC Earth.Next Week Next week, Dr. Jordan Ryan (Wheaton College) discusses Matthew 12:1–14:12 with us.Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Jan 4, 2023 • 58min
Matthew 8–11
Episode on Matthew 8–11 with Dr. Jeannine Brown is LiveJoin us as Dr. Jeannine Brown (Bethel Seminary) talks to us about Matthew 8–11. We discuss a number of things including: narrative and thematic threads throughout these chapters; how Jesus fulfills Isaiah's Servant Songs; the relationship between healing and exorcism in Matthew; Jesus sending out the twelve; the meaning of the coming of "the Son of Man"; John the Baptist's curious response of ignorance towards Jesus; how divine revelation is contingent on one's response to Jesus and how judgment fits this motif; Jesus as wisdom.Books by Jeannine Brown* The Gospels as Stories. Baker, 2020.* The Gospel of Matthew (Two Horizons NT Commentary), with Kyle Roberts. Eerdmans, 2018.* Dictionary of Jesus and the Gospels, 2nd edition, ed. with Joel Green and Nicholas Perrin. IVP Academic, 2014.This Week’s BlurbsIn this episode, Jeannine Brown recommends:* Luke Timothy Johnson, Living Jesus: Learning the Heart of the Gospel. HarperOne, 2000.Next Week Next week, we talk to Dr. Matthew Lynch (Regent College) about violence in Deuteronomy 7, 19, 21–22.Click here to meet our guides through Deuteronomy and Matthew. Subscribe and don't miss an episodeThe Two Testaments takes you on a guided journey through Scripture with leading experts on the Bible, hosted by Rony Kozman and Will KynesVisit our website at thetwotestaments.com, where you can subscribe, access all episodes, and meet our guides through Scripture. Sign up now so you don’t miss an episode.Find us on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Vurbl, iHeart Radio, Amazon Music, and Pocket Casts.You can also watch us on Youtube. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit thetwotestaments.substack.com

Dec 14, 2022 • 47min
Wrestling with Job
Drs. Bill and Will Kynes discuss the challenging book of Job, focusing on Job's defiant faith, the importance of wrestling with God, the failure of Job's friends to comfort him, God's success in comforting Job, and the connections between Job and Jesus.
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