I’m excited to have Bobby Matson, founder and CEO of Payitoff.io, back on the podcast. The last time he was on the show was in April of 2020, less than a month into the global COVID panic. Since then, 45 million plus Americans with student debt have kicked the can down the road. Until now. Bobby is a self-taught coder. He and his wife had student loan debt to deal with, so they built a product called Payitoff.io to help sort it out. Their API allows financial apps to empower borrowers with ways to assess and address their student debt while freeing up cash to invest or spend. And while there’s been a “pause” in repayment, student debt did not go away. The problem was just brushed aside for a couple of years. During those few years, Bobby and his team went and built other debt API products. But as repayments are starting up again, the “phones have been ringing off the hook” as everybody tries to catch up. Bobby and his team stayed in the game, didn’t overspend their VC money, and kept things under control. Full disclosure – Social Leverage is an investor in Payitoff.io Guest - Bobby Matson, Founder and CEO of payitoff.io howardlindzon.com, payitoff.io Twitter: @howardlindzon, @bomatson, @payitoffapp, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/bobbymatson #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:44) Welcome Bobby (08:08)  What is Payitoff? (08:36) COVID hits (10:35) Demonstrating category leadership (13:34) A good type of panic (15:36) Product & Execution (16:34) Domain experience & problem solving (17:36) Debt relief options (19:26) Use case solutions (20:09) Expanding beyond student loans (24:44) Self-taught coder (25:48) Learning to build companies (27:09) Trapped with debt (29:48) Navigating student loan relief (31:33) Avoiding channel conflict (37:31) Building the Enterprise (40:56) Tailwinds come full circle (43:17) Rising interest rates & consolidation (43:31) Wrapping up (43:49) Closing thoughts (44:33) 

I’m excited to have my new friend Dave Finocchio on the podcast. I met Dave on my golf trip to Ireland, and we hit it off on the long bus ride. He stands out because he’s focused and insanely smart. He’s the founder of the Bleacher Report, which was acquired for north of $200M, and is now working on The Cool Down – his attempt to build the world’s first mainstream climate brand. Dave’s taken everything he’s learned in sports and media over the years and is applying it to climate change. We have a wide-ranging conversation on what it was like to start a media company back in the day, and what it takes now. We discuss new trends that are emerging in media, like TikTok, his investment in 5-Iron Golf, and a whole lot more. Enjoy! Guest - Dave Finocchio, Co-Founder & CEO at The Cool Down, Founder of Bleacher Report howardlindzon.com, thecooldown.com Twitter: @howardlindzon, @PanicwFriends, @DaveFinocchio, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/dave-finocchio-90b2a93 #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:40) Welcome Dave (05:44) Golf courses in Ireland (08:42) The Cool Down (09:58) Content needs to resonate (12:33) Bringing in co-founders (13:27) Dealing with founder burnout (17:25) Flash back to the Bleacher report (21:38) Seed rounds back in the day (29:54) The end of an era (33:56) NFL Draft expert Matt Miller (35:45) Dave’s thoughts on parenting (37:29) Would he do sports media again? (39:05) Sports betting (41:02) Thoughts on TikTok (42:15) Growth - The Cool Down (46:20) Investments: Behave Candy (47:46) Investments: 5-Iron Golf (47:57) Bullish on golf (52:17) Closing thoughts (53:02) 

My good friend Jim O’Shaughnessy is back for a third appearance on Panic with Friends. He was my very first guest on the show way back in March of 2020, right at the start of the Global Pandemic. He wasn’t panicking then, and he’s not panicking now. I wanted to check in with Jim to see how his spider tingly sense feels around the markets right now. He’s more of a systems guy and doesn’t time the market, but I wanted to get his calm assessment of what the world looks like. One thing the 'yutes' need to keep in mind during this market turmoil is that they’re “time billionaires”. And you should use that to your advantage. You definitely want to exchange that time for risk. I hope you enjoy our wide-ranging conversation on life, family, investing, and the markets. Guest - Jim O’Shaughnessy, Founder, Chairman & Co-Chief Investment Officer, OSAM LLC howardlindzon.com, osam.com, infiniteloopspodcast.com Twitter: @howardlindzon , @jposhaughnessy, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/james-o-shaughnessy-b072bb#fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:42) Welcome Jim (08:19) Lake Como, Italy (09:24) A different type of Panic from 2020 (17:26) Strategic and Tactical insights (18:12) Historical perspectives (19:40) A generation raised on zero cost of capital (23:18) Recency bias / Arbitrage human nature (24:35) The Fed (37:10) Everything is psychology at the end of the day (41:40) We socialized losses (43:50) Musk's Twitter deal (52:40) Wrapping up (57:59) Closing thoughts (104:20) 

During my five weeks on the road, I’ve been doing reruns of some of my favorite Panic with Friends episodes. This one is the second of back-to-back episodes with my pal Jason Hirschorn from April of 2021. I have not met another person who is not just so passionate about all forms of media and the creator economy, but is eager and willing to share that knowledge with others. Best of Panic: In part one, we covered Jason’s long history at MTV, Slingbox, News Corp and MySpace. So listen here if you want the full backstory on this media extraordinaire. In this episode, Jason covers the future of new media and streaming and the explosion of the creator economy. Looking back, I believe that YouTube created the first explosion in the creator economy and today it is a bunch of new media platforms combined with decentralization and tokens that will create an even bigger explosion which Jason predicts will be a ‘more equitable’ version of the creator economy. Guest - Jason Hirschhorn, CEO and Chief Curator at REDEF howardlindzon.com, redef.com Twitter: @howardlindzon, @JasonHirschhorn, @MediaREDEF, @MusicREDEF, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/jason-hirschhorn-820a9b43 #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:41) Welcome Jason (02:19) Artists and NFTs (04:12) Gatekeepers with too much power (07:04) Building a trusted audience (09:38) Creator economy platforms (11:54) Sloth of Big Media (16:51) Technical debt/Brand debt (19:22) Bundling media (25:23) Streaming/Spotify (28:24) Advertising/Programming (31:34) Dealing with piracy (32:31) Movie Theaters (33:25) Cinema Paradisio (36:21) Wrapping up (43:47) Closing thoughts (47:18) 

As long time listeners know, I’ve taken a few weeks off from the podcast to go climb mountains on my bike. The bike phase is over, and it ended with a crescendo when I spent my 57th birthday climbing Stelvio. So far I’ve gone from San Diego to Toronto, to New York, to Italy, to Germany and I’m now in Tel Aviv – nearing the end of the third week of five weeks on the road. To fill the gap, I’m doing reruns of some of my favorite Panic with Friends episodes. This one with my pal Jason Hirschorn is from March of 2021. Best of Panic: I was excited about having Jason Hirschhorn on the ‘Panic’ podcast and he did not disappoint. This interview turned into a two part series so lean back for this first part which covers Jason’s long history at MTV, Slingbox, News Corp and MySpace. Jason has some great stories that were fun for me to listen to because I have met a lot of the same people in my short media stint at CBS. I have not met another person who is so passionate about movies, music and streaming.=In the second interview (rerunning next week), Jason covers the future of new media and streaming and the explosion of the creator economy.Looking back, I believe that YouTube created the first explosion in the creator economy and today it is a bunch of new media platforms combined with decentralization and tokens that will create an even bigger explosion which Jason predicts will be a ‘more equitable’ version of the creator economy. Guest - Jason Hirschhorn, CEO and Chief Curator at REDEF howardlindzon.com, redef.com Twitter: @howardlindzon, @JasonHirschhorn, @MediaREDEF, @MusicREDEF, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/jason-hirschhorn-820a9b43 #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:41) Welcome Jason (02:48) LA quarantine scene (03:28) MTV and MySpace (04:24) Blake at Slingbox (05:11) Tony Bennett doing Rock Band? (07:02) Running into Fred Wilson (11:20) Jason’s first company (16:43) Working with Barry Diller (20:02) MySpace decision (24:08) “Innovation through litigation!” (30:25) Getting engaged (31:27) Exporting American culture (38:40) Traveling to Israel (40:45) Comparing NY to LA (42:24) Meeting Steve Jobs (46:31) Jet-setting with Bono (47:53) Closing thoughts (56:05) 

Long time listeners know I’ve taken a few weeks off to go climb some mountains on my bike. I’ve just departed Lake Como, wrapping up this leg of my crazy cycling ‘adventurecation’. You can follow my rides on the Strava app. In the meantime, I’ve been doing reruns of some of my favorite Panic with Friends episodes. This episode from January of 2021 is with my good friend Ted Merz. He’s moved on from Bloomberg, but his insights on social media and data are spot on.Best of Panic: (January, 2021) My friend Ted Merz at Bloomberg has one of the most interesting jobs in the world. Ted has been at Bloomberg since 1991 and today heads Bloomberg’s Global News Product. That is a complicated job and this is a complicated era of news considering the 24/7/365 flow of information, misinformation and of course news. Ted makes it all look easy. I miss visiting with him at the Bloomberg HQ.I love talking to Ted about Twitter and the rest of social media and the deals he has had to cut and the way he thinks about data.One of the best compliments I have gotten is having Ted tell me he enjoys my writing style and reading my daily blog. That is not why I invited him on as a guest, but it is definitely one reason I am so happy I started to write in the first place and a motivating factor for me to keep writing! Guest - Ted Merz, Journalist turned Product Manager, Former Global Head of News product at Bloomberg howardlindzon.com, ted-merz.com Twitter: @howardlindzon, @TedMerz, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/ted-merz-cfa-b711257 #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:31) Welcome Ted (03:18) Starting in journalism (04:07) Moving to Bloomberg (06:21) The biggest story of Ted’s lifetime (09:33) Covering 9/11 (11:33) Bloomberg customer service (15:47) Talking Twitter (16:23) Partnering with Twitter (24:02) Monetizing data (27:21) Enormous opportunity with Twitter and Reddit (34:28) First inkling of COVID breaks December 31. 2019 (36:40) Data as alpha (39:35) A ‘Netflix’ Model of news and information (42:02) Wrapping up (47:20) Closing thoughts (52:05)

I’m still off from the podcast circuit climbing mountains on my bike, but will be back in the studio soon. The reruns of some of my favorite podcasts continue for now. This one from December of ‘21 with Frank Rotman of QED Investors is one you’ll want to listen to a few times for sure. It’s great historical perspective for where we’re at now, and evergreen enough to inform any evolving investment strategy. Best of Panic: My guest today is a fintech operator turned investor. Frank is the real deal. He spent almost 13 years at Capital One, is the co-founder of QED Investors, and made the Midas List of Top 100 Investors FOUR times. Everybody is a fanboy of somebody, and I’m a fanboy of Frank for sure – he has the amazing ability to spot leaders in the fintech space and has done it for a long period of time. In our business you get rewarded with a lot of money to manage and QED has just raised a fresh billion dollars. I learned a lot from this conversation and think every investor can do the same. Guest - Frank Rotman, Co-Founder, Partner and Head of Domestic Investments at QED Investors howardlindzon.com, qedinvestors.com Twitter: @howardlindzon, @fintechjunkie, @QEDInvestors, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/frank-rotman #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:56) Welcome Frank (4:14) Founding QED (04:49) Fintech before Fintech (05:48) Wrapping up (57:45) Operators as investors (06:34) Pitching Nigel (06:51) Pitching Dan Loeb (07:30) M&A with Capital One (09:01) Grow it or sell it? (10:12) An information-based strategy (10:20) Flash forward to 2021 (12:04) Separating bubbles from megatrends (12:46) Too soon Unicorns (14:59) Art of business building thrown out the window (15:25) Web3 is just getting started (17:05) Loose money fueling the system (18:08) Web3 attracting talent (20:49) Investing decisions and allocation (21:15) Doing diligence in today’s market (22:06) Talented venture teams (25:50) QED check size range (27:34) Ex-operators being ‘hands on’ (28:37) When IPOs peak (32:57) Private v. Public investors (33:15) Sequoia’s letters (37:02) First principles of investing (37:18) How much to pay for an earning stream? (38:00) 35 year payback (38:48) Valuation disconnects (39:26) Fast growing companies (41:21) Negative rates and the 60/40 portfolio (42:03) Inflation is a real force (43:12) Impact of rates on valuation (44:31) Biggest position in crypto (48:11) Being ‘crypto aware’ (49:34) Wrapping up (50:06) Closing thoughts (55:37) 

Long time listeners know I've taken a few weeks off the podcast circuit to go climb some mountains on my bike. In the meantime, I'm doing reruns of some of my favorite Panic with Friends episodes. This one with Michelle Zatlyn aired back in November of ‘21. If you missed it when it came out, now is a good time to catch up. And don't worry, I'll be back in the podcast booth soon.I’m excited to have my friend and fellow Canadian, Michelle Zatlyn, on the show. We’re going to talk about the internet today. Podcasts wouldn’t exist without it, and you’d be unable to appreciate the banter between Knut and I. But this just feels like the right time in the right moment to talk about the internet. Michelle is just the right person to talk about it with. She’s the co-founder, President, and COO of Cloudflare – the company that helps the internet work. We discuss security, how things really work on the internet, where Cloudflare is headed, and how the hell you grow even faster during COVID. Guest - Michelle Zatlyn, Co-Founder, President and COO at Cloudflare howardlindzon.com, cloudflare.com Twitter: @howardlindzon, @zatlyn, @Cloudflare, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/michellezatlyn #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:57) Welcome Michelle (05:36) Moving to US & Harvard Business School (06:51) Building Cloudflare (08:47) Cloudflare’s mission (10:18) Building a better Internet (10:49) Layering Cyber Security (11:24) A quick internet history lesson (13:06) Safe, reliable Internet (15:53) Harvard Professor Clay Christensen (15:59) Democratizing the Internet (16:47) A directional bet on the Internet (18:44) Crypto v. Cryptography (19:27) A public company with real revenue (21:11) Number of daily cyber attacks (21:55) Table stakes for merchants (25:25) The rise of the ‘Cloud’ (26:42) The perfect time to start Cloudflare (28:04) Protecting the Internet-of-Things (29:32) A network of networks (31:46) The rise of social and mobile (32:17) Following Web3 (32:42) Cyber attacks and cryptocurrency (34:03) Making your data your data (35:05) Cloudflare leadership team (36:40) Evolving business structure (38:56) Improving digital literacy (40:10) Building better products and delivering value (40:42) Michelle’s personal investing philosophy (43:15) Business continuity through the pandemic (46:08) Going big on digital literacy (53:11) Wrapping up (57:45) Closing thoughts (58:32) 

Howard has taken a few weeks off the podcast circuit to go climb some mountains on his bike. In the meantime, we’re doing reruns of some of our favorite Panic with Friends episodes. This one with Nick Adler aired back in October of ‘21. If you missed it when it came out, now is a good time to catch up. Today’s episode is with a new friend, Nick Adler. I’m not sure the best way to describe him – he’s a lawyer, entertainment wiz, and works with the one and only Snoop Dogg himself. They’ve gone on a massive run together, and we get into crypto and NFTs and collectibles and digital. Tons of people can talk about the technical side of it, Nick lays out the culture and community.There’s so much movement, there’s so much happening, and celebrity culture is at the center of it. They’re not passengers anymore. This crypto, digital NFT boom will have a million different use cases for a million different categories: from insurance to real estate, and more. And IP and creative and art and content, is all going to change radically due to these tools and technologies. It’s a blank canvas if you’re willing to be adventurous and take chances. Guest - Nicholas Adler, Founder of The Unified, and longtime business partner of Snoop Dogg. howardlindzon.com, soundcloud.com/whosbuyingthisshit Twitter: @howardlindzon, @nickyads, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen linkedin.com/in/nicholas-adler-3051587 #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:48) Welcome Nick (02:02) Panicked about NFTs (02:12) How Nick and Snoop Dog think about Crypto (03:02) The social media explosion (04:38) The Crypto/Digital/NFT boom (06:23) Snoop’s blank canvas (06:54) Web3 development is global (7:20) Partnering with talent (08:23) Have a strong team and experiment (08:34) How Nick and Howard met (10:34) The last true technology crash (11:58) Evergreen and Educational Finance (12:27) Innovation in the DeFi space (15:07) DeFi platforms and staking economy (18:08) The artistic side of NFTs (18:30) The Rocket Factory NFT (19:41) NFTs and endless money printing (21:50) Inflation, deflation and trading NFTs (23:18) Collectibles and NFTs (24:56) Brands will be the NFT leaders (25:48) Will we see a Snoop DAO? (31:03) A hundred David Geffen’s in the future (34:02) You have to know how to sell (34:41) The media negotiation environment (35:56) Build a brand as yourself (41:11) Wrapping up (41:17) Closing thoughts (42:49) 

I’m taking a few weeks off to go climb some mountains on my bike. In the meantime, I’ll be doing reruns of some of my Panic with Friends favorites, like this one with Garry Tan. This episode aired back in September of 21. If you missed it when it first came out, now is a good time to catch up. I think you’ll really enjoy it. Garry is a unique individual I’ve only met a couple of times. He says he’s a fan of the show, so he knows how to sell. His resume is bananas – something we love on Panic with Friends; they may not be famous to everyone, but they’re famous to me! Garry is a Stanford Graduate, was at Y Combinator in the heyday, and was partners with Alexis Ohanian (founder of Reddit). If that weren’t enough, Garry was a seed investor in Coinbase. Oh, and Garry’s now part of my go-to list on the crypto space along with Fred Wilson and Chris Dixon. Guest - Garry Tan, Co-Founder and Managing Partner at Initialized Capital howardlindzon.com, initialized.com, youtube.com/garrytan Twitter: @howardlindzon, @garrytan, @PanicwFriends, @knutjensen youtube.com/garrytan linkedin.com/in/garrytan #fintech #invest #investment #venturecapital #stockmarket #finance Show Notes: Introduction (00:56) Welcome Garry (04:28) Best place to start a company (04:53) Early life in the Bay area (07:01) First ‘business’ (08:00) Achieving the American Dream (09:07) Garry’s first startup (10:58) Balance in a world of endless opportunity (17:30) Launching Initialized (18:42) Panic about Y Cominator (19:58) Work on hard, valuable and fun stuff (20:45) VC at $1 trillion in a decade (24:42) Lean startup / Fat startup (27:35) Crypto ups and downs (28:36) Seed round investing (31:28) Software runs the world (33:58) Transitioning the non-digital natives (35:18) Obscure industries drive the economy (35:56) Building a media platform (39:52) How Garry stays up to date (42:52) Sky NIMBy’s (44:26) Closing thoughts (49:25) Wrapping up (54:18)