At Last She Said It

When one thinks about the events of Jesus' life and ministry, it's natural to think about women. The Bible shows us a man whose inclusion of women was radical within its cultural context. Yet for most of history, his namesake religion has been marked by near-total domination of the patriarchy. What happened? Greg Prince once asked Chieko Okazaki a question that bears repeating: "…where do we need to go to get women in the Church where He wants them to be?" In this episode Cynthia and Susan pose that question again in a conversation shining light on a few of the women hidden in plain sight at Christianity's beginnings.

If you grow up in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, is God a man, a woman, or both? It's a complication we bump up against a lot, if only indirectly, in our religion where God is Heavenly Father, but is also one of a pair of Heavenly Parents. Some members don't seem to notice the absence of the divine feminine in our collective dialogue and worship, while some feel it acutely and yearn for more. But as a church we don't talk about it, so the wrestle with questions is often a private one. In this episode, Susan shares an essay exploring her thoughts and experiences at the intersection of God and gender, then Cynthia joins to add her own insights and ideas. It's a conversation inviting each of us to examine the origins and development of our personal understanding of God.

In this brief bonus episode, Cynthia and Susan discuss some effects of the pandemic on their own faith and church lives.

The pandemic that interrupted attendance for all members forced an unprecedented change in our personal church habits and activity. It blurred the distinction between work, education, church, and family lives. Many saw the shift to "home-based, church-supported" as a prophetic precursor to this change, and leaned into the opportunity presented by it. For some normal attendance has now resumed, while others are choosing to reengage differently in church activity going forward. For this episode, Cynthia and Susan asked women how the pandemic had affected their personal faith journey and relationship with the Church. What changed? What didn't? And what opportunities for personal and institutional growth might we find by examining our individual and collective experience?

How we communicate with other Church members can be as important as what we're trying to say. Women are at a disadvantage with less freedom and opportunity to speak truth to those in authority. Even when we do get the floor, sometimes things as innocuous as pitch, accent, and personal style determine whether we're listened to or dismissed. In this conversation, Cynthia and Susan explore ideas and experiences around LDS women speaking up in ways that will be heard.

In this conversation, artist Caitlin Connolly talks about her experience manifesting the unseen "in large scale and present" in her painting, In Their Image. It's a conversation about a divine mother we've been missing, and daring to bring her into existence for ourselves. "I have found that what I am trying to learn about womanhood…and the divine feminine…has come through women. And will continue to. If we are brave enough to get uncomfortable and do that work."

"If history shows that patriarchy is bad for women, and data shows that girls and women fare better when they can see themselves at every level of leadership in our churches, schools, and societies…why do LDS women and men continue to cling to old ideas that deny history and data?" On this episode, Cynthis poses this question and others in a discussion detailing the list of possible opportunities for service and representation from which women are excluded in our church.

What do you envision when you think about a next life? Happiness? Answers? Judgment? Question marks? There are as many images of the afterlife as there are people to imagine it. But for some Latter-day Saints, the official picture painted at church doesn't feel entirely hopeful or comforting. To kick off Season 5, Cynthia and Susan unpack the idea of "sad heaven," an eternity spent with empty chairs where some of the people we love most should be.

In Episode 84, Kajsa Berlin-Kaufusi joined us for a conversation about how we approach scripture. How much is literal? How much is metaphor? This bonus episode contains additional insights from Kajsa focusing on a specific Old Testament story. It's an illustration of how considering the origin and larger context of a specific text can inform the ways we think about it now.

We received numerous requests for our thoughts around some of the messages delivered at General Conference. In this bonus episode, Cynthia and guest Sherry Macnab get real about their experiences raising LGBTQ kids. It's a vulnerable conversation about the perils of bringing up any kids in a church where they will almost certainly be exposed to some harmful messages.