

The Geek In Review
Greg Lambert & Marlene Gebauer
Welcome to The Geek in Review, where podcast hosts, Marlene Gebauer and Greg Lambert discuss innovation and creativity in legal profession.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Feb 14, 2020 • 54min
Nick Pryor and BCLP³'s Global Innovation Mission
We reach across the Atlantic Ocean and talk with Bryan Cave Leighton Paisner's Nick Pryor on his work the firm's BCLP³ innovation objectives. Nick heads up the firm's European, Middle East, and Asia innovation projects, and gives us some insights on the joys and hardships that come with innovation in the global legal market. Whether it is regulations, cultural challenges, competition, or setting a long-term vision, innovation is challenging. However, Nick also stresses that it is also very rewarding.
Innovation Inspirations
If you had any doubts that privacy was dying, the work that Clearview AI is doing may put those doubts to bed. The facial recognition company has scraped billions of images and personal details from the open web over the past few years and has created a database for law enforcement which claims to have a 99% accuracy rate for matching faces to these images. In a recent The Daily Podcast from the New York Times, reporter Kashmir Hill investigates Clearview AI's entry into the facial recognition marketplace and finds a story that is equally amazing and scary. Federal and state law enforcement are raving about the power of this product to help them solve crimes that may have gone unsolved forever. There is a dark side to this power, which Hill found out first hand when the company manipulated results on her photos and possibly intimidated police who were talking with her. Check out the podcast The End of Privacy as We Know It?
On a lighter note, Marlene's innovation comes from another podcast that explains how new words are added to the Miriam Webster dictionary. The podcast doesn't just stop with the explanation, they are actually attempting to place one of three words into that dictionary, and are asking for help on picking which one. Which will it be? Niblings? Preregret? Or, Pistracted? You can help pick America's Next Top Word.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Please take the time to rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Jan 29, 2020 • 44min
Professor Steve Black on Cybersecurity in the Legal Market
If there's one thing that many of us need these days, it is a cybersecurity expert on retainer. Luckily, law professor Steve Black, visiting professor at the University of Houston fills that need. Prof. Black talks with us on a number of issues including what motivates hackers and cybercriminals (spoiler: it's money), the dark web, how law firms and business approach information stored in the cloud, and what process automation means for data security.
Law firms might be a weak link in the eyes of cybercriminals when it comes to acquiring information. Professor Black discusses the different tactics cybercriminals use, the vulnerabilities found in law firms, and the actions that we need to take with our equipment, our network, our people, and our data. We guarantee that his discussion would be the highlight of any party.
Information Inspirations
While some still think of Millennials as the new kids in the workforce, that isn't really true. In a recent white paper from Thomson Reuters titled, "Becoming the firm where millennials want to work," the authors discuss the needs of a generation which is now the largest percentage in the workforce. Greg ponders the idea of there actually being two subsets within the generation of those in the workforce through the Great Recession and those who entered after the downturn. There is almost a decade of lawyers who have never actually experienced what it's like to work during a recession.
Everyone loves a good story. And we love learning about ways we can create better stories. Marlene discovered a great training site that helps teach you just that. Story Ready from Janece Shaffer offers workshops that deal with what makes details of a story stick in your mind. There are offerings on self-awareness, and design thinking as well.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Special thanks to Joel Lytle, Security Expert from Jackson Walker, LLP for helping me prepare questions for Professor Black.
Please take the time to rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Jan 23, 2020 • 46min
Matt Sunbulli on Fishbowl's Entry into the Legal Industry Social Media Space
The social media platform Fishbowl is designed to create an anonymous but verified space for professionals to socialize with others in the same profession. CEO and co-founder Matt Sunbulli joins us this week to talk about FIshbowl's entry into the legal industry social media space. It's been about eight weeks, but there is already a large number of attorneys and other legal professionals using the platform to discuss issues ranging from what's an appropriate salary range, to advice on lateral moves, to is it okay to vape in the workplace. The answer to that last one is a solid, NO!
Fishbowl creates an optional identification for its users which range from anonymized job title (Attorney, Partner, etc.), to "works at X law firm," to full identification, based on the user's needs on individual interactions. Because users have to sign up with their real names and be verified by your work email and LinkedIn profile, there's a self-policing aspect to the platform. This seems to have tamped down the Troll factor you find on other platforms like Reddit. Because it allows for anonymity in the posts, users are more comfortable about asking questions to peers or others in more senior roles. It's a very interesting concept of professional anonymity that brings us some very interesting conversations that we just don't find on other professional networks like LinkedIn.
Information Inspirations
The American Association of Law Libraries has allowed for full Open Access to the Law Library Journal and Spectrum magazine. The Open Access movement in professional journals and publications is something that has been occurring in academic circles, and once again, AALL is leading the way for other professional organizations to promote professional writing and promotion for its members.
Our Ep. 39 guest Hannah Bloch-Wehba is back with a great upcoming law review article on the problems surrounding the idea of automating social media platform's ability to remove questionable content. While it may sound good on paper, in practice there are many unintended consequences that have to be discussed and exposed.
The National Archives was caught censoring a photo on its Women's Sufferage Movement display. We cannot stress enough how wrong this was. While the National Archives admitted their mistake and is working to replace the image with an unedited one, it is the responsibility of librarians and archivists to not bow to demands or desires to whitewash history.
Two brothers worked for years to create an alphabet and working writing system to their native Fulfulde language. Through their work and collaboration with UNICODE's Michael Everson, and Microsoft, their vision of creating a way for the millions of native speakers to have their language on a computer system became a reality.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Please take the time to rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Jan 15, 2020 • 36min
The Leadership Journey with Laura Toledo and Kevin Iredell
While we may have had a tough time pronouncing things correctly, this week's guests said all the right things when it comes to being a leader within their organizations. Laura Toledo, Communications and Marketing Manager at Nilan Johnson Lewis PA in Minneapolis, and Kevin Iredell, Chief Marketing Officer at Lowenstein Sandler LLP in New York, discuss their year-long experience in the SmithBucklin Leadership Institute. Both are leaders within the Legal Marketing Association, which sponsored their attendance at the institute. While people in leadership positions may feel that they need to have all the answers, Toledo says that she learned it is okay to be patient and learn more about the situation before just going with her gut reaction. Iredell stressed that the key to being a great leader is making sure that you've given those who report to you all the tools and support they need in order to succeed. The Institute brings together leaders from different industries and helped both of our guests understand that the legal industry does not have a monopoly on stressful situations and the need for solid leadership.
Information Inspirations
Greg points to a recent TED talk article from Tomas Chamorro-Premuzic called “Why do so many incompetent men become leaders? And what can we do about it?” The article and video are about as harsh as the title implies. While Chamorrow-Premuzic takes liberties at the expense of men, pointing out that the traits of bad leaders skew toward men, the traits of a good leader do not have a gender bias. We have a tendency to value confidence over competence, narcissism over humility, and the belief that leaders can do anything rather than know their limitations. This inspiration dovetails nicely with our guests today.
Marlene's inspiration came from Jean O'Grady's reporting on the Law Street Media's relaunch of its legal news platform, beginning with high tech and intellectual property news. For those of us wanting a little more competition with Law360 and other legal new providers, this offering from Fastcase may be exactly what we've been looking for.
Greg's final inspiration is more of a request for certain media outlets. In the past month, there have been articles where the images placed on the article do not fit the content of the article. While the intent of the images may have been innocent or just unaware, the results are misogynistic and racist. Imaging matters, especially in an age where many people do little more than skim the titles and images of an article. Hopefully, this will inspire the publisher to make a more concerted effort to use more appropriate imagery for their articles.
Marlene's discusses Cambridge Analytica whistleblower, Brittany Kaiser, who sat down with Kai Ryssdal and Molly Wood on Make Me Smart, and discusses how we may be in a worse place than we were in 2016. (Cue the dark place music.)
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Please take the time to rate and review us on Apple Podcast. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Jan 8, 2020 • 29min
Ellyssa Valenti Kroski on Law Librarians in the Age of AI, and a Hamilton Escape Room
With the new decade comes a new tagline for The Geek in Review introduction. Let us know what you think of the change.
Ellyssa Valenti Kroski is the Director of Information Technology/Director of Marketing at New York Law Institute and is the editor of the new book, Law Librarianship in the Age of AI. Whenever there is a monumental shift in technology and processes, there will be winners and there will be those who are left behind. The authors of this compilation give the readers a path to better understanding what Artificial Intelligence is, and what it isn't. Ranging from the basic understanding of AI concepts to listing specific tools occupying the AI space within the legal industry, to the benefits, risks, and ethical issues surrounding the tools, this book covers a lot of ground. It's definitely worth checking out.
In addition to the book, Ellyssa discusses her other books and projects, including makerspaces and using escape room activities for professional development and end-user training. She will be running an escape room event at the Ark Group’s 14th annual Law Firm Library, Research & Information Services in New York, NY, March 12-13, 2020. The escape room is called Escape the Library: The Search for Alexander Hamilton and the Missing Librarian: A Time Travel Adventure. Apparently, Alexander Hamilton did not die from his duel with Aaron Burr but is actually a time-traveler. Whether true or not, it sounds like a lot of fun. Attendees can get a 20% discount on the conference by entering the code "ESCAPE" when registering.
Information Inspirations
We've covered how BigLaw is adopting the Mansfield Rule to increase diversity within the ranks and is basing that rule upon the National Football League's Rooney Rule. Hopefully, BigLaw does better than the NFL has. When the Rooney Rule was adopted in 2003, there were three black NFL head coaches. At one point, that improved to eight. However, habits persist and after nearly seventeen years in, the NFL coaching ranks are back to exactly where we started. Three. If BigLaw is to do better, it must be vigilant, and firms not complying should be called out.
Marlene's inspiration discusses what happens when your career so encompasses your life, that you can't separate yourself from your job. In a recent Harvard Business Review article, author Janna Koretz discusses the effects of what psychologists call "enmeshment" where professionals are so intertwined with their career identity, that they lose their self-identity. She describes ways to understand if your identity has become enmeshed with your career, and methods to break free of that enmeshment. The example she uses is a partner at a large firm, and we all probably know that this type of career/personal identity enmeshment is very prominent within the legal industry.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Please take the time to rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Dec 19, 2019 • 48min
Professor Ben Barton on Fixing Law Schools
The past ten years have been what University of Tennessee Law Professor Ben Barton calls "the lost decade" for law schools. In his new book, Fixing Law Schools: From Collapse to the Trump Bump and Beyond, Professor Barton walks us through the issues he sees with the current structure of legal education in the United States, and ways to actually fix it. The book focuses on three areas that need correction:
The cost of legal education is simply too high, and cannot be maintained.
Technology has to be leveraged within the educational curriculum to help future practicing attorneys to do more work, charge less, and make more money in the end.
Regulations have to be focused on the outputs of legal education, and be given teeth so that students are more likely to succeed.
While the book title is about the lost decade of the 2010s, the root of the problem goes back well over a hundred years. Professor Barton talks with us about where we've been, where we are, and where we need to go so that we really are Fixing Law Schools.
Information Inspirations
We keep it short and sweet this week (mostly because neither of us has finished our holiday shopping.)
Wireframes are becoming less relevant — and that’s a good thing - In his Medium article, Sean Dexter argues that using wireframes is basically old school now, especially given the rise of Agile product development, and Lean UX processes. Today's visualizations require more on-the-fly modifications which standard wireframes just don't allow. Newer products like Think Sketch, Adobe XD, or Figma are the modern tools you might want to check out.
25+ Legal Tech and Business of Law Predictions for 2020 - Aderant released its third annual predictions and the common theme seems to be centered around the idea that we need less talk about innovation and more actual implementation of innovative ideas and products. Stop with the PR and BS, and get something done. Greg wanted to add one other idea to the 2020 prediction and declare that collaborative software products like Microsoft Teams or the legal industry-focused product Workstorm are going to become must-have products in the team environments in which most of us work.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Our holiday gift wish is that you take the time to rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Be generous!!
Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Dec 9, 2019 • 58min
Deep Dive on State Copyright Issues with Kyle Courtney and Ed Walters
The US Supreme Court heard oral arguments on Georgia v. Public.Resource.Org and we take a deep dive into the issues in this matter. Kyle Courtney, Copyright Advisor at Harvard University, and Ed Walters, CEO of Fastcase have strong opinions in this matter, and were both involved in submitting Amicus Briefs on behalf of Public.Resources.Org. Join us for this engaging and informative conversation as we look at what the arguments are from both sides, and how Justices' questions may shape the outcome of this case.
For more information on this case, check out the oral argument transcript [PDF], and a primer with supportive materials from Ed Waters' on Medium.
We also catch up with Emily Feltren from the American Association of Law Libraries to hear what else has been going on in Washington, DC in regards to legal information (we skip the impeachment stuff.) Believe it or not, there are things actually getting done in DC despite all the obvious gridlock.
Information Inspirations
Our very own Toby Brown is the inaugural guest on the new podcast, Pricing Matters. Toby is well known for his contribution to the establishing of pricing professionals within large law firms, and he gives us a peak behind the curtain of what he has accomplished over the past decade and a half. He even gives us a parallel story of how pricing issues resemble actions taken by HGTV's Chip and Joanna Gaines. Check it out!
KM Is Dead... Long Live KM. It turns out that if you want to be innovative in law firms, look no further than what your Knowledge Management team has been working on for some time now. There's been a big boost lately in how KM is helping innovative law firms move forward with a 360 degree view of their knowledge, and better understanding their clients.
Sometimes we inspire ourselves. Greg recently read about an Australian law firm going through an identity crisis on whether it should see itself as a law firm, or as a professional services consultant on legal issues. The story line fits almost any company, industry, or organization where there is a paradigm shift in what they do. Check out his LinkedIn article where he reworks the story to fit nearly anyone facing change.
Is Data Science dying? Marlene says no. However, firms trying to implement data science techniques are finding that dirty data and antiquated ideas are limiting its results and driving data scientists away from working for them.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Nov 19, 2019 • 44min
The AALL Animal Law Caucus: Acknowledging and Researching Animal Rights in a People-Centric World
We all love our pets and think of them as part of our families. Even though we might love them as much (or more) than we love people, the legal system does not allow them the same protection. That doesn't mean that there are no rights for animals, in fact, there are many specific laws designated to protect them. In this episode of The Geek in Review, we bring on four experts in researching Animal Laws, not just in the US, but worldwide. We talk with the following members of the American Association of Law Libraries' Animal Law Caucus:
Alex Zhang - Law Library Director and Professor of Practice at Washington and Lee University School of Law
Stacey Gordon Sterling -Law Library Director and Professor of law - Alexander Blewett III School of Law at the University of Montana
Katie Ott - Reference Librarian - Robert Crown Law Library at Stanford University
Sarah Slinger - Reference Librarian and Lecturer at Law - University of Miami Law Library
Whether it is legal issues ranging from which "parent" gets the pet in a divorce, or how an orangutan is granted "personhood" in Argentina, to animal testing on cute beagles (yes... that's still going on in the US), our experts from the Animal Law Caucus cover these issues and more.
Information Inspirations
There is a lot of tech opportunities in America, but one of the unrealized places are on Native American Reservations. The Make Me Smart podcast talks with a Native Financial Officer about the upcoming Wiring the Rez conference.
One Texas Federal Judge asks if you submit a brief more than 10 pages long, that you make a recording so he can listen to it, rather than read it. Sounds like an opportunity for some talented legal podcasters with better voices than Greg.
Despite some of the best efforts to make things better, even allies can come up short when it comes to bias in the workplace. One leader in the Social Justice non-profit area shares her story, and it mirrors some of the same situations we see in the legal industry.
To understand Algorithmic Bias, you must first understand the different types of discrimination, and how they apply to the bias. It's very complicated, but here's a primer to get your started.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca.

Nov 12, 2019 • 1h
Alyson Carrel and Cat Moon on The Delta Model
We have discussed the concept of the T-Shaped Lawyer on previous episodes, but we jump into a new concept this week called the Delta Model. Alyson Carrel from Northwestern Law School joins returning guest Cat Moon from Vanderbilt Law School’s Program on Law and Innovation to discuss this intriguing idea of helping lawyers understand the pyramid of skills surrounding understanding the law, business & operations, and personal effectiveness.
We suggest taking a look at this primer from Carrel, Moon, and other members of the Delta Model working group (Natalie Runyon, Shellie Reid, and Gabe Teninbaum) from Bill Henderson's blog, Legal Evolution. This model of three principles, along with the ability to shift the center of importance for each skill set, helps explain, and guide the overall needs of the legal industry. Carrel and Moon give us an insider's view of the model and explain why this concept will help with the holistic training of law students as well as practicing attorneys.
Information Inspirations
In the article, Innovation, Disruption, and Impact: Should We All Jump Aboard the Legal Tech Hype Train? by Peter Melicharek and Franziska Lehner, the authors talk about the need to unwind the PR from the actual technology in the legal industry. The primary benefit of technology is to assist in achieving results by eliminating mundane tasks, and assisting in getting to better legal results, faster, and cheaper.
Once again... read the Delta Model primer. It's so important, it is inspirational.
Can law firms actually create a four-day work week? One smaller firm in Florida says yes. ALM's Dylan Jackson interviews the managing partner of Orlando based Benenati Law about how he has created a four-day work week, and three-day weekends, and the benefits they've discovered of this alternative work model. A recent Microsoft survey found a 40% increase in productivity in some of their four-day work schedules. Perhaps it could do the same at firms??
If you're looking for a great podcast that discusses UX and User Design, then Wireframe has just what you need.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. You can email us at geekinreviewpodcast@gmail.com. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca, thanks Jerry!

Nov 4, 2019 • 46min
Hotshot's Ian Nelson on Modernizing Attorney Professional Development
Ian Nelson is no stranger to introducing the legal industry to as-needed training on legal topics. He was one of the first US employees of Practical Law Company (PLC). After PLC was acquired by Thomson Reuters, Ian stayed on for a while as PLC transitioned into the Thomson Reuters portfolio of legal resources, but his days of finding better ways of presenting and teaching legal concepts were not behind him. Recently, he and his co-founder Chris Wedgeworth (anther PLC alum) created Hotshot. Hotshot is an online Professional Development resource which uses short videos, quizzes, and more to train lawyers, and even law students, across a growing list of legal, business, and technology skills. Essentially, they’ve brought digital learning to the legal industry.
Ian joins us to talk about Hotshot's short video training concepts work with adult learners ranging from attorneys, to law firm staffers, and even helping law students quickly understand complex legal topics.
Congratulations to the newly elected board members for the American Association of Law Libraries (AALL)! In other AALL news, time is running out for members to sign up for the Leadership Academy to be held in Chicago next March. Registration ends on November 11th.
Information Inspirations
We have some new, and new to you podcasts to suggest this week.
First up is the new Law360 Explores: Legalization which investigates all of the legal hurdles of marijuana between the states which legalized it, and the federal government which still sees it as illegal drug dealing.
Hustle and Flow Chart is one of Marlene's favorite digital marketing podcasts which has tips and tricks for your daily work routine.
Junior Economist is a brand new podcast that gives the Millennial perspective on pop culture and current affairs, but through an economic lens.
Beyond the podcast inspirations... if you're looking for a speaker on generational diversity within law firms (there's a 60+ year span between your youngest associates and your oldest senior partners), Greg suggests looking at Chris De Santis. The methods of achieving work goals differ between Boomers, Xers, and Millennials. The more we understand how each generation works, the better we work together.
And finally, Greg is still slightly depressed about the Houston Astros losing in the World Series to the Washington Nationals, but Marlene finds the silver lining by geeking out over sports and graphical data representation. Whether it is the amazing SkyCam view of Cordarrelle Patterson's kickoff return, or strike zone view in baseball, there's a lot of opportunity to add graphics and data to sports, especially baseball.
Listen, Subscribe, Comment
Contact us anytime by tweeting us at @gebauerm or @glambert. Or, you can call The Geek in Review hotline at 713-487-7270 and leave us a message. As always, the great music you hear on the podcast is from Jerry David DeCicca, thanks Jerry!