For the Life of the World / Yale Center for Faith & Culture

"Don't dare think that somehow your conversation with Mary and your interest in her is in competition with your relationship with Christ. ... You are flirting with heresy if you do not have a doctrine of Mary as mother of God." —Matthew MillinerWhat is the role of the Virgin Mary in Christian spiritual formation? Art historian Matthew Milliner (Wheaton College) joins Evan Rosa for a conversation about beauty of Mary in Christian spirituality—particularly for Protestants, for whom the abuses of the past have alienated them from a core component of creedal Christianity, Mary as "Theotokos," the Mother of God. They discuss the history of iconoclasm against Mary, the struggle of contemporary Christianity with art and aesthetics, unpacking the "Woman Clothed with the Sun" from Revelation 12, the feminist objection to Mary, and how the Virgin Mary upends an ancient pagan goddess culture invented to maintain patriarchy. They close with an appreciation of Mother Maria Skobtsova, who's life and witness in the Ravensbruck death camp during the Holocaust exemplifies how the example and presence of Mary Theotokos today might inform the pursuit of a life worth living.Show Notes"La Corona" by John Donne"Don't dare think that somehow your conversation with Mary and your interest in her is in competition with your relationship with Christ." —Matthew Milliner, from the interviewMatthew Milliner's forthcoming book, Mother of the LambHow sacred "art" must support presence"A large family album"Iconoclasm against the Virgin Mary"The institutionalized art world has done such a wonderful job of alienating so many people.""Where has this been all my life?"Madonna Della Misericordia: "The train of her robe is very wide."Contemporary Christianity's struggle with aesthetics"The idea that the Christianity is somehow aesthetically impoverished itself seems to me a fictitious assertion. One that can be fueled with select examples, but I just think there's so much out there that that has been undiscovered. And Mary is often at the heart of it all, like in some senses, whether or not Mary—her presence—[is] in a church in one way or another might be an indicator of whether or not it's going to be beautiful."Revelation 12: "A Woman Clothed with the Sun""She's the new arc of the covenant, in which the presence of God resides."Four-fold reading of scripture: "the literal and the allegorical and the anagogical and the tropical logical are all functioning at the same time."Reading Revelation 12 adventurously: The Woman and the Dragon"Don't dare think that somehow your conversation with Mary and your interest in her is in competition with your relationship with Christ.""It only will enhance your relationship with Christ to develop these other resonances.""Do you realize we're actually in a deep deficit of Catholic Mariology right now?"Vatican II decimated Catholic Mariology"You are flirting with heresy if you do not have a doctrine of Mary as mother of God."What is the role of Mary in Christian spiritual formation?Intersession and prayerJohn Henry Newman on the correlation of Marian piety with cultures that hang on to Christianity.The essential nature of art in Marian Christian piety.Icon: "Virgin of the Sign"—"A womb more spacious than the stars"Sonogram/Ultrasound Mary—conveying all powerful Deity humbled into human formJohn Donne's "La Corona": "Thy Maker's maker, thy Father's mother."Feminist objection to Mariology: "Any time Mary is uplifted, other women are left out.""Alone of all her sex"Rosemary Radford Ruther, Goddesses and the Divine FeminineGoddess cultureThe virgin Mary upends a goddess culture invented to maintain patriarchySarah Jane Boss, Mary: New Century TheologyCharlene Spretnak, Missing Mary: The ReEmergence of the Queen of Heaven in the Modern ChurchMariology and GenderThreatened masculinityPagan phallocentric  religionCourtney Hall Lee, Black Madonna: A Womanist Look at Mary of Nazareth"Christ has a female body too, and a black body too, and a white body, two and not just the Jewish body that he has. An Indian body too, and in Chinese body too, because of his dimension as the ecclesia, which also has a Marian resonance. So welcome to Christianity. You stay long enough, your mind's going to be blown again. ... Nicene orthodoxy is where you get all this stuff."On the Apostle Paul and Marian Piety: "I am grieving until Christ is formed in you. The birth pangs that Paul goes through. And we're all intended to nurse Christ, to give birth to Christ in a metaphorical manner in our lives. And that goes for men as well. So men also can be Marian. In fact, we must be marrying if we're going to be Orthodox Christians."Barth, Von Balthasar, Bulgakov"Theology is better communicated through images because the missteps are harder to make."The equivalent of the hymn is the icon: a tested image that's been around for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years, and that has been refined. And that people over time said, 'You know, there's something right about this one in particular.'"Find icons and prints online at Skete.comAnalysis of the classic Nativity icon"The Nativity icon is what God wants to do in your soul.""Icons are the brake tapping on the entire hyper visual world that we're in. We do not need to be dazzled the way Leonardo dazzled the people of his day. We need to be restrained. And that's what these icons are providing."The beam of light that crashes through the immanent frame.Navigating the depths of interior prayer through art history.Rowan Williams's Looking East in Winter: research on Mother Maria Skobtsova, the Russian Orthodox female parallel to Dietrich Bonhoeffer, who died in the Ravensbrück concentration camp."Mary functioned for her [Mother Maria] as the epiphany, as the illustration, of selfless love."Rowan Williams (from Looking East in Winter): "The Marian sense of being overwhelmed from outside by the presence of the others. Is one of the things that displaces the ego and self oriented projects, including the self-oriented project of doing good or serving the neighbor.""She kept saying, 'My monastery has no walls. My monastery is wherever the poor are.'""There's the great line that the Christians of the 20th century will be either mystics or they won't be Christians at all."About Matthew MillinerMatthew Milliner is Associate Professor of Art History at Wheaton College. He holds an M.A. & Ph.D. in art history from Princeton University, and an M.Div from Princeton Theological Seminary. His scholarly specialization is Byzantine and medieval art, with a focus on how such images inform contemporary visual culture. He teaches across the range of art history with an eye for the prospects and pitfalls of visual theology. He is a five-time appointee to the Curatorial Advisory Board of the United States Senate, and a winner of Redeemer University’s Emerging Public Intellectual Award. He has written for publications ranging from The New York Times to First Things. He recently delivered the Wade Center’s Hansen lecture series on Native American Art, and was awarded a Commonwealth fellowship at the Institute for Advanced Studies in Culture at the University of Virginia to complete his forthcoming book, Mother of the Lamb (Fortress Press). Follow @Millinerd on TwitterProduction NotesThis podcast featured art historian Matthew MillinerEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers,  and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

"Her hands steadied the first steps of him who steadied the earth to walk upon; her lips helped the Word of God to form his first human words." (St. John of Damascus)Who is Mary? Why is she called "Theotokos"? Frederica Mathewes-Green, an Eastern Orthodox writer and educator, joins Evan Rosa for a discussion about Mary, the Mother of God. During the first half of the episode, they discuss the Eastern Orthodox reverence for Mary and the scriptural account of her life—from the Annunciation and Nativity, to her parenting of Jesus, through to the Wedding at Cana and witnessing the unimaginable as her son was crucified, died, buried, and risen. In the second half of our conversation, Frederica sheds light on two ancient texts: The Forgotten Gospel of Mary, also known as the Protoevangelium of James, as well as one of the oldest known manuscripts that refer to Mary as Theotokos: a very short prayer scribbled on papyrus, and known as "Sub tuum praesidium" or "Under your compassion." But that's not all, Frederica draws out the beauty of Mary's exemplarity for all Christians, her suffering faith and bright sorrow, the conjoining of humility and magnanimity in her response to God, and so much more.Show NotesFrederica Mathewes-Green, Mary As the Early Christians Knew Her: The Mother of Jesus in Three Ancient TextsProtoevangelium of JamesSub tuum Praesidium ("Under your compassion...")Mary as Theotokos: "God's birth-giver""The Virgin of the Sign" iconOrthodox view of Mary as worship leaderMary in scriptural context: Luke 1 and 2Mary, troubled and perplexedMagnificat: Every line comes from the psalms, a very classic Jewish understanding of the Messiah as political revolutionary.Mary's perplexity and expectations about Jesus's role as MessiahCatacomb of Priscilla in RomeSimeon's words to Mary: "This child is destined for the falling and the rising of many in Israel and to be assigned, that will be opposed so that the inner thoughts of many will be revealed. In a sword will pierce your own soul too, and these words from Simeon to Mary, upon presenting Jesus at the temple." (Luke 2:34)Sin in Eastern Orthodoxy: "It starts with a thought."Epigraph: "Her hands steadied the first steps of him who steadied the earth to walk upon; her lips helped the Word of God to form his first human words." St. John of DamascusJesus's relationship with MaryThe leadership of MaryThe Wedding at CanaMary at the CrossMary's childhood in the Protoevangelium of JamesMary as a contemplativeMary's achievement of theosis: "absorbing God" / "union with God"AnnunciationMary's anxiety when Jesus was lost at the templeBright sorrow in Mary—both dread and joyLoneliness and autonomyThe practical spiritual benefits of the Protoevangelium of JamesPrayer as a medium of communication; sending Mary prayer requestsThe earliest prayer to Mary: "Sub tuum praesidium""Under your compassion we take refuge Theotokos. Do not overlook our prayers in the midst of tribulation, but deliver us from danger, O only pure, only blessed one."Coming under the shelter of her protectionMatthew 23:37—"Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones, those who are sent to it, how often have I desired to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her brood under her wings and you were not willing."Seeking shelter, refuge, and compassion during strident and striving times.About Frederica Mathewes-GreenFrederica Mathewes-Green is a wide-ranging author who has published 10 books and 800 essays, in such diverse publications as the Washington Post, Christianity Today, Smithsonian, and the Wall Street Journal. She has been a regular commentator for National Public Radio (NPR), a columnist for the Religion News Service, Beliefnet.com, and a podcaster for Ancient Faith Radio. (She was also a consultant for Veggie Tales.) She has appeared as a speaker over 600 times, at places like Yale, Harvard, Princeton, Wellesley, Cornell, Calvin, Baylor, and Westmont, and received a Doctor of Letters (honorary) from King University. She lives with her husband, the Rev. Gregory Mathewes-Green, in Johnson City, TN. Their three children are grown and married, and they have fifteen grandchildren.Production NotesThis podcast featured Mathewes-GreenEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

In the midst of war, the loss of his mother, and the heartbreak of unrequited love, poet W.H. Auden was rediscovering his faith. And the fitting response to the darkness and despair and apathy around him, he thought, was the Christmas event. So he set to work on a Christmas Oratorio called For the Time Being. Originally meant to be performed and sung, what emerged is a much more sobering and stark retelling of the Christmas narrative than you're used to. Auden's modernist poetry becomes a way for a modern humanity—whose resources are spent, whose plans have gone awry, whose hopes have been misplaced, whose sense of time has been unwound—to find redemption amidst the quotidian, the mundane, and the everyday. But also always in an eternally full "moment of decision"—a response to the bare fact of the Incarnation of God in infant Jesus. Evan Rosa is joined by writer Jeff Reimer (Associate Editor, Comment Magazine), who suggests that this modernist retelling of Christmas helps us to diagnose and treat the quintessentially modern vice of acedia, the noonday demon. They discuss the anachronistic cast of characters Auden uses to comment on the human condition. They read and marvel at several passages of the text. And they consider what Auden takes to be the matter of ultimate importance in our experience of Christmas: responding to the audacious claim that God has become human.About Jeff ReimerJeff Reimer is a writer with bylines at Commonweal, Comment, Plough, and Fare Forward. He is Associate Editor for Comment Magazine. Follow Jeff on Twitter @jreimr or check out his website for links to his writing.Show NotesW.H. Auden's For the Time Being (edited with introduction by Alan Jacobs)Read Jeff Reimer's What Comes After: W. H. Auden’s cure for the post-Christmas bluesDealing with the Post-Christmas BluesFlipping the feast for the fast in contemporary Christmas cultureW.H. Auden's For the Time BeingDarkness, despair as the context for the Advent apocalyptic setting"Very little Christmas cheer"Auden's context for writing For the Time Being: World War II, the death of his mother, and his re-discovered faithPossibilities for hope and redemptionReason and optimism have run outCentral question of For the Time Being: "What do we do with this singular Christmas event?"Cast of charactersExistentialist influence on AudenThe silence of Christ in the poemStrange characters: Intuition, Sensation, Feeling, and Thought as an expression of the human selfMary and Joseph: Divergent responses to the Angel GabrielMary's humility and magnanimity togetherWhat it's like to be JosephThe temptation of St. JosephRedeeming the mundane and the quotidianAcedia: the quintessentially modern viceCharles Taylor: "Our present condition is one in which many people are happy living for goals which are purely imminent; they live in a way that takes no account of the transcendent.""The Time Being"—ennui, acedia, and depression following ChristmasThe noonday demonSimeon: Auden's intellectual, theological response to the incarnationHerod: Auden's stoic intellectual, politically indifferent, tragic-comic figureStoic virtue: apathea, or "cultivated indifference"The incarnation does not allow for cultivated indifferenceHerod's cultivated indifference ends up becoming outright violent resistance and the massacre of the innocentsThe difficulty of inhabiting a moment the way we're meant toThe way, the truth, the life"Seek him in the Kingdom of Anxiety."Production NotesThis podcast featured writer Jeff ReimerEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

"I wrestle not against flesh and blood." (David Dark's Ephesians 6:12 mantra) / According to David Dark (Belmont University), each of us occupy a variety of robots—roles, titles, occupations, institutions, conglomerates, ways of being, social norms, etc.—and these robots exert a cultural force, sometimes benign, but then again, sometimes violently destructive and degrading of human life. And in order to appreciate and honor our shared humanity, those of us in violent, impersonal robot systems need to be softly, humanely, respectfully, lovingly exorcised from those violent systems. David Dark joins Evan Rosa to talk about his idea of "Robot Soft Exorcism"—a metaphor-slash-parable-slash-theory-slash-way-of-life—that he uses to explain and expound non-violent resistance and prophetic witness. Along the way, they discuss the righteous skepticism he was raised on, the blurry secular-sacred divide, how he met Henri Nouwen, the technological ethics of Jacques Ellul, the real meaning of turning the other cheek, and the constant need to divest ourselves of the power of our positions, our titles, our platforms ... our robots.About David DarkDavid Dark is an American writer and cultural critic; and is Assistant Professor of Religion and the Arts at Belmont University in Nashville, TN. He's author of several books including, Life's Too Short To Pretend You're Not Religious, The Sacredness of Questioning Everything, Everyday Apocalypse: The Sacred Revealed in Radiohead, The Simpsons, and Other Pop Culture Icons, and The Gospel According To America: A Meditation on a God-blessed, Christ-haunted Idea. Follow him on Twitter @DavidDark or his Substack, Dark MatterShow NotesDavid Dark's Robot Soft Exorcism Twitter Thread: https://twitter.com/DavidDark/status/1012804184868048896Righteous skepticism in David Dark's family historyGodzilla and GodSecular–sacred divide"I don't have to settle for the given dichotomies or dualisms."Daoism, intellectual humility and the meaning of righteous skepticism in southern (fundamentalist) Christian contextThe blurry binaries of Christianity and Pop CultureNashville: "The post-modern Vatican of the prayer trade"Christian music industry in the'80s"One might want to separate Christian marketing from the January 6th attack, but you really can't because association is currency.""On human barnyard"; "there are no unrelated phenomena"On meeting Henri Nouwen and learning the word social justice"There is no non-social justice. Justice is relational."Robot Soft ExorcismEphesians 6:12: "For our struggle is not against enemies of blood and flesh, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers of this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places."Walter Wink's Powers seriesPower dynamics of 2018's border crisis, separating families at the border, and Sarah Huckabee Sanders at the Red Hen RestaurantTurning the other cheek; demanding to be punched as an equalDramatizing the conflict as part of the task of prophetic action"Robot soft exorcism is inviting someone to be a human being rather than just being their position."Breaking it down: The Robot PartJacques Ellul and the Technological SocietyUse vs Reception"I think that Twitter can be a wonderful tool. It is the tool upon which I inscribed my Robots Soft Exorcism. But Twitter is also can be a broken fire hydrant of sadness and rage.""I think Ellul said: We speak of a computer as a companion, but a computer is actually a vampire.""What we do with our screens is what we do with our lives. We are never escaping relationship.""[Insert Soul Here]"Philip K. Dick's "disinformation"Beck: "Don't believe everything you breathe."Breaking it down: The Exorcism PartMob Spirit on January 6"Sitting with anger until it becomes sadness." (Sarah Mason)Exorcism as social therapyThoreau: "We all crave reality."Buddhists surrendering a spirit of conflict or difference before partingKarl Barth: If you don't have any solid difference with the person with whom you exchange the peace of Christ, the peace of Christ isn't there because the peace has to overcome some kind of difference."Opinion, Posture, Position: None ever have to be confused with one's identity.U2's "Staring at the Sun": "Armor-plated suits and ties""Sometimes when we skip straight to Christ, we skip over Jesus of Nazareth. I'm not saying we all do that whenever we say Christ, but w if I say Christ enough that I'm not thinking about the sermon on the Mount, that I'm not thinking of the red letter words, Christ can become a kind of personal ghost friend who excuses me from my bad behavior."Divesting ourselves of the power we carry through the worldClaudia Rankin: whiteness as an investment in not-knowingThe centrality of listeningEllul: "Propaganda is monologue and monologue ends when dialogue begins."Breaking it down: The Soft PartCivil Rights Movement is actually the Non-Violent Movement of America"One human exchange at a time."Mantra: "I wrestle not against flesh and blood." (Ephesians 6:12)Rage Against the MachineAdvent/Christmas as the prototypical Robot Soft ExorcismBruce Coburn: "Redemption rips through the surface of time in the cry of a tiny babe.""We're really going against the news cycle if we insist on the meaning of human history being in this manger scene. To be alive to it, to be citizens of a better future than what is being settled for by our robot overlords."Production NotesThis podcast featured author and cultural critic David DarkEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

"To be a poet is to be an exile," says poet Christian Wiman. He echoes the most influential writer on his early life and work, Simone Weil, who wrote in her Gravity & Grace: "We must take the feeling of being at home into exile. We must be rooted in the absence of a place." Wiman spent most of the 2020 leg of the pandemic curating a story about home using 100 poems, seamed with prose from some of the wisest denizens of our species to narrate the tale. He joins Evan Rosa to read some of the poetry from the collection, talk about the connection between poetry and faith, and continue to examine the meaning of home through exiles' eyes. This episode was made possible in part by the generous support of the Tyndale House Foundation. For more information, visit tyndale.foundation.Show NotesHome: 100 PoemsJoseph Brodsky, exile from RussaDefining "Home"Mahmoud Darwish, "I Belong There""I have learned and dismantled all the words in order to draw from them, a single word: home."Josef Pieper on tautologyPoetry as a way of inhabiting rather than definingThe epigraph from He Held Radical Light: "The world does not need to come from a god. For better or worse, the world is here. But it does need to go to one (where is he?). And that is why the poet exists." (Juan Ramon Jimenez)Why does the poet exist?"Existence is not existence until it's more than existence."Jack Gilbert, "Singing in My Difficult Mountains""My fine house that love is.""To be a poet is to be an exile."Simone Weil: "We must be rooted in the absence of a place." (Gravity & Grace)A traveling placeModern humanity in exile, a secular notionWeil, The Need for Roots"I think all poets though, experience the feeling of displacement that comes with perception."W.B. Yeats on Maude Young, "I might have thrown poor words away and attempted to live.""Life is the thing. Words are always a kind of displacement."Wendell Berry's Sabbath: "There is a day when the road neither comes nor goes, and the way is not a way, but a place."Frantically nomadicRestlessness and the pull toward securityRooted in relationships"In my 20s, Simone Weil was the most important writer in my life. ... But now in my fifties, I feel a little differently. I still love Simone Weil, but I appreciate very much the work that someone like Wendell Berry has done to secure an existence against all the odds, secure a kind of existence in one place, and make it out of language as well."Vincent Van Gogh and Gaston BachelardStabilizing and DestabilizingVan Gogh: Life is roundBachelard: Dwelling in images and wordsSome real element of the past, brought into the present with metaphysical power: "I think there's some real element of the past of memory, that is made alive and volatile and even salvific, and it's not an image of youth. It is the actual thing being brought into the present."He Held Radical Light: seeking, through poetry, "those moments of mysterious intrusion, that feeling of collusion with eternity, of life and language riled to the one wild charge.”Poetry: the main way faith sustains Wiman"All poets are Jews." (Maria Sativa)"All poets are believers." (Christian Wiman)Something in poetry itself to further existence"If you do not believe in poetry, you cannot write it." (Wallace Stevens)Glory to God for dappled thingsThe role of mystery in poetry and faithFollowing the music of poetry in a physical, physiological, improvisational wayWendell Berry on the Kingdom of God: "We contain that which contains us."Home in painful division in Wendell BerryCarson McCullers: ImprovisationBraithwaite, "Bass"How is poetry in conversation with perplexity?James Baldwin, "Sonny's Blues" (Christian Wiman's "favorite short story in the world")"Dealing with the roar rising from the void and imposing an order on it."Deep consolation in poetryResponding to the music of poetryRead poetry out loudCan you write good poetry without suffering much?George MacKay Brown, "Old Fisherman with Guitar"What is a life worth living? Creating and lovingThe pursuit of God is wrapped up with creating art and being freed to love.The impact of Christian Wiman's "Prayer"About Christian WimanPoet Christian Wiman is Professor of the Practice of Religion and Literature at Yale Divinity School. He’s the author of several books of poetry, including Every Riven Thing, Hammer is the Prayer, and his most recent, Survival Is a Style. His memoirs include the bracing and beautiful My Bright Abyss: Meditation of a Modern Believer and He Held Radical Light: The Art of Faith, the Faith of Art. He edited an anthology of 100 poems on Joy a few years ago, and just released Home: 100 Poems this month.Introduction (Evan Rosa)"To be a poet is to be an exile," says Christian Wiman, a poet and Professor of the Practice of Religion and Literature at Yale Divinity School. Wiman knows this personally. When he was younger than now, he moved 40 times over a 15 year period. He would come early to work as Editor of Poetry Magazine to write his own, spilling line after line onto page from the driver seat of his car (he wrote my favorite poem of his that way he tells me). And the writer that defined him then was Simone Weil, who wrote in her Gravity and Grace, "We must take the feeling of being at home into exile. We must be rooted in the absence of a place."And I wonder, if all poets are exiles, does that make us all poets? The generalized unease and anxiety that comes with being human often leaves us longing for a home. And each of us imagine a particular place, a perspective, a people, when we think of home. But it's always longing, isn't it. Especially in light of the fact that "we are home to each other"—that home is ultimately a relational reality built and maintained and indwelled with people—if that's true then no wonder we long for home all the more, because we long to be accepted, received, and loved all the more.A recent theme of the podcast has been exile and migration. War correspondent Janine Di Giovanni offered perspective on the vanishing Christian population in the middle east; biblical scholar Francisco Lozada helped us view faith through the eyes of the immigrants hopeful sojourn. Today, that continues, even as we consider the very meaning of home by way of poetry.Christian Wiman spent most of the 2020 leg of the pandemic curating a story about home using 100 poems, using with prose from some of the wisest denizens of our species to narrate the tale. The book came out this month, and you can listen to Miroslav Volf and Christian Wiman discuss the project on episode 36 of the podcast.I asked Chris to come back on the show to read more of the poems he selected, talk about the connection between poetry and faith, and continue to examine the meaning of home through exiles' eyes. You might think that's exactly the wrong way to wonder about home. But Odysseus would tell you different as he fights his way back to Ithaca. Moses would tell you different as he leads the Jews through the wilderness. Jesus would tell you different as he goes to prepare a place for you.And what other option do we have as wandering wonderers anyway—always longing for home, always praying for, in Christian Wiman's words, "those moments of mysterious intrusion, that feeling of collusion with eternity, of life and language riled to the one wild charge.”Thanks for listening, and enjoy.Production NotesThis podcast featured poet Christian WimanEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

Happy Thanksgiving! We often misunderstand gratitude as either a means to our subjective well-being or as an obligation of debt to a giver. So what is the emotion of gratitude? Sameer Yadav (Westmont College) joins Ryan McAnnally-Linz to reflect on a better way to understand gratitude than owing it, being in debt to another person, seeing gratitude only through the dry indifference of a receiver's economic indebtedness to a giver. Gratitude as indebtedness creates problems especially when thinking about gratitude to God, and the two consider instead on a conception of gratitude based in sacrament and creatureliness, mystical shared witness, the meetness and rightness of thanks and praise, and a joyful recognition of the gifts in our lives. This understanding of gratitude would have truly seismic consequences for how we see the world. Thank you cards would no longer feel obligatory, and gratitude lists wouldn't have to be hacked for my subjective well-being, it would simply follow from the glad, mutual sharing in the gift of life from God, and the presence of being what we are to each other.This episode was made possible in part by the generous support of the Tyndale House Foundation. For more information, visit tyndale.foundation.Show Notes"A debt of gratitude": Is it helpful for Christians to think about gratitude?What do we owe to one another?Obligations tied up with debtsGratitude is historically tied up with political economyRobert C. Roberts, Spiritual Emotions: A Psychology of Christian VirtuesDebts of gratitude as deeply problematic because of (1) the dynamics it presents for human relationships and (2) Christian understanding of the emotionDavid Graeber, Debt: The First 5,000 YearsDebt, calculation, equivalenceOwing money vs owing favorsForcibly severing us from our contexts: Abstraction from relationships and dependencies"The Labor that Pays My Salary" (Isaac Villegas, The Christian Century)Seneca on gratitude—internal attention on giftThomas Aquinas on gratitudeImmanuel Kant on gratitude: You can never do enough as recipient, since you're only ever a respondent; the giver always acts firstAristotle on gratitude: Not a virtue for the magnanimous person, since you'd have to owe someone, and self-sufficiency is better than dependence—better to be a giver than receiverThe role of social hierarchy and the economic image of gratitudeGratia vs GratitudoModeling "gratitudo" on social superiority/inferiorityGratitude as an "unfortunate necessity"Apostle Paul: "For who sees anything different in you? What do you have that you did not receive? And if you received it, why do you boast as if it were not a gift?" (1 Corinthians 4:7)Affirmation of dependence as essential to the human condition; staunch independence as sinful pride"Why not just be happy with indebtedness?"Inverting the values of debt obligationIndebted to GodArgument by analogy: Aquinas's distinction between gratitudo and gratia: Everyone has equal indebtedness to God. A bad analogy when you do it on economic terms.Jeremy David Engels, The Art of GratitudeChristianity and the cancellation of debtChristian mystical tradition—Howard Thurman and the divine sharing with creationGod's life extended in creaturesRather than benefactor or beneficiary relationships, God is a transcendent, holy other ..."We're a witness and channel for God's holy presence."Gratitude as joyful recognition offered to GodPraise and GratitudeHoward Thurman: Gratitude as a sacramentAbraham Joshua Heschel: Gratitude as a windowReflecting light back to its sourceDavid Graeber: "What could possibly be more presumptuous, more ridiculous than to think it would be possible to negotiate with the grounds of one's existence? Of course it isn't. Insofar as it is indeed possible to come to any sort of relation with the absolute, we are confronting a principle that exists outside of time or human scale entirely, therefore as medieval theologians correctly recognize when dealing with the absolute, there can be no such thing as debt."Debt as a category mistakeJacob's Ladder: "You give me everything, and I'll give a tenth back to you.""God isn't dealing with losses and gains here."TransfigurationIntrinsic relationalityEucharistic prayer: "Let us give thanks to the Lord our God. / It is meet and right so to do."Glad, mutual sharing in the gift of one another to one anotherIntrinsically egalitarian dimension to sharingEugene McCarraher, The Enchantments of Mammon: How Capitalism Became the Religion of Modernity: "without faith in the sacramental nature of the world, we anchor ourselves in the illusionary and inevitably malevolent apparatus of domination."Eucharist = "thanks"Introduction (Evan Rosa)This is the obligatory gratitude podcast for the week before Thanksgiving. Thank you. You're welcome. But in all seriousness: Here's to hoping that you're listening to this in the peace and rest and warmth of family and loving community.But I have to be honest about something; I'm not very good at thank you notes. Don't get me wrong, I try my best to communicate verbally my gratitude for the people and gifts in my life, and I'm ever—often painfully aware of my dependence on others, my need for them, my profound linkage to them. But I feel pretty bad that when it comes to writing the note and formalizing the payment of my debt of gratitude, I falter.Part of the problem, I gauge, besides the grossness of my narcissism, is that I feel so indebted, so obligated to do it, like my gratitude to you just doesn't count if I don't write the note, or that it's less about the giver and more about the card or the transaction. There's something wrong there.But I'm equally tempted to err in another way: Ever since I learned from positive psychology that I could hack my own thankfulness for happiness, I tend to exploit gratitude just to feel better.Our episode today will correct me on both counts, both for thinking of gratitude as something to be exploited for my personal well-being and for thinking of gratitude as an obligation.Today on the show Sameer Yadav, a theologian at Westmont College, joins Ryan McAnnally-Linz to reflect on a better way to understand gratitude than owing it, being in debt to another person, seeing gratitude only through the dry indifference of a receiver's economic indebtedness to a giver. Gratitude as indebtedness creates problems especially when thinking about gratitude to God, and the two consider instead on a conception of gratitude based in sacrament and creatureliness, mystical shared witness, the meetness and rightness of thanks and praise, and a joyful recognition of the gifts in our lives.This understanding of gratitude would have truly seismic consequences for how we see the world. Thank you cards would no longer feel obligatory, and gratitude lists wouldn't have to be hacked for my subjective well-being, it would simply follow from the glad, mutual sharing in the gift of life from God, and the presence of being what we are to each other.And I would be remiss if I didn't take the opportunity to thank each of you, our listeners and subscribers, for joining us each weekend for these conversations. It's our joy to produce them for you, and I don't even feel obligated to say that. Not in the least. So I guess remiss was the wrong word there cuz that means faulting a duty. Aye! That's why we need this episode.So, how about this: Thanks for sharing in the gift of making this podcast. Enjoy.Production NotesThis podcast featured theologians Sameer Yadav and Ryan McAnnally-LinzEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

What can the faith of the migrant teach us about a living theology? The resilience and communal outlook of immigrants offers a way of seeing human relationships—political, social, religious—as porous and permeable, meant to encounter God in the other, welcoming each other in love and hospitality. Francisco Lozada (Brite Divinity School) joins Evan Rosa to reflect on his experiences at U.S.-Mexico borderlands, leading travel seminars and teaching about immigration and justice from a theological framework—they discuss the influence of liberation theology's guiding principle of the preferential option for the poor, the centrality of history in understanding immigration, the problem of American xenophobia, and the racialization of U.S. immigration policy.This episode was made possible in part by the generous support of the Tyndale House Foundation. For more information, visit tyndale.foundation."Building bridges, not walls.""God doesn't see borders. In my theological thinking, I don't imagine a God or theologize a God asking, "show me your papers." God's asking different questions: Did you feed me, did you give me something to drink, did you clothe me?During this trip to Nogales, we came across a group of students and they were celebrating mass. We were walking right by them. We were on the U.S. side, they were on the Mexican side, and they asked, do we want to celebrate mass there? And what I see that moment is, that mass, that prayer was a form or expression of resistance, of pushing back there. There are no borders between us.Prayer doesn't see borders. Faith doesn't see borders. That's the power religion. I think the power of theology, the power of prayer, is that it works—not always, but in its true sense—it works to build bridges, not walls." (Francisco Lozada, from the interview)Introduction (Evan Rosa)Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,With conquering limbs astride from land to land;Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall standA mighty woman with a torch, whose flameIs the imprisoned lightning, and her nameMother of Exiles. From her beacon-handGlows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes commandThe air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.“Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries sheWith silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”"The New Colossus" Emma Lazarus, 1883The generous spirit, the welcome for the wandering, taking in the homeless stranger, the refugee—these words that inscribe the Statue of Liberty offer a hopeful image of an America with open arms, a beacon of hospitality and safety in a dangerous world. How do we square this symbol of welcoming freedom with the reality of immigration policy today? Detention centers crowded with young children separated from their families, exploitation of undocumented migrants for agricultural labor, billions of dollars spent on "the wall," the false nativism of fair-skinned European-American immigrants.Alongside the ideals of The New Colossus embracing the "tired, poor, huddled masses," a history of racial purity, exclusion, xenophobia, and fear can be seen in immigration policy, from the Chinese Exclusion Act just four years before the dedication of Lady Liberty, to the discriminatory immigration quotas of the Johnson-Reed Act in 1924, all the way up to the Muslim Travel Ban of 2017.In the spring of 2018, approximately 5,500 children were separated from their families by Trump's zero tolerance policy. 1,700 children still live in detention centers, 3 years later.But how does this balance with the rights of a nation to enforce and manage its political borders? How should those borders be enforced justly? How should we prioritize national security and cultural integrity with the call to welcome the tempest-tost stranger through our "golden doors"?Well, beyond the dizzying political and moral questions that we have with us always, Francisco Lozada is thinking theologically about immigration and the migrant experience. He is the Charles Fischer Catholic Professor of New Testament and Latinx Studies at Brite Divinity School in Fort Worth, Texas.Lozada draws on his experiences at U.S.-Mexico borderlands, leading travel seminars and teaching about immigration and justice from a theological framework. In this episode we discuss the influence of liberation theology's guiding principle of the preferential option for the poor, the centrality of history in understanding immigration, the problem of American xenophobia, the racialization of U.S. immigration policy, and the ways Jesus, himself a migrant and refugee, crosses borders and boundaries throughout the Gospel narrative.Thanks for listening.AboutFrancisco Lozada, Jr. is the Charles Fischer Catholic Professor of New Testament and Latinx Studies at Brite Divinity School in Fort Worth, Texas. He holds a doctorate in New Testament and Early Christianity from Vanderbilt University. He is a past co-chair of the Johannine Literature Section (SBL), past chair of the Program Committee of the Society of Biblical Literature (SBL), and a past member of SBL Council. He is a past president of the Academy of Catholic Hispanic Theologians of the United States, a past steering committee member of the Bible, Indigenous Group of the American Academy of Religion (AAR), and past co-chair of the Latino/a and Latin American Biblical Interpretation Consultation (SBL). He also serves on the board of directors for the Hispanic Summer Program, and mentored several doctoral students with the Hispanic Theological Initiative (HTI). Dr. Lozada’s most recent publications concern cultural and ideological interpretation while exploring how the Bible is employed and deployed in ethnic/racial communities. As a teacher, he co-led immersion travel seminars to Guatemala to explore colonial/postcolonial issues and, most recently, to El Paso, TX, and Nogales, AZ, to study life and society in the U.S.-Mexico borderlands. Click here to check out his personal website.Show NotesIntroduction (Evan Rosa)"The New Colossus," Emma Lazarus, 1883 (see above)Relationality, borderlands, and solidarityLife shared togetherWhat does solidarity mean in the context of immigration?Paolo Freire, Pedagogy of the OppressedJon Sobrino, SJ"How do you bring us churches in solidarity with the plight of the poor in Latin America?"The guiding principles of liberation theology and their influence on immigration theologyPreferential option for the poorJesus as someone with usResilience and the migrant's journeyReframing the narrative of why migration occurs.Common misconceptions (narratives) about why people migrate"How you understand migration will influence how you respond to immigration."Nationalism, nativism, and scarce resourcesResponsibility comes from our relatedness and living off the benefits of oppressive history"Immigration is historical. You can't construct an immigration response that's ahistorical."Oscar Martinez, Troublesome Border"The border is not fixed."Jesus crossing borders in the Gospel of JohnRelationships that break through bordersSamaritan womanCenturionAre borders meant to be crossed?Why migrants cross, how migrants cross, and how borders are maintained.The narrative is the encounter itself.XenophobiaA reckoning with our complicity with the construction of whitenessNationality Act of 1790Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882Johnson-Reed Act of 1924 Hart-Celler Immigration Act of 1965Whiteness and the history of U.S. Immigration Policy"The New Colossus" (Inscription  on the Statue of Liberty): "Give me your tired, your poor, / Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, / The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. / Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me, / I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”How do we interpret human mobility?How do we understand our past?"It can't begin out of an abstract reality, it has to begin with a lived reality. That's liberation."The faith of the migrantResilience Production NotesThis podcast featured biblical scholar Francisco LozadaEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

Can Christianity survive in the Middle East? Ancient communities of Christian faithful are currently being decimated not just by religious violence, persecution, and war—but the economic factors that motivate emigration and refuge. Janine Di Giovanni is an award-winning journalist and war correspondent, and is Senior Fellow at Yale University's Jackson Institute for Global Affairs. She joins Evan Rosa to discuss her journalistic style and approach to human rights reporting, the alarming decimation of the Christian population in the Middle East, the difference between survival and flourishing, and what it means to adapt to being an outsider. Her latest book is The Vanishing: Faith, Loss, & the Twilight of Christianity in the Land of the Prophets.This episode was made possible in part by the generous support of the Tyndale House Foundation. For more information, visit tyndale.foundation.From the Introduction (Evan Rosa):There are many ways to be a journalist in our noisy digital commons. And likely, there's a place for them all, but everyone—whether writer or reader—needs to ask: What is a journalist for? Presenting the truth, spreading knowledge, yes. But reporting for mere awareness pushes the question all the more for us news junkies, hooked on headlines replete with bad news.My guest today sees journalism as an endeavor of human empathy—recording the truth not from embassies or palaces or political centers, but from the leaky tents of refugee camps; telling stories not of the powerful politicians and generals executing a war, but the widows and orphans caught up in the chaos; publishing news and correspondence not to feed the insatiable news gluttony of American media, but to give voice to the voiceless.Show NotesThe Vanishing: Faith, Loss, & the Twilight of Christianity in the Land of the ProphetsHow Janine Di Giovanni became a "human rights reporter"Palestinian occupation and intifadaBosnian WarWar is not about religion or tribe, but powerEmbedded within a communityGiving voiceExpressing agencyThe Vanishing: Documenting Christian communities before they disappearDi Giovanni's personal faith and commitment to neighbor loveCoats on the BoweryJournalistic style: bringing the reader close"If you have the ability to go to these places and bring the story to other people, then you have the obligation."Confusion, frustration, fearWar makes life change in an instantPerspective-taking, empathy, and compassion"Celebrating the fact that we still exist."Christian persecution around the worldThe purpose of The Vanishing: to honor the people who have decided to stay, even amidst persecutionPope Francis's trip to Iraq during covid, for solidarity"Emigration is our enemy."Good refugees vs bad refugeesChaldean Christian Iraqis chanting in AramaicFaith rooted in the landAdapting to being an outsider vs adapting to being an insiderEgyptian Coptic ChristiansCourage to be a stranger in a strange landWhat is a life worth living?Production NotesThis podcast featured journalist and war correspondent Janine Di GiovanniEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

As the political world casts a leery eye on Christians—especially as the meaning of "Evangelical" changes—the focus on the meaning and purpose of the pastor is especially relevant. Amidst our consumeristic, narcissistic culture, what does it mean to pursue self-care? How does caring for oneself square with caring about what Jesus cares about? (Even and especially when Jesus cares about you?) Upholding the call of the pastor to take on the cares of Christ, Will Willimon (Professor of the Practice of Christian Ministry at Duke Divinity School) suggests we've developed a disordered approach to self-care, proving the triumph of the therapeutic and mimicking our consumeristic world rather than embodying the oddity of the Christian Gospel. Interview by Evan Rosa.This episode was made possible in part by the generous support of the Tyndale House Foundation. For more information, visit tyndale.foundation.Introduction (Evan Rosa)What is the purpose of a pastor? To teach you how to think (or vote)? To reassure you that you're safe? To heal your wounds? The goal of pastoral ministry is surely in question right now. Everything from the toxic masculinity of the bully pulpit, to the pastor as political pollster, to the staggering need to be cool of hipster celebrity pastor—there's lots of ways to go wrong in pastoral ministry, and a razors edge of getting it right. It's a demanding job. Perhaps its so demanding because the primary call of the pastor is to take up the cares of Christ, speaking the truth when the truth hurts, listening from both sides of the conversation between God and the Church, comforting the grieving when there's plenty in your own life to grieve, standing with the marginalized and oppressed when its the unpopular, difficult thing.That is to say: it's a dangerous world, the world of pastoral ministry. But as my guest on the show today suggests, this danger ought to be faced with courage and eyes wide to the cares of Christ.Will Willimon is Professor of the Practice of Christian Ministry at Duke Divinity School and author of over 100 books, including Worship as Pastoral Care, Accidental Preacher, Resident Aliens: Life in the Christian Colony (with Stanley Hauerwas), and his most recent, God Turned Toward Us: The ABCs of the Christian Faith. He's been a pastor in the United Methodist Church for a long time, including an 8 year stint as a Bishop.Will Willimon is concerned about the direction the church is headed and is asking uncomfortable but necessary questions. Amidst our culture of consumerism, narcissism, where the vision of flourishing reaches no higher than getting whatever it is you want most, how does caring for oneself square with caring about what Jesus cares about? (Even and especially when Jesus cares about you?) Upholding the call of the pastor to take on the cares of Christ, Will Willimon suggests we've developed a disordered approach to self-care, proving the triumph of the therapeutic and mimicking our consumeristic world rather than embodying the oddity of the Christian Gospel.About Will WillimonThe Reverend Dr. William H. Willimon is Professor of the Practice of Christian Ministry at the Divinity School, Duke University. He served eight years as Bishop of the North Alabama Conference of The United Methodist Church, where he led the 157,000 Methodists and 792 pastors in North Alabama. For twenty years prior to the episcopacy, he was Dean of the Chapel and Professor of Christian Ministry at Duke University, Durham, North Carolina. He is author of over 100 books, including Worship as Pastoral Care, Accidental Preacher, Resident Aliens: Life in the Christian Colony, and his most recent, God Turned Toward Us: The ABCs of the Christian Faith. His articles have appeared in many publications including The Christian Ministry, Quarterly Review, Plough, Liturgy, Worship and Christianity Today. For many years he was Editor-at-Large for The Christian Century. For more information and resources, visit his website.Show NotesHow Will Willimon became a pastor and educator in pastoral ministryWhat is the purpose of pastoral ministry?EquippingMutuality of care in Christian communityThe sermon as conversation between the preacher, the congregation, and GodPreaching as "double listening"Helping and caring, overemphasizing the role of help and care in pastoral ministryWill Willimon and Stanley Hauerwas recent article: "The dangers of providing pastoral care"The triumph of the therapeutic in pastoral ministry"... how tough it is in a kind of therapeutic culture to do pastoral care, because our care keeps getting captured by certain secular, therapeutic mindsets.""Jesus healed, but had an odd, ambiguous relationship to his healing.""Our care is offered in tension."Wading into people's pain is dangerous territory.Christ as "wounded healer"Flourishing as opposed to curing or healing"Jesus loves to take sick, hurting people in pain and give them a job to do—that is be a Christian disciple."Is ministry a therapy for me?Triumph of the therapeuticConsumerism, possession, and life without limitsWillie Jennings's After WhitenessT.S. Eliot: "Why should people love the church?"Christian humilityThe oddness of the Christian GospelJesus on marriage"Jesus has a different idea of what it means to be a human being."The modern myth of the role-less selfThe role of the community in supporting the individual"I wonder what God is doing with your pain right now.""Is the corporate practice of Christianity optional?"Hauerwas: "How do you minister to people in a pandemic who think that death is optional or think that death is an injustice God has worked on them?"Muddling throughEmbedded in communityTo whom are we responsible?How to become a community worthy of the name of "community in Christ"?"Maybe in God's hands, the present moment is not a call for lament and despair, but a call for: 'Wow. Let roll with Christ.'"Production NotesThis podcast featured pastor and educator Will WillimonEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

Julian Reid explores the way music and scripture can come together to create a sacred space. Extending metaphors of music as architecture and dwelling and spiritual experience as a river, the jazz pianist, producer, writer, and performer explains a recent project of his, "Notes of Rest," combining African-American spirituals with classical hymns for an experience of spiritual hospitality, gratitude, and proclamation of the Gospel into the full spectrum of human experience, in all its pain, frustration, frenzy, stillness, and joy. Throughout the conversation you'll hear Julian play along to accompany his points; he also graciously provided beautiful meditative interludes, much like the kind you'd experience in one of his "Notes of Rest" sessions. Interview by Matt Croasmun.This episode was made possible in part by the generous support of the Tyndale House Foundation. For more information, visit tyndale.foundation.Show NotesClick here to learn more about Julian Reid's "Notes of Rest"Introduction: Evan Rosa"God has given us music so that above all it can lead us upwards. Music unites all qualities: it can exalt us, divert us, cheer us up, or break the hardest of hearts with the softest of its melancholy tones. But its principal task is to lead our thoughts to higher things, to elevate, even to make us tremble… The musical art often speaks in sounds more penetrating than the words of poetry, and takes hold of the most hidden crevices of the heart… Song elevates our being and leads us to the good and the true. If, however, music serves only as a diversion or as a kind of vain ostentation it is sinful and harmful." (Friedrich Nietzsche at 14 years old; see Friedrich Nietzsche: A Philosophical Biography by Julian Young; h/t Brain Pickings)Bringing together music and scriptureEngendering wonder and trust as a seedbed for a life of faithCreating space, the architecture that music createsWeekly liturgical practicesThe ends and uses of music in sacred spacesLiving in a tent, motel—a musical spiritual hotelScripture is like a cathedral or museum.Performance: "Thank You, Lord"Gratitude—the way we enter into hospitality, "what it means to be hosted by God"Hotel art—the artwork invites and calms rather than jarring and provokingCuriosity vs calmnessInvoking a different kind of responseSanitizing the PsalmsPerformance: "Give Me Jesus"Speaking to different registersAimed at an encounter with the living GodGraceProclamation: music and preachingTaking risks over the pulpitKarl Barth: "God tempts the church through God's absence."Kerygma: "proclamation"Performance: "Lord, Hear My Prayer" (Taize)Word and WaterThe metaphor of water utilized in "Notes of Rest"Black musical idiomsFinding the use of Contemporary Christian Music (CCM)Balm in GileadThe Hymns of Isaac Watts, colonizing, historical contextCombining musical genealogiesBraxton Shelly's Healing for the SoulImaginative fuel from the mysticsCistercian monastics: worshipping in silence and solitude; "a long-standing faith"Performance: "Lord, Hear My Prayer / Give Me Jesus" (Medley)Introduction (Evan Rosa)One of the most gripping and influential philosophers of the last 200 years once wrote:"God has given us music so that above all it can lead us upwards. Music unites all qualities: it can exalt us, divert us, cheer us up, or break the hardest of hearts with the softest of its melancholy tones. But its principal task is to lead our thoughts to higher things, to elevate, even to make us tremble… The musical art often speaks in sounds more penetrating than the words of poetry, and takes hold of the most hidden crevices of the heart… Song elevates our being and leads us to the good and the true. If, however, music serves only as a diversion or as a kind of vain ostentation it is sinful and harmful."That Friedrich Nietzsche, written when he was 14 years old.There is plenty of "vain ostentation" in popular music today, and certainly not excluding the music played in church.But the unitive depth and invitation into transcendence that music offers us of course pairs beautifully with scripture. And whatever else might have changed in Nietzsche's thinking, even at the end of his life in Twilight of the Idols, he suggested that "Without music life would be a mistake. The German imagines even God as a songster." And I say: Well, not just the German, but the human.In today's episode, Matt Croasmun welcomes Julian Reid, jazz pianist and producer, writer, and performer (not to mention Yale and Emory educated). You can hear his hip-hop infused jazz project The JuJu Exchange on episode 26 of For the Life of the World, when Julian joined us to talk about How Jazz Teaches us Faith and Justice. Today, Matt and Julian explore the way music and scripture can come together to create a sacred space. Extending metaphors of music as architecture and dwelling and spiritual experience as a river, Julian explains a recent project of his, "Notes of Rest," combining African-American spirituals with classical hymns for an experience of spiritual hospitality, gratitude, and proclamation of the Gospel into the full spectrum of human experience, in all its pain, frustration, frenzy, stillness, and joy.Throughout the conversation you'll hear Julian play along to accompany his points; he also graciously provided beautiful meditative interludes, much like the kind you'd experience in one of his "Notes of Rest" sessions.Thanks for listening.About Julian ReidJulian Reid is a Chicago-based jazz pianist and producer, writer, and performer (B.A. Yale University / M.Div. Emory University). The JuJu Exchange is a musical partnership also featuring Nico Segal (trumpet, Chance the Rapper; The Social Experiment) and Everett Reid—exploring creativity, justice, and the human experience through their hip-hop infused jazz. Their new 5-song project is called The Eternal Boombox. Julian's latest project is "Notes of Rest"—a spiritual mini-retreat that places meditations from the Bible on a bed of music, cultivating rest, contemplation, and creativity in all who will hear Jesus’ call.Production NotesThis podcast featured musician Julian Reid and biblical scholar Matt CroasmunEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Martin Chan, Nathan Jowers, Natalie Lam, and Logan LedmanA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give