

The Other 22 Hours
Michaela Anne, Aaron Shafer-Haiss
"Artistry flourishes in shared conversation."
Everyone struggles with self-doubt and motivation in their careers. The Other 22 Hours Podcast features conversations with renowned musicians and artists, sharing tools for resilience, helping you feel more inspired, connected, and confident in your creative journey.
Hosted by music producer Aaron Shafer-Haiss, and singer-songwriter Michaela Anne, these are artist-lead conversations - not your typical outsider journalist interviews.
Everyone struggles with self-doubt and motivation in their careers. The Other 22 Hours Podcast features conversations with renowned musicians and artists, sharing tools for resilience, helping you feel more inspired, connected, and confident in your creative journey.
Hosted by music producer Aaron Shafer-Haiss, and singer-songwriter Michaela Anne, these are artist-lead conversations - not your typical outsider journalist interviews.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Mar 12, 2025 • 55min
JD McPherson on the long game, a body of work, and Nick Lowe's advice.
JD McPherson is a singer-songwriter and guitar player who's put out records on Decca, Rounder and New West, toured or collaborated with Dan Auerbach, Nick Lowe, and Lucius, is the guitar player for Robert Plant & Allison Krauss, as well as opening the shows with his own band, and is the producer of the recently-announced Jessica Simpson (comeback?) record.. We talk to JD about all modes of touring - from bus to plane to our shared affinity for van and trailer, touring to experience different cultures and meet new people, the long game of building a body of work and the value of word of mouth, Tulsa Oklahoma, and the advice that Nick Lowe shared with him backstage.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:JD McPhersonEp 3 - The Milk Carton KidsNick LoweJP HarrisEp 73 - Edwin McCainSpike Leetourfood.usBobnet.rocksRobert Plant & Allison KraussWe Jam Econo docPaul AcklingTheo LawrenceKen PomeroyWilderadoEp 41 - Samantha CrainEp 80 - John MorelandBronchoClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Mar 5, 2025 • 45min
The War and Treaty on living history, intentionality, and roadmaps.
The War and Treaty are a Grammy nominated duo who have released 6 records and EPs, starting out with independent releases before moving on to Rounder and now Mercury/Universal Nashville. They are the first black duo to be nominated for duo of the year at both the CMA's and the ACM's, where they've also performed, as well as performing and/or collaborating with the likes of Zach Bryan, Dierks Bentley, Brothers Osborne, Jason Isbell, John Legend, and Chris Stapleton.We talk with them about the importance of letting your own art move you, knowing your place in the history that you are making currently, starting their own management company - and even signing other artists, giving yourself the grace permission to come undone, and a whole lot more.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:The War and TreatyBuddy MillerDon WasUniversal NashvilleJohn LewisNew Orleans Jazz FestClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Feb 19, 2025 • 47min
On Family Business: Robert Ellis, Leyla McCalla + Joe Henry
This is the 4th and final episode of our thematic mini-series, and this week we are looking at the ways some of our Patreon's favorite guests have found to balance their family lives and their creative lives - from reevaluating what a meaningful approach looks like as your family grows, or juggling family life while both parents are creatives (ala Robert Ellis), to touring with kids and understanding your place as a creative in the broader fabric of society (ala Leyla McCalla), or budgeting and optimizing your creative time while being the primary care taker (ala Joe Henry). If you want to hear our full conversations with each of these guests they are linked below, and you can find a playlist with more conversations touching on balacing family + creative life on our YouTube page (also linked below).Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:Ep 42 - Robert EllisEp 12 - Leyla McCallaEp 39 - Joe HenryClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Feb 5, 2025 • 44min
On Self Doubt: Madame Gandhi, Langhorne Slim + Ryan Miller (Guster)
This is episode 3 of our mini-series of conversations compiled around a different theme each episode. This week we look at all things self doubt: from imposter syndrome, to score keeping, doubt hiding behind a need for outside validation, or just classic doubt in your abilities, we touch on all of it with Madame Gandhi, Langhorne Slim, and Guster's Ryan Miller.You can find a link to our full conversations with each of them below, and playlists of other past conversations grouped by topic on our YouTube channel, also below.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:Ep 36 Madame GandhiEp 49 Langhorne SlimEp 56 GusterClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Jan 22, 2025 • 46min
On The Business of DIY: Jesse Boykins III, Laura Veirs, Joe Pug + BJ Barham (American Aquarium)
This is episode 2 of our mini-series of conversations compiled around a different theme each episode. This week we dive into the business of DIY, and stories of different artists that have built successful, sustainable careers outside of the major label, stereotypical "right" career path. We hear from Jesse Boykins III talk about leaving and standing up to Def Jam Records and Universal Publishing, Laura Veirs on owning her publishing throughout and starting her own label, the blue collar DIY sustainability that Joe Pug has mastered, and how BJ Barham (American Aquarium) has managed to build a six-figure DIY empire (both record sales/touring and merch)!You can find a link to our full conversations with each of them below, and playlists of other past conversations grouped by topic on our YouTube channel, also below.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:Jesse Boykins III - episode 67Laura Veirs - episode 44Joe Pug - episode 10BJ Barham - episode 7Click here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Jan 8, 2025 • 51min
On Failure: Rodney Crowell, Madi Diaz, Aaron Lee Tasjan.
This is episode 1 of a mini-series centered around a different theme each episode. This week we explore failure in it's many forms: enduring it, embracing it, overcoming it, learning from it - all from three different Grammy-nominated artist: Rodney Crowell, Madi Diaz, and Aaron Lee Tasjan - in that order. You can find a link to our full conversations with each of them below, and playlists of other past conversations grouped by topic on our YouTube channel, also below.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:Rodney Crowell - episode 16Madi Diaz - episode 77Aaron Lee Tasjan - episode 1Here is our YouTube channel, with playlists on various topics.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Dec 26, 2024 • 44min
Chuck Prophet on controlled chaos, learning by doing, and being well-adjusted.
Chuck Prophet has put out 17+ solo records, 10 records with his former rock band Green on Red, and has worked with Bruce Springsteen, Kim Richey, Kelly Willis, Alejandro Escovedo, and Tony Visconti, appeared on many late night shows, toured with Lucinda Williams, and more. We chat with Chuck about transitioning from being in a band to having a solo career, San Fransisco as inspiration, how major successes come out of the blue, learning by doing, songwriting as a self taught art form, the need for more danger in music, and a whole lot more.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:Chuck ProphetGreen on RedJules ShearChuck CloseAngelo PetragliaLarry GottleibKim RicheySound EmporiumThe Paradise LoungeThe AlbionDead KennedysJohn CunibertiAlan WattsClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Dec 18, 2024 • 1h 5min
James Vincent McMorrow on shelf life, space to fail, and culty connotations.
James Vincent McMorrow is a platinum-selling, billions-streaming singer-songwriter who has released records independently and via labels such as Nettwork and Columbia, work with Paul Epworth, Kenny Beats, Lil Silva, had his vocals featured on songs by Drake, and Kygo, in Game of Thrones, and numerous festivals. He also took 7 years off from touring to be with his growing family and recalibrate his relationship with the industry, which we talk about here at length, as well as an industry without stats, long shelf life for your creations, building something that matters, defining your own targets, having the space to fail, and much more.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:James Vincent McMorrowCity and ColourRoyal Albert HallYoung JesusThe Civil WarsFake Famous DocLankumJames BlakeNeil Young'On the Beach'DeftonesClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Dec 11, 2024 • 49min
Liz Longley on buying your art back, touring as self care, and wilderness.
Liz Longley has released 10+ records both independently and with labels such as Rounder Records, raised $150,000 on Kickstarter (the 4th most largest campaign by an independent artist at the time) to buy her finished album back from her former label, and has been critically acclaimed by Billboard, Newsweek, and Pop Matters. We talk to Liz about creators having the power in the music industry, touring as self care, time management with toddlers, balance, the wilderness, and more.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:Liz LongleyPaul Basile / Great ElkParlor in the RoundEp 78 - Tim EastonPaul MoakChatham RabbitsEp 39 - Joe HenryEp 60 - Lori McKennaEp 7 - BJ BarhamClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.

Dec 4, 2024 • 48min
Tommy Emmanuel on endless experimenting, genre non-conforming, and stage craft.
Tommy Emmanuel is a legendary acoustic guitar player from Australia, where he has received some of the nation's highest honors, won Grammy, ARIA, and IBMA awards (amongst others), released 27+ records on labels such as Sony and Columbia, and began touring at the age of 6. We talk to Tommy about his endless enthusiasm and drive to experiment that has kept him inspired and learning through his almost 65 year career, how he bucks genre traditions (and because of that, label constraints), being vulnerable with your audience, studying the art of stagecraft, and a whole lot more.Get more access and support this show by subscribing to our Patreon, right here.Links:Tommy EmmanuelCayamoEp 50 - Sierra HullMassey HallGroucho MarxEp 53 - Larry Campbell & Teresa Williams‘Classical Gas’ albumRandy GoodrumBarry GibbDave CobbRCA Studio AEp 51 - Steve PoltzEp 83 - Kevn KinneyClick here to watch this conversation on YouTube.Social Media:The Other 22 Hours InstagramThe Other 22 Hours TikTokMichaela Anne InstagramAaron Shafer-Haiss InstagramAll music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Become a subscribing member on our Patreon to gain more inside access including exclusive content, workshops, the chance to have your questions answered by our upcoming guests, and more.