
Politics with Michelle Grattan
The Conversation's Chief Political Correspondent Michelle Grattan talks politics with politicians and experts, from Capital Hill.
Latest episodes

Jun 9, 2016 • 20min
Nick Xenophon on his play for Senate power
Senator Nick Xenophon is the South Australian “vote magnet” making both the Coalition and Labor nervous, as he spreads his brand at this election. His probable success promises not just more Senate seats for the nascent party but a powerful role in the new Senate for its leader.
Xenophon tells Michelle Grattan he believes that while governments have a mandate to introduce legislation, the Senate has a mandate to scrutinise.
“I say that in the context that there are many hundreds of thousands of Australians that vote differently between the lower house and the upper house because under our Constitution, under our system of government, the Senate is there to represent the states.
“It’s also there under its proportional representation system to be a bulwark against excesses of executive power,” he says.

Jun 2, 2016 • 29min
Tony Abbott on his campaign role
Tony Abbott has been low key so far this election, spending much of his time campaigning in his own electorate, with some visits to MPs who invite him.
Speaking with Michelle Grattan, he plays up being part of the team. He admits staunch Liberals have issues with the superannuation changes but says “the point I keep making to them is that we cannot avoid tough decisions”, and does not expect the policy to change after the election.
On same-sex marriage he confirms that if the plebiscite was carried he would vote for the enabling legislation. By putting the question to the people “we’ve effectively said the people are sovereign on this matter rather than the parliament”.

Jun 2, 2016 • 44min
The Greens' fight for Batman and Wills
The Greens, who already hold the seat of Melbourne, are making a big play for two nearby Labor-held seats – Batman, held by David Feeney, and Wills, where the popular Kelvin Thomson is retiring. Labor is especially worried about Batman, where Feeney’s failure to declare his A$2.3 million house added to his already embattled position.
This week The Conversation spoke to Greens leader Richard Di Natale about the Greens' campaign and ambitions generally, including these two seats.
Di Natale said that if there were a minority Labor government and the Greens were in a balance-of-power situation, he would still hope for an agreement, despite Labor ruling out such an alliance. He indicated the Greens would press for concessions on policy rather than seeking a ministry.
The Conversation also interviewed the Greens candidate in Wills, Samantha Ratnam, and the Labor candidate Peter Khalil, as well as the Greens candidate for Batman Alex Bhathal. David Feeney declined an interview.

May 31, 2016 • 42min
The Indi Project
The battle for the Victorian seat of Indi is shaping up as a three-way contest. Independent Cathy McGowan is trying to fend off the former member Sophie Mirabella and the Nationals' Marty Corboy.
McGowan tells Michelle Grattan the election will come down to preferences.
“I’m hoping that the National Party people will consider giving me their second preference and I’m hoping that Liberal Party people … certainly the ones in Wodonga – don’t see their answer in the National Party and they will consider giving me their preferences,” she says.
In this special election podcast, Michelle Grattan interviews McGowan, Corboy, as well as the Greens' candidate Jenny O'Connor and Labor’s Eric Kerr. Sophie Mirabella was unwilling to be interviewed.

May 23, 2016 • 19min
Sam Dastyari on the ‘Bill Bus’
The Labor Party has been driving a campaign bus from Cairns to Canberra. On Sunday night senator Sam Dastyari, leader of the “Bill Bus”, told supporters at a Canberra pub they had raised enough money to extend its journey through to Melbourne and would be leaving the next morning.
After giving a speech to the faithful, Dastyari tells Michelle Grattan they have been getting a lot of local media in small towns and that the reception has been “quite positive”.
“The irony of all this is what is old is new. And what we’re really doing is taking on board some really 1950s/1960s great Labor campaigns, great political campaigns. This is how we campaigned. And why did we campaign this way? Because people felt engaged, people felt like they were part of it. It helped tell a story,” he says.
While warning Labor can’t afford to be complacent in any state or territory, Dastyari emphasises the importance of New South Wales and Queensland for Labor at this election.
“In 2010, we lost a bunch of Queensland seats and in 2013, we lost a bunch of New South Wales seats. If we’re not picking up the bulk of the seats we need to win government out of New South Wales and Queensland, we will not be forming government.”

May 16, 2016 • 35min
The Battle for New England
This is The Conversation’s first election podcast, where we visit the New South Wales seat of New England. The electorate is held by deputy prime minister and Nationals leader Barnaby Joyce, who is under challenge from former independent member Tony Windsor.
Joyce predicts the government will “take a haircut” at the election, and talks about New England becoming a net exporter of renewable energy in future years. Windsor says if there was a hung parliament he would not go into an alliance, as he did with the Gillard government, and is coy about where his vote would end up.

May 7, 2016 • 11min
Andrew Leigh on Labor’s budget reply
In response to the government’s pre-election budget, Labor’s Shadow Assistant Treasurer Andrew Leigh, a former professor of economics, describes an alternative economic plan.
Leigh tells Michelle Grattan that a Labor government would have delivered a budget that faced down Australia’s big economic challenges.
“They include declining living standards: income per capita in real net terms has declined 4% since the government came to office; flagging innovation, which has seen too few Australian firms develop ‘new to the world’ innovations; and rising inequality where the gap between rich and poor now is as high as it’s been in three-quarters of a century,” he says.

May 5, 2016 • 23min
In Conversation with Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull
On the cusp of calling the election, Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull sat down with Michelle Grattan to talk about the budget.
When the discussion turned to political trust, Turnbull said it’s critical to be very upfront about issues, to explain what the problems are, and to explain how you propose to resolve them.
“I think there is a gotcha culture in the media and perhaps in the political discourse overall where, for example, any change in policy is seen as a backflip or an admission of failure.”

May 4, 2016 • 11min
Mathias Cormann on the government's economic plan
Sleep is at a premium in Canberra this week. Finance Minister Mathias Cormann is one of those doing the post-budget heavy lifting, with 22 media interviews on Wednesday. He sat down with Michelle Grattan to discuss the government’s long-term economic plan.

May 3, 2016 • 7min
John Daley on the budget big picture
From the Parliament House lockup, Grattan Institute CEO John Daley joins Michelle Grattan to give an overall picture of the government’s pre-election budget.