What happens when a pastor trades the pulpit for a tech startup? In this episode, Martha welcomes back Alexander Lang, a former PCUSA pastor turned tech entrepreneur, to share his journey from church ministry to launching a business focused on fostering meaningful relationships. Alexander dives into his latest creative projects, including the Restorative Faith Podcast and his upcoming YouTube series, Kokoro, which draws inspiration from Mr. Rogers to address universal themes like trust, anxiety, and doubt, offering adults a space to feel seen, heard, and valued. Through the lens of Kokoro, he unpacks how theology and media intersect, blending a theology of love and acceptance with practical strategies for personal growth. Martha and Alexander also discuss the potential of platforms like YouTube and TikTok to transcend traditional church boundaries, highlighting how social media can transform modern faith communication and reach new audiences in powerful ways. Alexander Lang is a former PCUSA pastor who worked in church ministry for 20 years. He has since left the church to pursue a technology business that is designed to help people form meaningful relationships. Alex’s interests include independent film, electronic music and deep conversation with people who question, doubt and want to dig into the most complex issues we face as humans. When he’s not working on books, podcasts or the Restorative Faith Movement, Alex enjoys spending time with his wife and two sons.   Previous Episodes with Alex Lang: 21st Century Spirituality: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/spirituality-for-the-21st-century-rationalist-a-conversation-with-alexander-lang/ The Most Viral Article on Clergy Burnout: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/alex-lang/   Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!   Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode, co-hosts Martha Tatarnic and Loren Richmond Jr. reflect on the past season and share personal insights from their ministry journeys. Martha opens up about the challenges of transitioning back to ministry after a focused writing sabbath, touching on key themes like clergy mental health, food insecurity, and economic pressures that have shaped the season’s conversations. Loren and Martha celebrate a major milestone—200 episodes—reflecting on the podcast’s beginnings as a COVID project and its growth into a valued resource for church leaders. They highlight standout episodes, discussing topics such as the evolving landscape of church leadership, the importance of diversity and inclusion, and the benefits of team ministry in building strong faith communities. Throughout the episode, Loren and Martha stress the podcast’s mission to provide companionship and support for those navigating the complexities of ministry.   Episodes Referenced: Pastoral Health Roundtable: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/pastoral/ Elizabeth Schrader Polczer: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/elizabeth-schrader-polczer-on-rethinking-mary-magdalene-part-1/ Yolanda Solomon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/solomon/ Chuck DeGroat: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/the-primal-wound/ Casey Tygrett: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/casey-tygrett-on-why-remembering-matters/ Grace Ji-Sun Kim: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/grace-ji-sun-kim-on-making-church-less-white/ Allison Milbank: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/alison-milbank-on-why-small-and-local-might-be-the-churchs-way-forward/     Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!   Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

What can the wider church learn from the rich history and theology of Black Christianity? In this episode of the Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr. interviews Dr. Walter Strickland, a theologian and pastor, about his faith journey, spiritual practices, and the history of Black Christianity in America. Drawing from his book Swing Low, Dr. Strickland explores the anchors of Black Christianity, the impact of the Great Migration, and the tension between social engagement and gospel proclamation during the Civil Rights Movement. The conversation highlights lessons the white church can learn from African-American Christianity, the evolution of Black theology, and the relevance of the gospel in addressing societal issues and political complexities.   Walter R. Strickland II (PhD, University of Aberdeen) is associate professor of systematic and contextual theology at Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary. He has coauthored or contributed to several books, including For God So Loved the World: A Blueprint for Kingdom Diversity. He is a host of the White Horse Inn podcast and founder of Cultural Engagement and Aptree Learning.   Episodes Referenced: Pastoral Health Roundtable: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/pastoral/   Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you! Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this conversation, Reverend Jocelyn Jones shares her journey of faith, trauma, and healing, emphasizing the importance of community and therapy in overcoming personal challenges. She discusses her experiences in ministry, the barriers women face, and the significance of understanding one's value beyond societal definitions of success and failure. The conversation highlights the need for spiritual practices and wise counsel to stay centered in God's guidance while passionately sharing one's ministry. In this conversation, Rev. Jocelyn Jones discusses the importance of effectively communicating and 'selling' one's ministry, the challenges of valuing one's time and services, and the significance of setting boundaries by learning to say no. She also shares insights on guiding others in their ministry journeys, reflections on leadership, and her hopes for a future of Christianity that emphasizes healing and love over harm. Rev. Jocelyn is an author, speaker, and entrepreneur. Jocelyn's background as a journalist, executive director of a nonprofit, and community leader allows her to connect with people from all walks of life.  She received her bachelor's degree from the University of Iowa in journalism.  After receiving her B.A., she earned her master's degree in social work and her master's degree in theological studies.  Jocelyn published her first book in 2019, Breaking the Power of the Mask. Jocelyn is an ordained minister and the President of Faith on the Journey, a Christian Counseling company specializing in grief and trauma.  She is a Master Facilitator with the Trauma Healing Institute and the founder of the Women in the Ministry which helps women to start, grow, and sustain transformative ministries that change the world.  Website: jocelynjjones.com Social: IG: @jocelynjjones             FB: @connectwithJocelyn             Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@MeetRevJocelyn Free Ministry Launch Starter Kit at sisterstartyourministry.com   Episodes Referenced: Casey Tygrett: https:/https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/casey/ Kinsie Tate: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/restore-clergy/   Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you! Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

What if the key to a deeper relationship with God lies in the way we remember? In this episode, spiritual director and author Casey Tygrett joins us to explore how memory shapes our identity and faith journey. Together, we discuss how embracing spiritual practices that center on intimacy, rather than punishment, can help us unlearn harmful narratives about God. Casey shares insights on remembering as a path to healing, especially in addressing generational trauma that influences our beliefs. We also delve into the role of lament in processing painful memories and the wisdom we gain from them. Finally, we reflect on the Lord’s Supper as a symbol of unity and love, and why pastors must prioritize wellness for the health of their ministry.   Casey Tygrett (D.Min.) is a pastor and spiritual director who has lived in the spiritual formation conversation for the last two decades. He is the author of Becoming Curious: A Spiritual Practice of Asking Questions, The Practice of Remembering: Uncovering the Place of Memories in Our Spiritual Life and The Gift of Restlessness: A Spirituality for Unsettled Seasons. He is passionate about the soul health of leaders and the recovery of the transformational way of Jesus that is spiritual formation. He, his wife Holley, and daughter Bailey live in Chicago, IL. www.caseytygrett.com @caseytygrett   Episodes Referenced: Casey Tygrett: https:/https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/casey/ Kinsie Tate: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/restore-clergy/   Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you! Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this milestone 200th episode of the Future Christian Podcast, hosts Loren Richmond Jr. and Martha Tatarnic celebrate with a roundtable discussion on clergy wellness, joined by Brian Davis, and Kinsie Tate. Together, they explore the challenges and opportunities surrounding pastoral health, sharing insights and personal experiences from their diverse backgrounds. The conversation delves into the importance of community, the performative nature of clergy life, and the challenges of burnout and mental health. The panelists share personal experiences and insights on navigating success and failure in ministry, the impact of competition among clergy, and the systemic issues facing the church today. They also discuss practical steps and resources for clergy to support their mental, emotional, and spiritual well-being, emphasizing the need for vulnerability and connection in ministry. Rev. Kinsie Tate is the Founder and Executive Director of Restore Clergy, a nonprofit organization whose mission is to support clergy with programs that improve wellness to cultivate faithful and sustainable ministry. She is a Licensed Professional Clinical Counselor and has a private practice where she has facilitated growth and transformation for clients for over a decade. She completed her Master of Divinity at Phillips Theological Seminary and was ordained in the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) in 2007. She served as an associate minister for 3 years prior to returning to complete her Master of Education in Applied Behavioral Studies at Oklahoma City University in 2010. She became a Licensed Professional Counselor in Oklahoma in 2012 and a Licensed Professional Clinical Counselor in California in 2021. She was certified as a Truce Coach in 2022. She lives in California with her spouse, who is United Methodist Clergy serving in a local congregation, and their 3 school age children.  FB: https://www.facebook.com/restoreclergy/ Insta: https://www.instagram.com/restoreclergy/ website: www.restoreclergy.com Brian Davis has been leading worship in the Denver-metro area for the last 25 years and has built relationships with dozens of churches all over the city. Authenticity and empathy have been hallmarks of Brian’s leadership, and his intention is to use these attributes to coach other worship leaders and inspire greater creativity and deeper spiritual practice in the local church. Brian has three daughters, and he and his wife, Jess, live in Lakewood, CO. He also serves part-time as the Worship Arts Director at New Denver Church. Insta: https://www.instagram.com/greenroomleaders/ website: https://www.greenroomleaders.com/   Episodes Referenced: Martha Tatarnic: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/why-gather-with-martha-tatarnic/https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-himxq-13e0aa9 Kinsie Tate: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/restore-clergy/ Brian Davis: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/the-pressure-to-perform-as-a-pastor-with-paul-romig-leavitt-and-brian-davis/   Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.    Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!   Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

What if the core problem in most humans these days isn't that we think too highly of ourselves, but rather that we live with an underlying sense of worthlessness, alienation, and disillusionment? In this episode, Chuck DeGroat joins the pod to talk about his book Healing What's Within and the concept of Internal Family Systems theory. Sharing from his  background as a therapist and pastor, DeGroat explains the importance of befriending our different parts and becoming aware of how they show up in different situations. DeGroat emphasizes the significance of connecting with our true selves and living from that core. Exploring the classic "fall" narrative in Genesis 3, DeGroat proposes the theological concept of a primal wound and the importance of understanding the underlying story and biography behind harmful behavior. He emphasizes the need for pastors and church leaders to have support groups and close friendships to navigate the challenges they face.  Chuck DeGroat is a professor of pastoral care and Christian spirituality at Western Theological Seminary in Holland, Michigan, where he also serves as the founding executive director of the clinical mental health counseling program. He is a licensed therapist, spiritual director, author, retreat leader speaker, and faculty member with the Soul Care Institute. As a therapist, he specializes in navigating issues of abuse and trauma, pastoral (and leadership) health, and doubt and dark nights on the faith journey. He trains clergy in handling issues of abuse and trauma, conducts pastor and planter assessments, and facilitates church consultations and investigations of abuse. Before transitioning to training and forming pastors, Chuck served as a pastor in Orlando and San Francisco. He and his wife, Sara, have been married for 30 years and have two adult daughters. Book Buy Link Chuck’s Website Chuck’s IG Chuck’s X   Episodes Referenced: Chuck DeGroat: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/chuck-degroat-on-when-narcissism-comes-to-church/ Yolanda Solomon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/solomon/     Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you! Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

What if common worship practices are elevating our anxiety rather than centering us in the peace of God? In this conversation, J. Michael Jordan joins the show to talk about the intersection of faith and mental health, particularly in relation to anxiety. He explores the historical context of the anxiety-relief repentance model in revivalist movements and its impact on worship practices. He emphasizes the need for a more holistic and sustainable approach to faith that goes beyond the cycle of anxiety, repentance, and relief. Jordan emphasizes the importance of a guiding story outside of our own experiences and the value of ritual in worship. He also discusses practical aspects of worship, such as lighting and technology, and how they can either draw us deeper into the worship experience or distract us from it. Rev. Dr. Michael Jordan (PhD, Drew University) is professor of theology at Houghton University. From 2002-2009, he was the pastor of Exton Community Baptist Church in Exton, PA. From 2013-2024, he served as Dean of the Chapel at Houghton before moving over to teach full-time this fall.  Over the summer, he is the staff chaplain at Camp-of-the-Woods, a Christian camp in the Adirondack Mountains. Mike’s wife Jill is a mathematician who also teaches at Houghton; they live just off campus and together are raising their five children: Grace, Jack, Lucy, Gabriel, and Anne. In his spare time, Mike enjoys singing, crossword puzzles and distance running and is a rabid fan of Philadelphia professional and college sports. Facebook @RevDrMichaelJordan michael.jordan@houghton.edu theothermichaeljordan.substack.com   Episodes Referenced: Andrew Root: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-himxq-13e0aa9   Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you! Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Jeff Keuss, a seasoned Professor and director at Seattle Pacific University, reveals surprising insights about young adults and their views on churches. He emphasizes that they see these institutions as vital agents of social change. Young adults desire meaningful communities that tackle real-world issues, embracing inclusion and mentorship. Keuss challenges traditional membership models, advocating for churches as resource centers that promote open dialogue and diverse voices. His research offers a hopeful future for faith, rooted in collaboration and genuine connection.

How do we make church less "white," and more welcoming and inclusive of different non-white cultures, perspectives, and persons? In this conversation, Grace Ji-Sun Kim discusses her book When God Became White: Dismantling Whiteness for More Just Christianity and the need to challenge the white, male image of God in Christianity. She shares her personal experiences with racism and explores the impact of the image of a white Jesus on the perception of race and power in the church. Dr. Kim suggests embracing non-white, non-gendered images of God in worship and liturgy as a way to promote inclusivity and challenge racism. She also emphasizes the importance of recognizing God's presence in other cultures and religions. Dr. Grace Ji-Sun Kim received her MDiv from Knox College at the University of Toronto and her PhD from the University of Toronto. She is professor of theology at Earlham School of Religion. Dr. Kim is an internationally renowned lecturer and the acclaimed author or editor of 24 books, including When God Became White, Surviving God, and Invisible. Among many other accolades, Englewood review of books listed Invisible as one of the 12 important theology books of 2021, and listed Kim as one of 10 important women theologians that you should be reading. She is also on the list of the top 10 writers shaping our movement put together by the Center for Progressive Renewal.    Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you! Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant