This week, Mike and Jude are joined by Dr. Susan Shirk, Founding Chair of the 21st Century China Center at the University of California, San Diego and the author of Overreach: How China Derailed its Peaceful Rise (Oxford University Press, 2022), which examines the evolution of China’s domestic and foreign policy over the last 15 years. The conversation begins by examining steps taken toward political decentralization and economic liberalization under Hu Jintao—and the reversal of these trends under Xi Jinping. Next, they discuss Xi’s governance style and the shortcomings of loyalty-based political systems. The discussion then turns to the recent G7 summit in Hiroshima and China’s reaction to its outcomes. After assessing U.S. China policy during the Trump and Biden administrations, they then consider how Xi might respond to renewed diplomatic overtures. After a discussion of the risks of U.S. overreaction to Beijing’s policies, they conclude with reflections on what—if any—actions can be taken to stabilize the deteriorating U.S.-China relationship.

Susan Shirk, a research professor at UC San Diego and former Deputy Assistant Secretary of State, shares her expertise on the evolution of U.S.-China relations. She discusses key diplomatic shifts from past administrations and analyzes the pessimistic sentiment regarding political change under Xi Jinping. Shirk also highlights the importance of diplomacy for future relations and explores potential internal conflicts within the Communist Party. Her personal insights into China’s elite politics provide a compelling view on the changing landscape.