In this engaging discussion, Sarah Cox, an investigative journalist, and Sarah Dubois, a professor and animal welfare advocate, tackle the ethical dilemmas of wildlife management. They explore the rivet popper hypothesis, emphasizing biodiversity's critical role in ecosystems. Personal stories highlight the struggles of species like the spotted owl amidst logging threats and cormorant overpopulation. The conversation underscores the importance of compassion in conservation practices, challenging listeners to rethink the value of all life and the implications of lethal intervention in nature.