The dangers of climate change are “no longer over the horizon.” Humanity may soon pass the “point of no return.” These are the phrases U.N. Secretary-General Antonio Guterres used to describe what he called an “utterly inadequate” global response to rising temperatures. But if we were to decisively act, and restructure our global economy with the climate in mind, who would shoulder the burden? Or should our collective focus orient more toward humans’ capacity for adaptation?   Podcast: Arguing in favor of the motion are Bjorn Lomberg and Michael Shellenberger. Arguing against the motion is Kaveh Madani and Michele Wucker. Emmy award-winning journalist John Donvan moderates.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Michele Wucker, author of *The Gray Rhino* and *You Are What You Risk*, dives into the concept of gray rhinos—obvious yet overlooked risks—especially focusing on climate change. She draws comparisons between gray rhinos and black swans, emphasizing the urgent need to address impending threats. Wucker discusses the societal factors affecting our perception of risk and how cultural differences shape responses. She also reflects on the pandemic as a gray rhino, highlighting the lessons learned for future preparedness.

Join Michele Wucker, internationally bestselling author of 'Grey Rhino,' as she dives into the neglected threats we often overlook. She clarifies the grey rhino metaphor, emphasizing its vital implications for risk management and Chinese policy. Discover how psychological biases like optimism can cloud our judgment and learn to recognize market signals and sentiments. Michele also explores the balance between conscious and unconscious decision-making while sharing insights on how our personal values shape our understanding of risk.