In this enlightening discussion, Lydia Pelot-Hobbs, an assistant professor at the University of Kentucky, delves into her book, which explores Louisiana's staggering history of mass incarceration. She highlights the intersection of economic forces, systemic racism, and grassroots activism that has shaped the state's penal landscape. The conversation touches on the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, the role of policing in New Orleans, and the vital need for transformative change. Lydia also discusses the shift from reform to abolition, emphasizing the importance of addressing deep-rooted social inequities.