“Did you have integrity today?”

That’s the question that Steve Carter, author, podcaster, and former lead teaching pastor of Willow Creek Community Church, pictured his son asking him when allegations of sexual harassment against Bill Hybels emerged. Carter realized he couldn’t go “play church.” He had to take the allegations seriously and act with integrity, which, for him, looked like resigning.

On this episode of Being Human, Cuss and Carter discuss what it looks like to have integrity when mentors and institutions fail us. They talk about the heartbreak of losing beloved communities, navigating relationships when people feel betrayed, and how difficult it is to see broken systems when inside them.

Carter shares how he has dealt with the weight of being misunderstood, the way some of his highest values were wielded against him, and what it was like to deal with public loss and accusation as an Enneagram Three. He and Cuss talk about the power of the resurrection and the two Greek words that became an anchor for Carter. And they discuss what propelled Carter to write Grieve, Breathe, Receive—a stunning memoir on grief and healing that recounts Carter leaving Willow Creek Church, entering a wilderness season, and enduring loss upon loss upon loss, from income and reputation to precious family members and more.

Resources mentioned in this episode include:

Luke: Interpretation: A Bible Commentary for Teaching and Preaching by Fred B. Craddock
Steve Carter
Craft & Character with Steve Carter
Grieve, Breathe, Receive: Finding a Faith Strong Enough to Hold Us by Steve Carter
The Thing Beneath the Thing: What's Hidden Inside (and What God Helps Us Do About It) by Steve Carter
Willow Creek Community Church
“Managing Leadership Anxiety: Yours and Theirs”
“Cadet Prayer”
Annie F. Downs
Ira Glass
Camino De Santiago
“What Is a Verbatim?”
Compassion International
“Welcoming Practice”
The Worst James Harden Flops

“Being Human with Steve Cuss” is a production of Christianity Today

Executive Produced by Erik Petrik and Mike Cosper

Produced and Edited by Matt Stevens

Associate Producers: McKenzie Hill, Raed Gilliam, and Abby Perry

Theme song by Dan Phelps

Original Music by Andy Gullahorn

Mix Engineer: Kevin Morris

Graphic Design: Amy Jones

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