Guy Stagg, a writer who embarked on a grueling pilgrimage to Jerusalem, shares his thrilling journey through perilous terrains, including a near-drowning incident in a Swiss river. He reflects on how this adventure transformed into a spiritual pilgrimage despite his atheism. Harry Mount, editor of The Oldie, joins to discuss his fascination with church architecture, revealing how his agnostic perspective still draws him to sacred spaces. They explore the emotional resonance of rituals and the complex relationship between spirituality and skepticism.