Do most Palestinians want their own state in the West Bank and Gaza, one that co-exists with the state of Israel? Is the conflict between Israel and Palestinians primarily about territory and the solution therefore simply to trade territory for peace?

For many years, as an advisor to Israel's top leaders and member of its parliament, Einat Wilf thought so.

Then she started to listen deeply to what Palestinians were saying, and what she heard stunned her. What Palestinians wanted was a land to themselves so they could return to the homes their families once occupied in Israel proper. What they didn't want was a Jewish state.

This discovery, coupled with extensive research into the century-long history, left Einat with a dramatically different view of the conflict. Palestinians' dream of "return" and the world's support for this dream constituted as big an obstacle to peace as Israeli settlements in the West Bank.

Engaging with this possibility may be painful, but it opens new possibilities for long-term peace in the region. If Israel and the United states take Einat's story seriously, they will approach the conflict dramatically differently than they have been doing for decades.

**Key takeaways**

4:00 Why Einat believed that the conflict was simply about territory
9:39 The purpose and flaws of constructive ambiguity
16:00 The shock and meaning of the Second Intifada
19:00 Listening deeply to Palestinians and taking seriously what they say they want
22:30 The settlements are Israel's most wasteful project
28:30 The Jews want a state. The Arabs want the Jews to not have a state
31:00 What the Arabs of Gaza did and didn't do when they finally controlled the territory
37:30 Why Israel's Labor Party declined
40:30 When Arabs say two states, do they mean two Palestinian states?
44:00 A clarifying question to a Palestinian student reveals a great deal
45:00 The one question Israeli negotiators should ask before entering the room
50:00 No refugees anywhere else in the world have had a "right of return"
54:00 Amiel's reflections

**Resources**

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Episode 222 - The Dog Shogun