Conversations with Bill Kristol Jonathan Karl on Trump’s Retribution Presidency
Oct 28, 2025
Jonathan Karl, a veteran political journalist and author of 'Retribution,' discusses the unique dynamics of Trump's second presidency, highlighting how personal experiences and courtroom trials shape his approach to power and loyalty. Karl emphasizes retribution as a driving theme, influencing Trump's strategy and reshaping his team. He details the impact of assassination attempts on Trump's resolve, the evolving role of allies like Elon Musk and J.D. Vance, and the uncertainties that lie ahead in a transformed political landscape.
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Stronger Comeback Than Expected
- Trump returned from exile far stronger than his first term, consolidating control of the Republican Party and governing with greater force.
- Jonathan Karl argues this comeback and increased power are the campaign's defining surprise and consequence.
Retribution Targets Institutions Too
- Retribution is broader than punishing prosecutors; it targets former allies and institutional guardrails.
- Karl says Trump seeks loyalists over expertise to prove he was right and centralize power.
Humiliating New York Courthouse Experience
- Karl recounts Trump's humiliating New York trial experiences, including sitting through testimony in a dilapidated courthouse.
- That courthouse ordeal became a searing personal grievance fueling Trump's desire for revenge.
