Maiden Mother Matriarch with Louise Perry

The gay rights movement got it wrong - Julie Bindel, Matthew Vines & Ronan McCrea | Maiden Mother Matriarch Episode 177

Dec 21, 2025

Guest

In this thought-provoking discussion, Ronan McCrea, a constitutional law professor, critiques the fragility of recent gay rights wins. Julie Bindel, a journalist and activist, shares her feminist insights on the effects of queer activism on lesbians. Meanwhile, Matthew Vines, an advocate for same-sex relationships within Christianity, emphasizes the need for moderate strategies in the movement. The trio explores complex issues like the tension between liberation and respectability, the implications of demographic shifts, and the risks posed by radical activism.

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INSIGHT

Gay Rights Rode A Broader Sexual Revolution

The gay rights revolution largely rode the wave of broader secular sexual liberalization rather than arising independently.
That makes gains vulnerable if wider cultural currents reverse or shift away from expressive individualism.

INSIGHT

Separate Acceptance From Decline In Faith

Matthew Vines agrees acceptance of gay people grew as societies secularized, but he wants that acceptance without decline in Christianity.
He urges separating gay acceptance from wholesale cultural decline so both can coexist.

ANECDOTE

Coming Out In A Hostile Community

Julie Bindel recalls coming out in a working-class community where 'lesbian' was the worst word imaginable.
She credits activist visibility and women's liberation for opening space for lesbians to be accepted later on.

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We have seen an extraordinary change in attitudes towards gay and lesbian people over the last half century in the West. Within living memory, homosexuality was criminalised. Now, same-sex couples can get married and share custody of children. This is nothing short of a moral revolution.

Plenty of progressives think, not only that this change was inevitable, but also that further liberalisation is inevitable. My guests today are not so sure.

They note that, for the first time in a long time, younger people on average are less accepting of homosexuality than are slightly older people. Perhaps this is a result of immigration patterns. Perhaps it's a result of strategic errors made by activists. I'm joined by three people who all agree that something has gone wrong, although they disagree – subtly – on exactly how and why.

Ronan McCrea is professor of constitutional and European law at University College London and the author of 'The End of the Gay Rights Revolution: How Hubris and Overreach Threaten Gay Freedom.'

Matthew Vines the the Founder and Executive Director of The Reformation Project and the author of 'God and the Gay Christian: The Biblical Case in Support of Same-Sex Relationships.'

And Julie Bindel is a journalist, broadcaster, author, and the co-founder and co-director of The Lesbian Project.

All of these guests share a concern that the wins of the gay rights movement are very fragile. There is a very real possibility that we will look back on the early twenty-first century as an historical blip – a brief moment of victory that was squandered. We ask how that fate might be avoided.

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