Bloomberg Washington Correspondents Joe Mathieu and Kailey Leinz deliver insight and analysis on the latest headlines from the White House and Capitol Hill, including conversations with influential lawmakers and key figures in politics and policy. On this edition, Joe and Kailey speak with:
- Ret. Gen. Wesley Clark, former Supreme Allied Commander Europe of NATO, about the ongoing conflict in Israel.
- Bloomberg Politics Contributors Rick Davis and Jeanne Sheehan Zaino about what's next for Congress now that a new Speaker of the House has been elected.
- Palm Beach Country State Attorney Dave Aronberg about the legal challenges former President Donald Trump is facing.
- Wall Street Journal's Paul Beckett about the continued to efforts to secure the release of Evan Gershkovich from Russian prison.
Full Transcript:
You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch us live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app, or listen on demand wherever you get your podcast. The Democratic Leader in the House calls on the new speaker to take shutdown off the table, and Israel conducts raids in Gaza to prepare for the next phase. Welcome to the fastest show in politics with twin leads this day in Washington. After the new Speaker was installed and Hamas now claims Israeli raids have killed almost fifty hostages. We'll talk about the next steps in Israel and the threat posed by Iran. Coming up with retired Army General Wesley Clark, a former Supreme Allied Commander for Europe, with analysis today from our signature panel. They're both back with us. Bloomberg Politics contributors Rick Davis and Gdi Shanzano will be with us for the hour to distill a lot of information from the past twenty five four hours here in Washington. A bit later this hour, a special conversation with the Secretary of the Treasury Jennet Yellen, is with us today in our offices at Bloomberg in Washington. Our bureau chief Peggy Collins will be conducting an interview across the platforms here, the radio, the satellite, and YouTube coming up in just about a half hour's time. So you want to stay with us for an important conversation ahead as we begin on Capitol Hill now, and welcome General Wesley Clark to the conversation. It's good to see you, General, I know you're on Capitol Hill as you join us today from the Russell Rotunda to talk with Senators about threats posed by Iran and our policy towards Iran. I'd like to start by asking you though about the urgency around a supplemental budget request that now there is a new speaker, there's going to be some action on this. In your thoughts on how quickly and what is needed for Israel now, Well, we need the full request that the administration's made, We need it passed as rapperly as possible. And let's not forget it's not just Israel, it's also Ukraine. The two are linked. Russia and Iran are strategic partners, and you can be sure that Vladimir Putin is really happy to see what's going on in Israel. How much he had to do with it, Maybe we won't know for a while, but we know Iran had a lot to do with it. We have to understand that this Both actions are threats to democracy, it's the international order, the rule of law in the world today, and of course obviously to our business community internationally. So we have to keep both in mind when need to get that those appropriations passed immediately. Well, there does seem to be an appetite for supporting Israel in this case general. But there is an argument overfunding for Ukraine, and I know that the Republican Conference in the House is looking to bring an Israel only bill to the floor. What do you make of this argument? Sixty billion dollars for Ukraine with some members saying not another dollar. But the president, as you just put it, is trying to link the two together as a matter of national security. You see continuity between these two requests. They are linked together. Vladimir Putin is working with Iran, Iran's working with Putin. Yes, they're linked, but also understand this, that's sixty billion dollars for Ukraine. Most of that money doesn't go to Ukraine. That money goes to the United States. That's keeping and building up our industrial base to face the challenges of the Middle East, to face future challenges in NATO, and of course to face the challenge of China. We've let our industrial base, our military industrial base, deteriorate over the last thirty years since the end of the Cold War. We allowed a wholesale consolidation of defense industries. We reduced the rates of supply that we need of everything. Is this sort of half step, We've got to put that money into our own base. The appropriations we've already given to Ukraine. That money went to American firms. We just gave them a bunch of old equipment, old ammunition. We need to keep that system alive and strengthen it for the challenges ahead. That's why putting Ukraine in that appropriations bill is so important. Well, there's so much to talk about here general. We talk about the DIB here on the program, the defense industrial base that you're referring to. This goes for Israel as well, And I think that's your point, right. If we're going to be making missiles to replenish the Iron Dome, for instance, we do not have a manufacturing chain, according to companies like Raytheon to make them fast enough. How do we accelerate that process? Does this supplemental request? Do it supply and demand put the money into it. The companies will respond, but without that funding, No, if they can't hire the people, invest in the capital goods that are necessary create the supply chaange. No, they have to have contracts, and these are multi year contracts procurement contracts by the Defense Department, and that requires a funding. So it's very simple, and it's if you don't do it now, who knows what's going to happen in twenty four, twenty five, twenty twenty six, twenty seven with Taiwan. So all of this is linked. You can't artificially separate it. Well, are you hearing that message received on Capitol Hill today? I trust you're talking with members of both parties. I know you're briefing senators today on our Iran policy. What do they say to you about this matter, the supplemental request and the need for a more streamlined and enhanced manufacturing chain. Well, I think they're all generally in support of this. In the United States Senate, the question is the House, and there's a lot of let's say, misunderstanding in the House about what the funding for Ukraine actually does and why it's needed. And hopefully this can become something that can be corrected by information and not just sort of a partisan tagline. But the big thing up here today is Iran and what we're going to do about Iran. You know, we've tried for forty years to work with this government in Iran. We've pulled on it, pushed on it, we've appeased it, we've patted it on the back, we've sanctioned it, we've threatened it. Nothing changes the direction of this Iranian government. They use terror and murder at home and abroad. They want regional dominance. They've destroyed the state of Lebanon. They've built a huge military complex and they've forward positioned it through his Bilah ready to attack Israel. Look, this crisis in Hamas brings this to a head. Can't appease this government in Iran. It's time to let the Iranian people have a government that represents them. And that means we, the United States, stage and our allies need to delegitimize the Iyatolas, get rid of them in international organizations, cut off their access to funding, sanction individually, get after their families, stop this government from having control over its people. Doesn't take a war, don't want an invasion. But if we keep going the way we're going, Iran is going to provoke a war in the region. And that's the day. Well, I'd like to ask you more about that. Let me first ask you about the Biden administration's repeated message that there is no actual evidence that Iran was directly involved in or helped plan or fund the Hamas terror attack. Do you need to see that evidence or is that kind of missing the point in this conversation. You're pointing to a long history that the administration is also acknowledged, but without that evidence to put the two together, the presidents seems to be a bit tied up on this. Do you think, well, I think it's I think it's what the administration's appetite is for acting in many different directions at once, and what the capacity is Washington typically is a one crisis at a time town. And you know, we've got a crisis right now. We're worried about what Israel will do in Gaza, will they have the support they need? What about his law and what I'm suggesting is you've got to go to the source, and the source is Iran. Now is it the immediate source? Did the Iranians tell the Hamas people on this specific day, I want you to go out this specific gate, come in with these paragliders, kill these people. No, probably not, But we do know have evidence that they trained a bunch of Palestinian fighters as late as September. We know there are meetings that have been held. Do we know what's said in those meetings? Well, not at the unclassified level, and maybe we don't even know at the most secret level. It's a question of how the administration sees its way through the crisis. And what I'm suggesting is that you have to be able to do more than one thing at a time. You've got Ukraine, that's a critical at a critical state right now. They need sustainment and they're facing a really tough Russian attack. In the northeast, You've got Israel and Gaza, and then you've got the region, and so in the region you have to understand the source of these tensions. It is Iran. And there's nothing like a crisis to bring on a path to a resolution. And in this case the resolution is to delegitimate that government in Tehran. There's talk about a second or third front opening. I know that's a great fear of the administration and the Pentagon general, But when you look around, we've already seen incursions repeatedly to the north. We've seen attacks against US military installations in Iraq and Syria. We've seen an American warship intercept cruise missiles from Yemen. Are the second and third fronts already hot? Is this already happening? Well, let's put it this way. They're warming it up. But I don't think the decision has been made by the Ayatolas to really open up the northern front yet. It's it's nuisances right now. Yeah, they're killing people, they're firing, but they haven't really committed. They want to wait and see what Israel is able to do in Gaza, whether it's so deeply enmeasure in Gaza that it can't defend itself from the north, whether the whole world turns against it because of the need to bring heavy firepower in an urban area to dislodge Hamas, if they can bring world opinion totally against it, isolate the United States and Israel. If they think the Israelis can't protect themselves from all three directions at once, then maybe they will unleash his blow. And they haven't made that decision yet, as we can tell publicly. General, while you're with us, I want to ask you about the matter of military readiness in the blockade on military promotions in the Senate. You might have even spoken with Tommy Tubberville today, but there's a new effort that Democrats are making to send a resolution to the Rules Committee that would allow three hundred plus promotions that have been held up to all go to the floor at one time. Would you support that movement? Is it set a bad precedent? Oh? I think it's essential at this point. Look, Senator TULLVERRLL has made his point. Everybody understands where he stands, what he stands for, that he's a man who's willing to fight for what he believes in. Okay, enough is enough. Let's get on with getting these military leaders and their families and their right positions and preparing for the challenges that are on our doorstep right now. There's no time to waste on this. Is it impacting our readiness? There's no doubt about it. Have you talked to Tommy Tubberville to let him know your thoughts. Well, I haven't talked to him on this. No, I'm one of many in the retired general officer ranks who's watching this very anxiously. I'd be delighted if he would call me and ask me for some his assistance or advice on it. He's got to back his way out, and he hasn't been willing to do that. But you know, he's a senator. He's do his respect, and he has the right to put a hold on nominations. But enough's enough. Let's get on with the business of the United States government. You've been generous with your time today. General. I wonder lastly, as you're speaking with senators, are you also talking to the administration about policy toward Iran, next step, sanctions, whatever you think the next step should be. Well, I talk to anybody who will listen on this. This is a looming crisis that we've seen coming for some time. And you know, there's an odd thing about Iran. When things are quiet and they're not attacking our troops and there's diplomacy going on, people say, well, don't worry, so much about it. Us don't shake the tree, and then when there's a crisis, people say, oh, this is a crisis. This is no time to reach in to change the policy. And so we never seem to want to move past what's been forty years of fruitless efforts one way or another to engage with this Iranian regime. It is time to recognize that this is an illegitimate regime and get it out of international legitimacy. General Wesley Clark, we appreciate the time and the insights today on Bloomberg. Thank you for joining us. This is Bloomberg Sound On. I'm Joe, Matthew and Washington. As we assemble our panel here the day after we got a speaker. Rick Davis and Genie Shanzino are with us now, Bloomberg Politics Contributor's great to have you both here. Genie, what's your thought about what we just heard? Because the General sounded a lot like Rick Davis, to be honest with regard to Iran. This is, of course a man who ran for president as a Democrat. Is there a daylight between what he's saying and what we're hearing from Joe Biden? Yeah, I mean it's a fascinating conversation because I do think there is a divide in the Democratic Party on this, and there has been for some time. You know, we can go back to Barack Obama's approach to Iran, but you can go back even further, and I think he is echoing what is a sort of in the momentum continuing to gain hold, which is that efforts to what some people describe as a peace or some people describe as contain I mean, there's a lot of different adjectives you can use. Iran simply have not worked, and what has happened since October seventh, but even earlier is proved positive of that. But the problem is there is very little agreement on where to go forward and how to go forward. I mean, shared Brown's view on what the Banking Committee alone should do on Iran is fascinating and shows this divide. So there's a necessary conversation, and you were just having a really key part of it with somebody with very strong views on this. Yeah, what do you think, Rick, what should the next move be for the Biden administration? The generals on Capitol Hill to sound the alarm today? Do they need to move past the idea of finding evidence that links Iran. I mean, the general's talking about shutting this down, even going after their families. Yeah, I think it's parsing that's actually just going to make them look weak in the eyes of the American public. You know. Look, I mean, Ran has been a horrible influence in the region around the world for as long as the Iatola has been running it, and we've allowed that to sustain itself. We're afraid of the development of their nuclear weapons. We don't want to get in a scrape with them in the Middle East, and yet they dictate all the terms that occur there. I mean, the reason that this is all happening is because through US efforts to normalize relations between Saudi Arabia and Israel, they put a kebash to it, and and so like, who's not surprised by all this? And and this naivete within the Biden administration that they can somehow do business with Iran but let them be a pure and interest in the region is absolutely insane. They've got to rationalize this to us in their relationship with Iran in a way that is absolutely clear to the American public, which is Iran's the enemy. They've always been the enemy. They're always going to be the enemy. They don't have the same views around the world, values that we all hold dear on human life. And just look at what they've been able to accomplish in the region, you know, supporting Hamas, supporting Husbala, supporting Syrian Islamis. I mean, it's it's there's nothing positive about their conduct whatsoever. So let's quit saying, oh, well, there's no direct evidence that they pulled the triggers. It's a little bit late for that. We'll have a lot more with our panel, Rick Davis and Genie Shanzano. We haven't even gotten to the matter of the speaker race. The new Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson making waves already today in Washington and meeting with Biden administration officials about avoiding a shutdown. We're going to get to that next with Rick and Jeannie on the Fastest Show in Politics. I'm Joe, Matthew and Washington. Thanks for being with us on the radio, on the satellite, and on YouTube. Search Bloomberg Global News to find us. This is Bloomberg. You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, Just Say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty Live from Washington with breaking news on the new Speaker of the House. It's the first full day on the job for Speaker Johnson. Meeting with Biden administration's administration officials. Easy for me to say on the big funding request we were just talking about with the general here, bipartisan briefing with congressional leadership. This is the first time the Speaker is interfacing with the Biden administration as the man who holds the gavel. And it's coming less than twenty four hours after the big celebration on the steps of the House after he made the grade. He was joined by all the members of the Republican Conference and it was a LoveFest. We're going to act consistently. We're going to exhibit two things here, trust and teamwork, and this group will deliver for the American people. I said it in the Chamber and I will say it here. We're going to govern well, We're going to govern well endorsed by everyone else who wanted to get the job, including Steve Scalise. You know, if you think about what's happened these last three weeks, while a lot of people outside of Washington and talk about dysfunction, this great group of men and women behind me have been talking about how to fix what's broken in Washington, and so this was really good for everybody. Ask Tom Emmer, this is like the best time he ever had. I guess remember you had the nomination for I think four hours. From an outside point of view, these last few weeks probably looked like total chaos, confusion. Oh, I don't no end in sight. But from my perspective, this is one of the greatest experiences in recent history, in the recent history of our republic. We couldn't have planned it better. Let's reassemble the panel. Rick Davis and Genie Shanzey no Bloomberg Politics contributors. Haven't heard from either of you yet. Can't wait, Rick, what do you think of our new Speaker of the House? Well, I'm holding my breath. Is he a member of the Vote No Hope, Yes Caucus? He voted against Ukraine funding when all three of those people McCarthy, Emmer and Scleeves voted yes. What kind of leadership is he going to give if he's opposing those kinds of things? I don't know. I'm very nervous that we've got a deadlock house of representatives. It's only going to make bad look worse. Wow. Joe Biden was asked about him yesterday, Genie. He was in the Rose Garden with the Prime Minister of Australia. The question pretty obvious for this president, knowing that this is not only an election denier, but someone who actually wrote the amicus brief in the Texas case to bring this to the Supreme Court. Here's how it went to the White House. If you win reelection in twenty twenty four, are you worried that a Speaker Johnson would again attempt to overturn the election? No? Why not? Because he can't? Look just like I was not worried that the last time I'd be able to overturn the election. They have not sixty lawsuits and all the way to the the Supreme Court, and every time they lost. I understand the constitution. Do you share his Confidenie? Well, I applaud Joe Biden, Unlike Mike Johnson for answering the question, because of course, yesterday when Mike Johnson was asked the question he was it was Virginia Fox. I think who said shut up, shut up to the report. So you know, he's a constitutional lawyer described as a constitutional scholar, but he does not want to get up there and answer questions. So thank you to the President for answering. The President seems confident. I'm gonna go with Rick and say I'm holding my breath on this aspect of it, you know, Mike Johnson, and I'm so glad you raised that amicus cure I brief. It's one of the most confounding things that he would write the brief to help the disgraced Ken Paxton try to say that Texas can overturn the votes of four other states, something that even the hardliners on the Supreme Court found so baffling constitutionally that they didn't even take the case. And that is Mike Johnson. We don't know how he's going to behave and as speaker, he may turn out to be a great speaker. We simply don't know. But the reality is we know what he's done before, and that is lead the effort to vote to overturn the twenty election, defend Donald Trump, and also support Ken Paxton in the ridiculousness of Texas overturning other states votes for the presidency. Rick, we only have a couple of minutes before our sit down conversation with the Treasury Secretary. How concerned are you that every member of the Republican Conference voted for an election? Denier? Yeah, look, I think it's a it's a bad form. I'm shocked that Emmer didn't press the point of actually having a floor vote for his own Speakership candidacy. Frankly, I suspect a bunch of Democrats would have voted for him, because in retrospect you look at that and say, gee, we could have had Emmer. Democrats are going to really pay a price for for not having the opportunity to put a reasonable Republican in the seat who actually believed the elections weren't flawed. So this has been a horrible three week period for the Republican Party. I think the onus is going to be on Speaker Johnson to try and write that ship. Nothing in his background indicates that he has the ability to do that. So this is a real test by Fire. You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, the iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business App, or listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts. Then there's the former president, who, in these wild times we've really only been talking about through the guise of the speaker race. But this is Donald Trump, who's been in court every day lately to talk about the value of his company or face off with Michael Cohen or whatever might be happening. Ye did you see he took the stand yesterday? I did. This is incredible. Now we keep seeing him in the lobby and people are asking questions about yesterday, violating the gag order in this case New York curious where with respect to what very no any other questions, any other questions. They're trying to figure out who was he talking about? Who was he disparaging because he goes in there and he just you know, he lobs, spitballs at everybody and talks negatively about the judge, about the prosecutor in this case, though the judge issued a ten thousand dollars fine for what is Donald Trump's second violation of a gag order in the civil fraud trial against him New York State and called him to the stand, asking him to talk about what he meant with these remarks. Immediately told him he was not credible. Sit down. Here's a ten thousand dollars fine. Yeah, and as you said, this is the second fine, because last week he was fined five thousand dollars for violating disorder. This is incredible. We kind of knew Joe right that this is the former president we are talking about. We know how open he usually is with his commentary. And when all of these either restricted gag orders or you know, different judges doing different things, it was a question, how are you actually going to enforce that? And I guess we're seeing it enforced in this case. But there's many others to consider as well. Well. There are a lot of others. And that's why I can't believe we have Dave Ehrenberg in Washington and at the table with us. You've heard him, you've seen him on zoom and the Palm Beach County State Attorney is with us in person. What a treat. It's great to see you. Welcome to the Capitol. It is great to be with you. Both guys are too good looking to be on radio. Well that's why they're on YouTube now too. My god, Yes, we're doing everything with you today. It's great and thanks for coming. My gosh, your thoughts on the gag order? Here? Will this be kind of a weekly Obviously ten thousand dollars is not a matter for Donald Trump, but to be kind of spanked publicly by the judge like that is remarkable. He got up and left. He walked out before the session was over. I think he gets under Trump's skin like this case, whether it's a gag order from a judge he does not like, or for the valuation of mar Lago at between eighteen and twenty eight million, which is really way below market value. It cuts him to the core to have to see what's going on there. Even though this is not a criminal case. He will not be sent to jail for this case, but this one is personal for him and as far as what the future punishments will be for him if he continues to violate the gag order, I think the judge will continue to find him increasing amounts of money. It's ten thousand dollars this time, maybe the next time he will be fifty and then on. But I do not expect this judge to sentence him to jail for contempt because after all, it's a civil case, not a criminal one. Well, and it is a civil case, so are we just going to see him stop showing up. He's not mandated to be there in the room, right correct, Unlike a criminal case, he does not have to be there for this civil trial. But he has his own reasons. He wanted to glower and Michael Cohen. He really hates his former lawyer. He wants the optics of looking like he's the aggrieved individual here. He wants people and his party to believe that somehow he's entitled to a jury trial and the court wouldn't give it to him, when it's really his own lawyer, Alena Haba, who forgot to check the right box. So he only has his own lawyers to blame. But nothing fuels Maga like grievance and martyrdom. That's why he's showing up and just having a blast talking to cameras every day. But to be called to the stand like that, it was like, you know, the troubled student called at the front of the class to be scolded. How often are we going to see that type of thing. The idea of Donald Trump ending up on the stand might suggest it's not always wise to show up when you don't have that's right. You know, he can end up in a perjury trap himself, and so it's not always a great idea. But look, lawyers can't control their own defendants, especially defendants their clients like Donald Trump. Donald Trump wants to be there, he will be there, and he has other motivations. It's about the optics. He's the leading candidate for president, and he wants people to believe that I am aggrieved. I could be in Iowa right now, but I have to be here, when in reality he was missing a golf match by being in court. Excellent, But it's all about show. Yeah, well, we definitely know that for sure that the former president does have a reputation for being quite a showman every day. This is how he operates. And as we were just alluding to, this is just one case that he is facing, and it's a civil case. He's facing a multitude of criminal cases as well. And the one I think that has been the most interesting over the course of the last several weeks is Georgia the racketeering case. There's now been what four plea deals, some high profile including Jenna Ellis, Mark Sidney Powell, Mark Meadows, Scott Hall. Do you think this is just dominoes that are going to fall one by one? How do you think this is going to play out? I think there'll be more defendants copying the plea. They're going to get FOMO. These other defendants, I fear a missing out. And there's what fourteen others here that we are considering. Look at this. If you're on YouTube, you can see all the mugshots that got them in two different columns. Now, yeah, see, I'm guilty, all not guilty. All those folks in the right, they all have FOMO. They are worrying that the longer they weigh, the worst the deal will get. Right now, the folks on the left, if you're on YouTube, you can see the four of them, they got plea deals with no jail time. They were facing years in prison. But first one in is the first to win. That's something defense law is like to say. If you get in first the prosecutor's door, you get the best deal. But that door is closing soon and I anticipate that future plea deals. Maybe not yet, but pretty soon they'll start including incarceration. Wow, what do you make of the Meadows deal? Specifically, as compelled as I am to talk about Sidney Powell at any turn, the idea here, and we've heard a lot of people suggest this, including Chris Christy yesterday, of course, a former prosecutor. You don't just cut a deal with the chief of staff who was clearly involved in this and may well deserve to be punished for his role that he played unless he's really got some important Was that the deal that closes the walls in on Donald Trump? Well, we don't know. Joe Weather Mark Meadows cut a deal with prosecutors other than receiving immunity to test why before the grand jury. So apparently he spoke to Jacksmith's team three separate times this year and test why before the grand jury. You cannot force someone to self incriminate unless you give them immunity at the grand jury. That's what happens. So they call him before the grand jury, they say we're going to give you immunity, and then he testifies truthfully. But as far as weather he entered into a non prosecution deal where I will be a cooperating witness in return for your not prosecuting me. That's not clear. It's be up to ultimately Jack Smith and Mark Meadows whether it goes that far. But right now I'm just thinking he just tests by before the grand jury got immunity for his testimony, and I can't extrapolate beyond that. That's really something we should clarify. That is the January sixth case here in Washington, And I'm actually curious the Sydney and the others you mentioned in Georgia, Kayley, are they also talking to Jack Smith at the same time. There's no indication that Sidney Powell is talking to Jack Smith, but it looks like Mark Meadows people wanted us to know that he was talking to the grand jury to Jack Smith for whatever reason. Now what's interesting is how does Fannie Willis take this. Fannie Wills has got to be concerned that she really should not try to use the information that Mark Meadows gave to Jack Smith under immunity against him in the state case, because then there are some complex issues of whether state proscuers can feed off of the information where he was grand immunity. There was an Oliver North case, you remember that guy. He was ultimately cleared or at least found the case was thrown out against him because of those types of issues. So proscuers are very careful. So I think what's going to happen is she's going to continue to go after Mark Meadows, who is an indicted individual in Fulton County, based on the evidence she accumulates, not on the evidence that Jack Smith gives her. But overall Marcmetto's aside with the other plea deals that have now been entered, her job is getting easier, not harder, generally, right, It is definitely getting easier when you have a number of your co defendants flip because nineteen co defendants, that's very difficult, and in a reco case that takes months to try. What was going to happen is you had two people, cheesebro and Sidney Powell, who requested speedy trial. They were going to be tried first. They were going to give Donald Trump a dress rehearsal. They were going to expose the state's arguments. It was to Donald Trump's benefit. But now they're out of the way. So not only does Donald Trump not get to see an advanced copy of the prosecution. He also could be tried before the election. Had the others been tried first, it would have pushed his case beyond the election. But now there's no one to wait for. That's incredible and something that we have to remember with, you know, as we juggled for indictments. With all of that said, you consider his life over the next year as he's running for president. Made the point, Hey, I wish I could be in Iowa, but I'm here in court on some days. That might actually be true. And his campaign will need him to be in certain places. How much flexibility will he have to actually run for president while he's managing all these That's a really good question because we don't know the schedule yet. I do believe the case that will happen before the election is the case in DC that we've been discussing Judge Chuck, and she's not fooling around, and that case from Jack Smith is built for speed. There are no other co defendants. There are unindicted ones, but not indicted ones. There are only four counts against Trump. Because Jack Smith wants that to happen before the election, and I think it will so can he campaign fully while being put on trial? I don't know, but I don't think. I'm not certain that the other cases will happen before the election. I think because of the plea deals now, it's a better chance the Fulton County one happens before the election. But I think the strongest case against Trump is the one in my neck of the woods good Documents case. They got them dead to rights there. But you got Judge Cannon, who's not quite Judge Chuckan. She's new, and she is slow walking this thing. And I think that case is going to get pushed beyond the election. And if we're saying then beyond the election, he very well could be president at that time, right, So how would that? Does that mean that this case just never gets tried? To feel like that's where we get into really murky waters? Are you now having a sitting president of the United States on trial? Oh? I don't think it's a murky firm at all. I think that's his only defense, that he has no defense to the document's case they got him. His only defense is become president and then order his Department of Justice to drop the case. That's what he'll do, and the case goes bye bye. The Trigckier one is what happens if he's convicted in Atlanta or in New York, which also could happen for the election itself. In the state case, he can't pardon himself. You know what will happen? So if becomes president and he's convicted or they keep trying to prosecute him, he'll say, Okay, New York, Okay, Georgia, I'm surrounded by my secret service here in the Oval Office. Come and get me. Yeah, who will be a constution crisis to say that the reality continues? Is it wrong? I'm admiring the lapel pin, the badge. I don't know if people can see that, probably not on YouTube. Is it wrong that I want one of those? Does that make me a herschel walker? Is that? Is that like a state attorney's How do you get that? You can't get this in a costume store. You've got to get elected state attorney at one of these days. That's so cool. Now here's the here's the insider tip there. We exchange them with each other. So this is actually someone else's tell me it's funny, Willis's. This is Tim Cruz from Massachusetts looking at it. Hey, my friend, no kidding, Republican to Massachusetts. I love that. Dave Ehrenberg, what a treat to have you in Washington. Get home safe, good luck here in the Capitol. I'm Joe Matthew with Kayley Lines. This is Bloomberg. You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, Tune in alf Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. As we head for Bloomberg BusinessWeek, we want to bring you an important conversation with Paul Beckett. You might have heard him a couple of months ago. Join us on Bloomberg as the bureau chief of the Wall Street Journal here in Washington, DC, and Kayley. As I said earlier, it's not too often that you see Bloomberg and the WSJ making news together here. But it's important because he's not actually the bureau chief, at least not at the moment in Washington. He's become assistant editor of the journal dedicated the efforts to secure Evan Gershkovic's release. And it's Evan's birthday, ye thirty two years old, his two hundred and eleventh day of incarceration, as I read on the Wall Street Journal. And it's always an honor to bring Paul back on the air. It's good to see you, and thanks for coming across town to say hello to us. If you're with us on YouTube, see Paul's pin that says free Evan that I suspect you're wearing everywhere right now. And I just wonder if you could give us an update on his situation, what you're hearing from him when the last time he spoke, thank you so much. He is in decent shape, but in decent shape in a Russian prison where he's been for two hundred and eleven days. As you mentioned, he spends a great deal of that time in isolation. He's given one hour in the prison yard each day. He's working very hard to keep himself in shape, both mentally and physically. But we really just see this stretching on far too long, and we hope everything can be done to bring him home. Yeah, what's his degree of optimism and your degree of optimism? That his incarceration there is going to end anytime soon. This will end with the negotiation between the US government and the Russian government, So we would just like to see more action taken. At the moment, his pre trial attention will last until November thirtieth. They have twelve months to keep extending that detention, so that would put it into the spring of next year. But it's so opate. We don't even really know when you'll go to trial and what happens after that, so it's very murky, and that's the dispariting part. So is this a diplomatic solution, a prisoner swap, or is it actually infect a legal resolution that you're hoping for. One of the ways it will happen, and probably the most likely, given what's happened in the past, is through a prisoner swap. He has been accused of very serious espionized charges, which we of course will say to the end of the earth are completely false, but he will probably go into the Russian statement. So far, I have to go through that trial before the meaningful negotiations can take place. We hope to circuit that process, but in the mists ahead, that's about all we can see so you suggested you would like to see the US doing more here to push this What kind of conversations are you having with the Biden administration with those in government who may be able to help push this case. How committed do they seem to Evans? Cause? President Biden met with Evans family at the Whites correspond Association dinner and made a promise there to bring Evan home. So that's something that they have been relying on that we have been relying on for action. We can't see everything obviously that the government is doing. The public statements have been encouraging that this is a top priority, but we just want to make sure that it remains there. Boy, can you describe the conditions that he's in there? We spoke last time about the facility that he was staying and is he still there? Is he around other people or is he isolated? He's in the the forte of a prison Maxicmum Security Security Services prison in Moscow. We think he's in okay shape. We have lawyers that go in to see him once a week. He's had a few visits from the US ambassador to Moscow. So from what we can tell, it is he's reading he's meditating, he's exercising when he can, but it's a lot of work in the circumstances are awful. I'm sure is there anything that the journal is doing as well? For those journalists who are not currently incarcerated in Russia but still have to do the kind of work that Evan was doing and that he is now being essentially punished for. What do you do to make sure that others don't end up in the position he is currently in. Well, we are actually trying to be helpful in a position of another reporter who is in a similar circumstance. Alsu Kumasheva from Free Europe Radio Liberty was detained in Russia recently. So the extent that we can our experience can be helpful to them, then of course I'm more than happy to engage on that. I think overall, what you're seeing is a real stifling of what little free press or independent press there was in Russia. So so many reporters now have to cover Russia from outside, from Warsaw, from Berlin, from Dubai, from wherever they can, and it's just not the same. We're spending time with Paul Beckett from the Wall Street journal who is working to secure Evan Gershkovich's release as people consider what he's going through right now, and more broadly, what journalists are facing on a daily basis. Here we've got journalists in very dangerous places and it could get a lot more dangerous, for instance, in the Middle East. Does it change policies at the journal and the way that you look at deploying reporters around the world. We've always, as I'm shore Bloomberg, has put the safety of our reporters first absolutely. In spite of having very strict protocols, bad things will happen, and to some degree is the nature of the business. You do see a increase in violence towards harassment of and targeting of journalists around the world. We've seen it recently in the Middle East with sim Abdallah, the writers Yes reporter in Lebanon who is monitoring a live feed and he was killed and several other reporters were injured when that location was hit by a missile. So it is very dangerous days for reporters out there, and I think sometimes press can be an easy punching bag. I think it's a moment to reflect on how many people do extraordinary things to bring us. A news producer, Matt reminds us Kayley thirty four journalists killed in a line of duty this year. So far this calendar year, five hundred and ten journalists are detained as we speak, and Evan, of course, is one of them. Obviously, I know communication reaching him in a communicative way is probably immensely difficult. But if you had one message for him on what is again his thirty second birthday, could you share that for us. We're doing everything we can to make sure he doesn't spend his thirty third birthday in jail. How often, if at all, does the journal does his employer get to speak with him or is it through his lawyers on that weekly basis that you referenced, that's the chief point of contact. We have letters going in now. His family write some letters, his colleagues write him letters, and in those letters they try and fill him in on what he's missing the world. I think that's the messages that he wants to hear. He is a huge arsenal FC fan. He wants to hear they're doing. His sister sends him celebrity gossip to keep him up to speed. Anything that will boy, his spirits during such difficult time and his strength there is an inspiration to all of us doing well. I want you to know how much we respect the role that you've taken on there. You were the Washington Bureau chief, which is a very proud position, and the fact that you're doing this full time to secure his release is honorable and we thank you for what you're doing. There's not a lot that we can do here, I think, Kaylee. Other thing keep talking about this and keep reporting on it, and Paul, that's the pledge that we'll make to you, So stay in touch with us. Greatly appreciate, great, Thank you by so much. Thank you for the all Beckett from the Wall Street Journal with us here on an important conversation on the thirty second birthday of Evan Gershkovich, Joe Matthew and Washington along with Kaylee Lines. Thank you so much for spending time with us on the radio, on the satellite, and on YouTube. We certainly learn a lot today, as always, Kaylee, and we'll be back with one more of these. Tell me it's real. Tomorrow is Friday home stretch check on a working weekend. Right, We've got a speaker. We got some things worked well, don't Chinxit now? Fuh fair enough with Kaylee, I'm joke. Thanks for listening to the sound on podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, and anywhere else you get your podcasts, and you can find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at one pm Eastern Time at Bloomberg dot com
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