Outrage + Optimism: The Climate Podcast Inside COP: The New World Order - power, politics and the green pie
Oct 16, 2025
Christiana Figueres, former UNFCCC Executive Secretary, shares insights on the complexities of geopolitics at COP30, emphasizing the need for collaboration among rising powers like Brazil and the BRICS. Bernice Lee from Chatham House discusses the evolving landscape of multipolar geopolitics and resource security, highlighting the competition for the 'green pie.' The conversation covers the implications of US withdrawal, the crucial role of minerals in shaping alliances, and how China's investments could create a more robust climate action framework.
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Climate Politics Is Becoming Competitive
- The climate agenda is shifting from cooperation to competition as countries race to capture economic benefits.
- Competition can accelerate solutions if politics aligns with clear economic incentives.
Diplomacy Can Isolate Climate From Rivalry
- Geopolitical rivalries can be ring-fenced for climate, as U.S. and China collaborated before Paris.
- Brazil must balance pro-renewable leadership with oil interests and regional diplomacy.
Momentum Exists Beyond Major Powers
- Despite global headwinds, many countries show implementation momentum on renewables and emissions.
- COP30 must demonstrate that this momentum translates into tangible delivery.