Martin Köppelmann, co-founder of Gnosis, has proposed that Ethereum should have native rollups—a vision aimed at addressing scalability and decentralization.

Köppelmann critiques the current state of layer 2 solutions, highlighting their limitations in fully inheriting Ethereum’s security and composability.

He proposes a bold alternative: 128 Ethereum-native rollups designed to expand block space, strengthen alignment with Ethereum’s core principles, and ensure long-term viability for developers and users.

Plus, Martin tackles the controversies: Are L2s parasitic? Could native rollups spell the end for existing solutions? And why should they rely on zero-knowledge proofs instead of Optimism?

Show highlights:

Whether the Ethereum scaling roadmap is accomplishing its goals
Why based rollups are not a full solution, according to Martin
What Martin proposes instead
Why Martin is proposing these rollups to be ZK-rollups instead of optimistic
Whether the proposed solution would focus on privacy
What it is about chain abstraction that Martin doesn’t like
How he envisions that these native rollups will solve many composability issues across L2s
Whether the community has embraced this proposal and how likely it is to be implemented
What would happen to current L2s if native rollups get implemented
Why despite being against the current state of L2s, Martin says that they are not parasitic to Ethereum

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Guest:

Martin Köppelmann, Co-founder and CEO of Gnosis

Links

Previous coverage of Unchained on Ethereum layer 2s:
ETH Is Down Bad, While Layer 2s Are Ripping. Are L2s Parasitic to Ethereum?
Are L2s ‘Parasitic’? Analysis Shows Ethereum Only Gets a Tiny Percentage of Fees
Are Solana’s ‘Network Extensions’ Just Like Ethereum’s Layer 2s But by a Different Name?
Ethereum Has Had a Banner Year in Most Areas. Except Price.
Should Ethereum Layer 2s Urgently Decentralize Their Sequencers?
Blockworks: Gnosis founder argues Ethereum needs native L2s
Martin’s tweet on USDC yields

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro
01:47 Is Ethereum’s scaling roadmap meeting its goals?
04:07 Why Martin believes based rollups aren’t the full solution
08:11 Martin’s bold proposal for native rollups
12:07 Why ZK-rollups over optimistic rollups
15:56 Whether these rollups should also preserve privacy
17:11 Martin’s issue with chain abstraction
22:35 How native rollups could solve L2 composability problems
26:49 Has the community embraced Martin’s vision?
30:52 What happens to existing L2s if native rollups win
36:06 Whether Martin thinks L2s are parasitic to Ethereum

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