We started talking about Michelle's commitment to avoid scrolling on vacation. She did. It sounds like it was both no big deal and something worth building on.

We had intended to keep the recording to under thirty minutes for scheduling reasons, but the conversation kept staying too interesting to stop. We talked about addiction, how big a difference small differences can make, the difference between Portland and Vancouver in culture, how to change culture, living off the grid, and what stays with you when transitioning back.

Coincidentally, a story of hers appeared in this week's New Yorker: When Summer Becomes the Season of Danger and Dread
Michelle's book: Beloved Beasts

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629: Michelle Nijhuis, part 2: Stopping doom scrolling