Ep. 2593 Scott Horton: Truth Is Now "Russian Disinformation"
Jan 16, 2025
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Scott Horton, a journalist and author known for his expertise on U.S. foreign policy, dives into the complexities surrounding the Ukraine conflict. He critiques the portrayal of dissenting views as 'Russian disinformation' and discusses the historical context of NATO's involvement. Horton highlights the West's role in Ukraine's political upheaval while questioning the motivations behind American foreign policy. Their conversation also touches on the intricate dynamics of regime change and the challenges facing Ukraine today amidst geopolitical turmoil.
Scott Horton highlights how Washington elites prioritize strategic interests over genuine democratic concerns in U.S. foreign policy, particularly towards Russia.
The podcast recounts a respectful exchange between Scott Horton and General Wesley Clark, showcasing the evolution of political discourse in military interventions.
Horton argues for nuanced discussions regarding the 2014 Ukraine coup, emphasizing its significant role in escalating U.S.-Russia tensions and NATO expansion.
Deep dives
The Influence of Elites on Foreign Policy
The discussion highlights how certain elites in Washington have shaped U.S. foreign policy, particularly in relation to Russia and the events surrounding Ukraine. The conversation emphasizes that decisions made by policymakers often prioritize strategic interests rather than genuine concern for democracy or humanitarian issues. An example mentioned is the perceived drive among some neoconservatives for military interventions in various countries, framed as necessary for U.S. security and interests. This influence not only complicates international relations but also propagates a narrative that conflicts are driven by external aggressions rather than domestic interests.
Scott Horton and General Wesley Clark
The podcast recounts the memorable exchange between Scott Horton and General Wesley Clark, focusing on the nature of their conversation. Horton emphasizes that although Clark held a prominent military position and had significant influence over NATO operations, their dialogue was surprisingly cordial and respectful. Horton critiques Clark’s historical decisions regarding NATO expansion and military interventions while using Clark’s own acknowledgment of past errors to bolster his arguments. This dynamic showcased just how political discourse can evolve and impact future policy discussions.
Analysis of the 2014 Ukraine Coup
A significant focal point of the conversation is the 2014 coup in Ukraine and the subsequent impact on U.S.-Russia relations. Horton explains that financial and logistical support from the U.S. to pro-Western movements played a crucial role in the regime change. He draws parallels to historical interventions, suggesting that the U.S. employed similar tactics in past geopolitical conflicts to influence outcomes that align with American interests. The implications of this coup have led to a continual state of tension, with Russia viewing such moves as direct threats to its influence in the region.
The Narrative of Russian Aggression
The dialogue also addresses the portrayal of Russia as the aggressor in the ongoing conflict, challenging this prevailing narrative by pointing to the complex causes of the tensions. Horton notes that the U.S. expansion of NATO and support for Ukraine post-coup created a hostile environment that Russia perceives as a direct threat. Amid this framing, Horton argues for more nuanced discussions about the historical context and the warnings provided by former officials against NATO expansions. He underscores that understanding these dynamics is crucial in analyzing the present conflict without oversimplifying the motivations of either side.
The Future of U.S.-Russia Relations
The final segment focuses on the potential for a change in U.S.-Russia relations, especially with a new administration or leadership aiming for diplomatic engagement. Horton expresses hope that newly elected leaders can navigate the complexities of international relations and work towards reducing tensions with Russia. He argues that prioritizing peaceful negotiations over military confrontations could yield positive outcomes for both nations. The conversation ends with an emphasis on strategic dialogue, recognizing the need for both understanding and compromises in future diplomatic efforts.
It's been difficult to have an adult conversation on Ukraine and Russia, because anything other than the CIA line is treated as "Russian disinformation." Scott Horton joins us.