Welcome to episode 54 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.

This week, we bring you a very special joint episode of The Way Out Is In and fellow podcast Outrage + Optimism, which explores the stories behind climate change headlines. From the peace and tranquility of the International Plum Village Community of Engaged Buddhism, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach and journalist Jo Confino speak with Christiana Figueres and Tom Rivett-Carnac.

Christiana Figueres, a student of Thich Nhat Hanh, was one of the architects of the Paris Climate Agreement in 2015, and is a valued member of the Plum Village Sangha. Executive Secretary of the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) from 2010 to 2016, she is also the co-founder of Global Optimism, co-host of Outrage + Optimism, and co-author of the bestselling The Future We Choose: Surviving the Climate Crisis.

Tom Rivett-Carnac is a political strategist, author, and podcaster who has spent more than 20 years working to address the climate and ecological crises. He is also a Founding Partner of Global Optimism, co-host of the podcast Outrage + Optimism, and co-author of The Future We Choose.

Listeners of both podcasts are invited to join an intimate and deep conversation which covers the spiritual elements missing from the climate movement; moving beyond linear timelines into exponential transformation; how to develop the power within ourselves to drive change; non-attachment to views; listening without judgment; what happens when we all stop; and much more. Plus, what is spiritual power and how can it support us?

So bring your tea to the table and let the radical collaboration begin.

Co-produced by the Plum Village App:
https://plumvillage.app/

And Global Optimism:
https://globaloptimism.com/

With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:
https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/

List of resources

Christiana Figueres
http://christianafigueres.com/#/

Tom Rivett-Carnac
https://www.globaloptimism.com/tom-rivett-carnac

The Art of Power
https://www.parallax.org/product/art-of-power/

Brother Phap Linh (Brother Spirit)
https://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/brother-phap-linh

The Four Dharma Seals of Plum Village
https://plumvillage.org/articles/the-four-dharma-seals-of-plum-village

The B Team
https://bteam.org/

The United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC)
https://unfccc.int/

Zen and the Art of Saving the Planet
https://www.harpercollins.com/products/zen-and-the-art-of-saving-the-planet-thich-nhat-hanh

Music for Difficult Times: Awakening the Heart of Compassion by Brother Phap Linh
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YarhXTDs8Z4

The Way Out Is In: ‘Being the Change We Want to See in the World: A Conversation with Christiana Figueres (Episode #21)’
https://plumvillage.org/podcast/being-the-change-we-want-to-see-in-the-world-a-conversation-with-christiana-figueres-episode-21

The Way Out Is In: ‘Benefitting from a Spiritual Practice: In Conversation with Tom Rivett-Carnac (Episode #37)’
https://plumvillage.org/podcast/benefitting-from-a-spiritual-practice-in-conversation-with-tom-rivett-carnac-episode-37

The Way Out Is In: ‘Bringing the Ultimate Dimension Down to Earth (Episode #40)’
https://plumvillage.org/podcast/bringing-the-ultimate-dimension-down-to-earth-episode-40

Aeschylus
https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Aeschylus

Quotes

“Recognizing our own presence is already a power.”

“The linearity of time is something that those of us who work on climate change live with on a daily basis. We have an alarm clock that is with us all the time because we have very clear timelines. We know that by 2100, we absolutely must have guaranteed that we do not go over 1.5 degrees [Celsius]. We know that in order to get there, we have to be at net zero by 2050. We know that in order to get to net zero by 2050, we have to be at one half of global emissions by 2030. And we know that to be at half emissions by 2030, we have to reduce yearly by 7%. So we take time and we pull it into our current experience and we derive mathematically, we derive then the implications of time upon our work. And so it is not surprising that those of us who work on climate change have a huge anxiety about time.”

“Time and space, we have to be attentive and mindful of them, but we can also be free from them, because this present moment that we’re living deeply is the seed that we need to plant for the future.”

“Some of our transformation and actions of today, we may not see them until two, three, or five generations later – but nothing is lost. And that is the insight. And I believe it’s the truth of karma. The word karma, for us, is not what you hear in music: ‘What comes around, goes around,’ ‘Do better’… Yes, do better, but karma is much more profound than that. The actions of today, we don’t see them. Some of it, we will experience right away; we experience the transformation right away. But there are deeper transformations that need time for ripening.”

“Love has no frontier, it goes on forever.”

“There’s no way to find common ground without respecting and understanding the differences, because then you don’t see what’s common.”

“You can be a different person in how you show up.”

“When you are able to live in the present moment, the right action emerges out of that space, out of that ultimate dimension that you are able to inhabit. If you can stay there and can trust that the best way to prepare for the future is to be in the present moment when it comes – rather than spend all of your time in your head trying to plan it out and think it through, which I think a lot of people get stuck in. Then, when that moment comes, what’s needed is there.”

“Even in our sleep, pain which cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart until, in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom through the awful grace of God” – Aeschylus.

The Epiphany of Allegiance