Episode 136: My Fourth Time, We Drowned with Sally Hayden

This episode of Across The Margin: The Podcast features an interview with award-winning journalist and photographer currently focused on migration, conflict, and humanitarian crises, Sally Hayden. Hayden has worked with VICE News, CNN International, TIME, BBC, the Washington Post, the Guardian, the New York Times, Al Jazeera, NBC News, Newsweek, the Independent, the Telegraph, the National, the Huffington Post and ITV News, and had stories and photojournalism republished on six continents by outlets including National Geographic, NPR, the Observer, ABC News, among many others. She was named as one of Forbes' "30 Under 30” in Media in Europe, in part because of her work on refugee issues. Her book My Fourth Time We Drowned: Seeking Refuge on the World’s Deadliest Migration Route — the focus of this episode — exposes a human rights disaster of epic proportions. One day, Sally Hayden was at home in London when she received a message on Facebook that read: “Hi sister Sally, we need your help.” The sender identified himself as an Eritrean refugee who had been held in a Libyan detention center for months, locked in one big hall with hundreds of others. The city around them was crumbling in a conflict between warring factions, and they remained stuck, defenseless, with only one remaining hope — contacting her. From this single message begins a staggering account of the migrant crisis across North Africa. With unprecedented access to people currently inside Libyan detention centers, Hayden’s book is based on interviews with hundreds of refugees and migrants who tried to reach Europe and found themselves stuck in Libya once the EU started funding interceptions in 2017. My Fourth Time, We Drowned is an intimate portrait of life for these detainees, as well as a condemnation of NGOs and the United Nations, whose abdication of international standards will echo throughout history. But most importantly, Hayden’s groundbreaking work of investigative journalism shines a light on the resilience of humans — how refugees and migrants locked up for years fall in love, support each other through the hardest times, and carry out small acts of resistance in order to survive in a system that wants them to be silent and disappear. In this episode host Michael Shields and Sally Hayden discuss the compelling story of how a cryptic Facebook message led to the revelation of atrocities taking place in detention camps in Northern Africa. They discuss the true scope of the migrant crisis taking place while expounding upon how the European Union (EU) and the United Nations (UN) are largely responsible for the ongoing emergency. They discuss the importance of documenting and paying attention to the suffering in the world, and much more.

Grab a copy of Sally Hayden’s My Fourth Time, We Drowned here!

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